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Question for CCP - Is this RMT officially allowed?

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Murk Paradox
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#81 - 2013-09-28 18:15:16 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Murk Paradox wrote:
Then what do you get for using their affiliate links?

“Blink's GTC bonus gives you 250M Blink Credit for each 60-Day GTC you purchase, and 125M Blink Credit for each 30-Day GTC you purchase. For every four 60-Day GTC (or eight 30-Day GTC) you purchase in the same transaction, you'll receive an additional bonus 250M.”



And what can you use those credits on?

This post has been signed by Murk Paradox and no other accounts, alternate or otherwise. Any other post claiming to be this holder's is subject to being banned at the discretion of the GM Team as it would violate the TOS in regards to impersonation. Signed, Murk Paradox. In triplicate.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#82 - 2013-09-28 18:16:04 UTC
Murk Paradox wrote:
And what can you use those credits on?
Lottery tickets.
Murk Paradox
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#83 - 2013-09-28 18:17:04 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Murk Paradox wrote:
And what can you use those credits on?
Lottery tickets.



What are the lotteries for?

This post has been signed by Murk Paradox and no other accounts, alternate or otherwise. Any other post claiming to be this holder's is subject to being banned at the discretion of the GM Team as it would violate the TOS in regards to impersonation. Signed, Murk Paradox. In triplicate.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#84 - 2013-09-28 18:18:23 UTC
Murk Paradox wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Murk Paradox wrote:
And what can you use those credits on?
Lottery tickets.

What are the lotteries for?

Foolish people.
Murk Paradox
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#85 - 2013-09-28 18:20:43 UTC
Tippia wrote:


Foolish people.



I can win a foolish people with lottery tickets that I got for a bonus from buying a GTC from Somer's affiliate links?

Interesting.

Be careful in your desire to be obtuse you are not impersonating an entity that you are not associated with.

This post has been signed by Murk Paradox and no other accounts, alternate or otherwise. Any other post claiming to be this holder's is subject to being banned at the discretion of the GM Team as it would violate the TOS in regards to impersonation. Signed, Murk Paradox. In triplicate.
Murk Paradox
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#86 - 2013-09-28 18:21:40 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Murk Paradox wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Murk Paradox wrote:
And what can you use those credits on?
Lottery tickets.

What are the lotteries for?

Foolish people.



So just to confirm your answers, you are saying you cannot win ingame items using out of game currency is that correct?

This post has been signed by Murk Paradox and no other accounts, alternate or otherwise. Any other post claiming to be this holder's is subject to being banned at the discretion of the GM Team as it would violate the TOS in regards to impersonation. Signed, Murk Paradox. In triplicate.
Murk Paradox
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#87 - 2013-09-28 18:23:56 UTC
I'm sorry, let me rephrase it into a direct question as to not be misleading.

Are you saying you can, or can not win in game items using out of game currency from Somer's blink website?

This post has been signed by Murk Paradox and no other accounts, alternate or otherwise. Any other post claiming to be this holder's is subject to being banned at the discretion of the GM Team as it would violate the TOS in regards to impersonation. Signed, Murk Paradox. In triplicate.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#88 - 2013-09-28 18:24:36 UTC
Murk Paradox wrote:
So just to confirm your answers, you are saying you cannot win ingame items using out of game currency is that correct?
No it is not. Maybe if you used my answers rather than your own, you'd be able to confirm what I said more readily.

I'm saying that Somer getting money from Markee for sending customers their way is not the same thing as you giving Somer money in return for ISK.
Murk Paradox
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#89 - 2013-09-28 18:27:25 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Murk Paradox wrote:
So just to confirm your answers, you are saying you cannot win ingame items using out of game currency is that correct?
No it is not. Maybe if you used my answers rather than your own, you'd be able to confirm what I said more readily.

I'm saying that Somer getting money from Markee for sending customers their way is not the same thing as you giving Somer money in return for ISK.



But that has nothing to do with my questions.

You endeavored to engage in conversation with me. If you refuse, or choose not to answer as truthfully as it lead up to this, I will gladly acknowledge your tactical retreat and wish you a good day.

This post has been signed by Murk Paradox and no other accounts, alternate or otherwise. Any other post claiming to be this holder's is subject to being banned at the discretion of the GM Team as it would violate the TOS in regards to impersonation. Signed, Murk Paradox. In triplicate.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#90 - 2013-09-28 18:30:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Murk Paradox wrote:
But that has nothing to do with my questions.
…apart from answering it. Just because you don't like that answer doesn't mean it isn't one.

