These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

[Rubicon] Warp Speed and Acceleration

First post First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Pant MercenaryS
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#201 - 2013-10-05 08:54:02 UTC
Starrakatt wrote:
Pant MercenaryS wrote:

I am not saying the warp speed changes are a bad idea, but if this is to be implemented without completely rendering null sec mining useless you have to do some adjustments to mining.

Or use tactics to prevent such a demise, and create an offgrid BM to warp to, then bounce to the very close by mining op.


22+ second warp at 150km plus align time so you're still looking at well over a minute, plenty of time for a ceptor to fly through the scouted system next door and land in your grav.

A ceptor could fly through several gravs in the minute+ time he have. The risk will have increased many times of that it was before this patch, only T3s could blitz through the scouted and bubbled system next door before, but they warp a lot slower then the proposed new ceptor will and also they cost much more.

At the end of the day it is a risk reward thing. I don't see the reward increasing that much, since this hardly affect the mackinaw bots that don't use haulers, they simply warp to a mining site, align out, mine until they fill their 35k m3 cargo hold, warp to station to unload and rinse and repeat.

Also Orcas / Rorquals now have a dimminshed role as haulers, since they have to spend a lot more time in warp, they can't haul ore as fast as they could, the m3 moved per hour is alot less.

Can't really say this isn't a massive nerf to null sec miners that can be remedied by placing a BM 300km of the mining site.
Falkor1984
The Love Dragons
#202 - 2013-10-05 15:30:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Falkor1984
So unless the warp is longer than 50+ AU freighters will warp even slower, more than doubeling the time in some cases? Which percentage of Eve's systems has warps over 50+ AU? In my experience there aren't a whole lot of those systems. So in general it seems you are pestering freighters with this. Dont you think freighterering is horrible enough already? What have you been smoking?
Niko Lorenzio
United Eve Directorate
#203 - 2013-10-05 15:45:24 UTC
YES! YES! AND YES!

I think keeping the T1 Cruiser standard might be a bit low and maybe the standard should be set at T1 BC, but either way, thank you for this awesomeness.

The CSM XI Election are now open until March 25th, 2016. Consider Niko Lorenzio for CSM XI.

CSM matters, your voice matters, your vote matters!
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#204 - 2013-10-05 16:01:46 UTC
Falkor1984 wrote:
So unless the warp is longer than 50+ AU freighters will warp even slower, more than doubeling the time in some cases? Which percentage of Eve's systems has warps over 50+ AU? In my experience there aren't a whole lot of those systems. So in general it seems you are pestering freighters with this. Dont you think freighterering is horrible enough already? What have you been smoking?

Of course, you might also see Freighters allowed fittings when they get to the Cap ships in Tiericide, and can then choose to fit warp speed & agility rigs to your freighter making it much faster.
Udonor
Doomheim
#205 - 2013-10-05 16:34:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Udonor
Gankspeed boys!

no target escapes by warping when they see you pop up in local when you jump gate and start warp to where scout marked target.

Now can we get around to simply removing local as a source of intellignence through out EVE?

WH local should be the standard model for local everywhere.

Also CCP needs to think about comm jamming of lookout at gates and targets. Targeted comm jamming on single ship (CONCORD remains unaware of any hostile acts) and area of effect comm jamming (suggest only NPC ships in grid respond to any criminal flagging until jamming ceases & killing all NPC ships before end of jamming prevents flagging).
This would be much more realistic pirate activity. Flagging criminals should require LEO witnesses.
Falkor1984
The Love Dragons
#206 - 2013-10-05 16:40:05 UTC
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Falkor1984 wrote:
So unless the warp is longer than 50+ AU freighters will warp even slower, more than doubeling the time in some cases? Which percentage of Eve's systems has warps over 50+ AU? In my experience there aren't a whole lot of those systems. So in general it seems you are pestering freighters with this. Dont you think freighterering is horrible enough already? What have you been smoking?

Of course, you might also see Freighters allowed fittings when they get to the Cap ships in Tiericide, and can then choose to fit warp speed & agility rigs to your freighter making it much faster.

Yeah that would be nice indeed, but lets do that first before making the bricks fly even slowerCool
Udonor
Doomheim
#207 - 2013-10-05 16:49:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Udonor
Falkor1984 wrote:
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Falkor1984 wrote:
So unless the warp is longer than 50+ AU freighters will warp even slower, more than doubeling the time in some cases? Which percentage of Eve's systems has warps over 50+ AU? In my experience there aren't a whole lot of those systems. So in general it seems you are pestering freighters with this. Dont you think freighterering is horrible enough already? What have you been smoking?

