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Player Loan System
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Ju0ZaS
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#21 - 2013-10-03 11:52:31 UTC
Weren't loan contracts a thing maybe 4 yeas ago? Pretty sure CCP removed them for a good reason.

Are you going to fight me or do you expect to bore me to death with your forum pvp?
Velicitia
XS Tech
#22 - 2013-10-03 11:56:06 UTC
Hezron Iserles wrote:
Velicitia wrote:
The biggest thing I do not see you covering ...

... in this new safety-net loan system, what's to stop me from creating a 20 billion ISK loan to an alt, having the alt "default" on the loan, and then getting 20b out of thin air (and then getting the "defaulted" 20b back from the alt's alt)?


This is very easily avoided, simply read my response to Lucas Rox above here. Your scenario is much easier to solve than what he stated, its even funny how easy and silly it is, if you default on the loan CCP just reverses the transaction with whatever you have, doesn't create one additional isk unit. If you don't have the isk then whatever assets you are are returned, and if thats not enough your account goes into a temporal suspension until you pay the owed amount, even with interests accounted for. I think its pretty much the only way this would work, its what happens in real life, and its the right thing to do even in EVE. A little sense of decency, responsibility, and sincerity will not harm the game or the players, I mean just think about what you are saying there, you are ok with theft and crime, why is that? Would you do this in real life? I know its just a game and some people have fun scamming and robbing others, making the easy money, but should it be that way? Should you just demand that you always have the opportunity to get away with crime, even if its in a video game? I think not, and anyways as I already said this system will not hinder anyone from scamming, or pirating, or doing whatever is done right now to rob others, it would only make loans a safer thing to do, it would be a functional thing in the game, and it would just add some more freedom to many honest players.



This is even more terrible of an idea than I initially thought.

Account suspension for being short a few billion ISK? Are you ******* serious? That would ~instantly~ **** people off.

Also -- protip: if they're coming to me for an INGAME LOAN OF ISK, it's a pretty good bet they don't have the RL-disposable income to actually pay for a PLEX.

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia
Hezron Iserles
Star Task Force Innovations
#23 - 2013-10-03 17:16:08 UTC
Velicitia wrote:
Hezron Iserles wrote:
Velicitia wrote:
The biggest thing I do not see you covering ...

... in this new safety-net loan system, what's to stop me from creating a 20 billion ISK loan to an alt, having the alt "default" on the loan, and then getting 20b out of thin air (and then getting the "defaulted" 20b back from the alt's alt)?


This is very easily avoided, simply read my response to Lucas Rox above here. Your scenario is much easier to solve than what he stated, its even funny how easy and silly it is, if you default on the loan CCP just reverses the transaction with whatever you have, doesn't create one additional isk unit. If you don't have the isk then whatever assets you are are returned, and if thats not enough your account goes into a temporal suspension until you pay the owed amount, even with interests accounted for. I think its pretty much the only way this would work, its what happens in real life, and its the right thing to do even in EVE. A little sense of decency, responsibility, and sincerity will not harm the game or the players, I mean just think about what you are saying there, you are ok with theft and crime, why is that? Would you do this in real life? I know its just a game and some people have fun scamming and robbing others, making the easy money, but should it be that way? Should you just demand that you always have the opportunity to get away with crime, even if its in a video game? I think not, and anyways as I already said this system will not hinder anyone from scamming, or pirating, or doing whatever is done right now to rob others, it would only make loans a safer thing to do, it would be a functional thing in the game, and it would just add some more freedom to many honest players.



This is even more terrible of an idea than I initially thought.

Account suspension for being short a few billion ISK? Are you ******* serious? That would ~instantly~ **** people off.

Also -- protip: if they're coming to me for an INGAME LOAN OF ISK, it's a pretty good bet they don't have the RL-disposable income to actually pay for a PLEX.

Take it easy! Remember, if you are not ok with the terms of getting a loan then you don't have to freak out about it, just don't take or ask for a loan, its that simple, ok? Nobody will force you to get a loan, its your choice, if you do take a loan then be prepared to be responsible for what you do with it. If you just want to pvp and lose ships on other peoples money then you have to pay for that, and this should mean account suspension. If you are an industrial player like me and you need a few billion to start new production lines then you should be perfectly fine, its that simple.
Hesod Adee
Perkone
Caldari State
#24 - 2013-10-04 07:52:15 UTC
Hezron Iserles wrote:
Hesod Adee wrote:
Hezron Iserles wrote:
The issue here is about making things easier and more secure for everyone.

That is the biggest problem I have with your suggestion.

Yes offcourse, because you probably either scam and/or does some pirating, but in any case this wouldn't be eliminated, its just loans, how other way would this affect the risk of the game other than the way people lend others the isk they need? It really doesn't, the risk in the game would still be there, pretty much the same. You can still scam and you can still do pirating etc.

You are talking about banning people for defaulting on their loans. So tell us, why would anyone use the current options for loans when they have this nice safe system that you created ?

If you don't have a good reason, then your system will reduce scamming.

But lets get into the stupid of your suggestion to ban people for defaulting:
- How can CCP tell between an accidental default (someone gets a loan to buy an ISK making ship, then it gets ganked) from an intentional one (someone buys a mission running ship with the loan, then has some friends gank it) ?
Or do you really think that suspending someones account when they have done nothing wrong is a good idea ?

If it's the later, go back to WoW. Or any other carebear game. You have no place in Eve.
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