The simple fact remains: you are not being given any in-game items just because Somer gets cash from a third party for driving traffic to that party.
Murk Paradox
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#91 - 2013-09-28 18:32:19 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Murk Paradox wrote:
But that has nothing to do with my questions.
…apart from answering it. Just because you don't like that answer doesn't mean it isn't one.



I gave you a small out in which you could disengage from the conversation.

You took it.

I acknowledge it.

Have a good day.

This post has been signed by Murk Paradox and no other accounts, alternate or otherwise. Any other post claiming to be this holder's is subject to being banned at the discretion of the GM Team as it would violate the TOS in regards to impersonation. Signed, Murk Paradox. In triplicate.
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#92 - 2013-09-28 19:13:21 UTC
I run a website and my friend runs another website (A and B respectively).
Website A links users to website B which is selling GTC to support itself.
Website B in return sends website A some real money for every GTC bought.
Website A in return sends ISK to the person who bought the GTC from website B.

Let's place the websites inside a black box. What happens?
User puts real money inside the black box. User gets ISK out of the black box (separately from the GTC).
If I set up a program that does such a thing, then according to Tippia this isn't RMT.

The gambling aspect isn't important at all since buying all the tickets guarantees a certain payout.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#93 - 2013-09-28 19:25:05 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Let's place the websites inside a black box. What happens?
We get an incomplete picture of what's actually going on, which makes it wholly inadequate for determining whether ISK has been traded for cash or vice versa.

Quote:
The gambling aspect isn't important at all since buying all the tickets guarantees a certain payout.
…and again, if there is any part of this that even remotely resembles RMT, it's that transfer between ISK→Credits and Credits→Items — the GTC part isn't important at all since, at best, if we fallaciously collapse all the intermediate steps it's just an out-of-game-for-out-of-game trade.

Of course, since that's a closed system with in-game items entering at one end and in-game items exiting at the other (and some skimming taking place in the middle), it's not really something that's worth enforcing.
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#94 - 2013-09-28 19:27:36 UTC
Let's say I were to buy four GTCs through Blink's affiliate program. This would accordingly get me 1.25b ISK of Blink credit (250m ISK per GTC, plus 250m extra for every four bought).

If I were to blink all 8 tickets 5 times on an item that had a ticket cost of 31m isk and an isk payout of 197m (calculated roughly using Muninn ticket and payout prices) I'd use up all but 10m of this blink credit and get a guaranteed isk payout of 985m.

Normally that'd be pretty crappy RMT, but that's in addition to the ISK you get from selling the PLEX.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#95 - 2013-09-28 19:29:22 UTC
Tippia wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Let's place the websites inside a black box. What happens?
We get an incomplete picture of what's actually going on, which makes it wholly inadequate for determining whether ISK has been traded for cash or vice versa.

Quote:
The gambling aspect isn't important at all since buying all the tickets guarantees a certain payout.
…and again, if there is any part of this that even remotely resembles RMT, it's that transfer between ISK→Credits and Credits→Items — the GTC part isn't important at all since, at best, if we fallaciously collapse all the intermediate steps it's just an out-of-game-for-out-of-game trade.

Of course, since that's a closed system with in-game items entering at one end and in-game items exiting at the other (and some skimming taking place in the middle), it's not really something that's worth enforcing.

So you're saying it's perfectly okay if I set up the system as I described above, that I can send players ISK for buying GTC from my affiliate who in turn sends me cash.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#96 - 2013-09-28 19:33:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
So you're saying it's perfectly okay if I set up the system as I described above, that I can send players ISK for buying GTC from my affiliate who in turn sends me cash.

I'm saying that the GTC part is completely irrelevant. If anything, it's the part that is definitely kosher in every way.
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#97 - 2013-09-28 19:35:59 UTC
So replace "buying GTC" with "making a purchase."
How is that irrelevant in any way?

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#98 - 2013-09-28 19:37:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
So replace "buying GTC" with "making a purchase."
How is that irrelevant in any way?

Because you're trading out-of-game for out-of-game, in accordance with the rules set up for affiliate sales of these goods.

It's GTC for cash for kickback. The only potentially illegitimate part is if you're not actually an authorised GTC retailer, but that's not what we're talking about.
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#99 - 2013-09-28 19:39:27 UTC
Tippia wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
So replace "buying GTC" with "making a purchase."
How is that irrelevant in any way?

Because you're trading out-of-game for out-of-game, in accordance with the rules set up for affiliate sales of these goods.

Last I checked an ISK payout is not "out-of-game".

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#100 - 2013-09-28 19:44:43 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Last I checked an ISK payout is not "out-of-game".
No, but the Cash→GTC→Kickback parts all are.
My point is that if people want to cry “RMT” about all of this, they should stop trying to squeeze the affiliate sales into it because that part is completely irrelevant.