Of course, you might also see Freighters allowed fittings when they get to the Cap ships in Tiericide, and can then choose to fit warp speed & agility rigs to your freighter making it much faster.

Yeah that would be nice indeed, but lets do that first before making the bricks fly even slowerCool


LOL - CCP will be killing web slingshoting to warp speed EXPLOIT first.

The idea will be to motivate you to buy a dozen PLEX for those super expensive freighter modules and to help give back profits to the player pirates that make EVE rock.

What? You didn't think CP was in this as a charity did you?

If they make the game better they deserve to be paid better. Especially by bots who chicken out of PVP.

Long live CODE...soon expanding into mission protection services (what someone shooting all the triggers and stealing mission object loots?) Helping CCP move people into low sec and null PVP for over 2 years.
Udonor
Doomheim
#208 - 2013-10-05 16:58:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Udonor
Falkor1984 wrote:
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Falkor1984 wrote:
So unless the warp is longer than 50+ AU freighters will warp even slower, more than doubeling the time in some cases? Which percentage of Eve's systems has warps over 50+ AU? In my experience there aren't a whole lot of those systems. So in general it seems you are pestering freighters with this. Dont you think freighterering is horrible enough already? What have you been smoking?

Of course, you might also see Freighters allowed fittings when they get to the Cap ships in Tiericide, and can then choose to fit warp speed & agility rigs to your freighter making it much faster.

Yeah that would be nice indeed, but lets do that first before making the bricks fly even slowerCool



There is an rumored alternative that CCP was considering & which you can vote for.

Fast freighters. Only twice as slow as industrial. Otherwise basically the same cost etc. as current freighters except a lot less EHP to be more agile and quick. 3 Volleys from BS or Tornado type Attack Battlecruiser ship can take one out. Personally this one has a lot of appeal to me.
Sizeof Void
Ninja Suicide Squadron
#209 - 2013-10-05 18:43:45 UTC
Falkor1984 wrote:
So unless the warp is longer than 50+ AU freighters will warp even slower, more than doubeling the time in some cases? Which percentage of Eve's systems has warps over 50+ AU? In my experience there aren't a whole lot of those systems. So in general it seems you are pestering freighters with this. Dont you think freighterering is horrible enough already? What have you been smoking?

Actually, making freighters slower should also make freight hauling more profitable. Fewer pilots are going to want to do their own long-distance hauling, and will be much more likely to just contract it out.

Which is what I do now. I can fly a freighter, yet I prefer to pay to contract it out, simply because I'm not into doing those long, slow runs. Even if freight rates triple after this warp speed change, I'll still consider it a bargain.
CW Itovuo
The Executioners
#210 - 2013-10-05 19:43:34 UTC
Kismeteer wrote:
Oh, and fix the recon cap usage on warps while you're at it.

4 warps for a single system in a recon is a joke.



Big +1



Definitely support changing warp speeds. This is a positive change to the game, and is long overdue. Interceptors can now reach their full potential.


I think CCP needs to move the speed slider a bit closer to the BC & BS side of things. Interceptors and small tackle should gain speed, but BS/BC shouldn't suffer for it.
Omnathious Deninard
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#211 - 2013-10-05 20:58:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Omnathious Deninard
Deleted

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.
Atreides 47
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#212 - 2013-10-05 23:27:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Atreides 47
~1 minute to warp 20 AU for BS, up from ~30 seconds ? Stop ruining this game, thats ridiculous BS.
BS must have 3 AU warp speed as now and there is no point to cut it.

Long Live the Fighters !

CCP and nerfs - http://i.imgur.com/MejTGfL.jpg
Cselle
Perkone
Caldari State
#213 - 2013-10-06 01:05:12 UTC
are blockade runners still going to be crazy fast?
Aglais
Ice-Storm
#214 - 2013-10-06 01:49:35 UTC
Atreides 47 wrote:
~1 minute to warp 20 AU for BS, up from ~30 seconds ? Stop ruining this game, thats ridiculous BS.
BS must have 3 AU warp speed as now and there is no point to cut it.



Just remember, the Marauders too are affected by this and are only marginally faster than T1 battleships. And their subwarp velocity got completely thrashed in the "rebalance" they suffered recently.

This is more or less a T3 stealth buff in terms of PvE, too.
Joe Risalo
State War Academy
Caldari State
#215 - 2013-10-06 01:56:52 UTC
I think the balance point should start at BCs.

I say this because all this effort that CCP made to balance BSs is going to be worthless once you factor slower warp and higher costs together.
Not to mention that so far, Marauders aren't suited for pvp at all in their planned design.
Hell, this is even going to hurt BS pve viability, expecially for marauders who just got a massive mass hit, and lowered mobility.
Noritama Furikake
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#216 - 2013-10-06 04:24:45 UTC
Please add "Align" to anything which we can warp to.
(Especially, anormaly, fleet member in same system, etc.)
We cannot take fleet warp without "Align" , so after Rubicon,
this warp speed modification affects too much for these location at fleet activity.
Vicar2008
MCMLXXVI
#217 - 2013-10-06 06:10:48 UTC
Tidi is going to be a blast now in Battleship fleets :D

Does this change the way Pods warp now also?
sabastyian
Worthless Carebears
The Initiative.
#218 - 2013-10-06 06:19:56 UTC
For the love of god, dont make battleships and battlecruisers even slower..... My bs collection already collects dust because they are slower then most ships, and normally in low-sec pvp you do "fleet, warp to this gate" and since we all have similar times, it isnt bad when running from a hostile gang, but now if our slow abaddon ( which takes like 11 seconds just to get into warp ) just had his warp speed doubled we will leave his ass to die. This is effectively killing any sub-cruiser pvp and pve. As a freighter pilot, i did around 150 jumps in 1 day and it took me like 9 hours ( i finished LOTR before i was done moving everything ) but now...you just doubled my time....so 18 hours....no..... Consider keeping warp speeds the same, but making the amount of time needed to hit max warp less for Interceptors and Interdictors. That would keep those ships in their role as "That freaking thing i better run from or ima die cause hes faster then me" but would also leave combat in a standard niche. Consider your average 0.0 10% tidi fight with bs, well your 30 second warp takes like 5 minutes, well now double that to 10 minutes while the hostile fleet only has a 7.5 minute warp time. Also Bs fleets are already a rarity in eve ( due to the maneuverability of Tier 3 bc gangs, and nano gangs ) they are about to become extint.
Falkor1984
The Love Dragons
#219 - 2013-10-06 08:05:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Falkor1984
Udonor wrote:
LOL - CCP will be killing web slingshoting to warp speed EXPLOIT first.

This is a stealth nerf to webbing: it is a lot less effective for shortening travel time with these crazy ideas. Webbing will still give extra security though. And why are you calling it an exploit? Its game mechanics 101.

Also BS fleets are crazy slow indeed already, longer warp times multiplied by tidi will quickly see them disappear unless used in combo with Titans.

Want more danger from ceptors? Make them quicker, dont slow the rest of the ships down, some are already crazy slow.
One can also wonder though whether to go to a third of the time it took before (11 vs 4 seconds, 23 vs 8 etc.) for small stuff. In a game where change is often in the 2-5% range when you skill up or fit a better module, taking 60-65% of warp times seems like A LOT.

So all in all, badly thought through plan.
Scatim Helicon
State War Academy
Caldari State
#220 - 2013-10-06 08:41:18 UTC
Pant MercenaryS wrote:
Starrakatt wrote:
Pant MercenaryS wrote:

I am not saying the warp speed changes are a bad idea, but if this is to be implemented without completely rendering null sec mining useless you have to do some adjustments to mining.

Or use tactics to prevent such a demise, and create an offgrid BM to warp to, then bounce to the very close by mining op.


22+ second warp at 150km plus align time so you're still looking at well over a minute, plenty of time for a ceptor to fly through the scouted system next door and land in your grav.

A ceptor could fly through several gravs in the minute+ time he have. The risk will have increased many times of that it was before this patch, only T3s could blitz through the scouted and bubbled system next door before, but they warp a lot slower then the proposed new ceptor will and also they cost much more.

At the end of the day it is a risk reward thing. I don't see the reward increasing that much, since this hardly affect the mackinaw bots that don't use haulers, they simply warp to a mining site, align out, mine until they fill their 35k m3 cargo hold, warp to station to unload and rinse and repeat.

Also Orcas / Rorquals now have a dimminshed role as haulers, since they have to spend a lot more time in warp, they can't haul ore as fast as they could, the m3 moved per hour is alot less.

Can't really say this isn't a massive nerf to null sec miners that can be remedied by placing a BM 300km of the mining site.

Maybe you could try defending your miners rather than leaving them to die when hostiles roll through?

Every time you post a WiS thread, Hilmar strangles a kitten.