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Killing in Corp
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Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#41 - 2013-11-20 17:10:59 UTC
Joe Risalo wrote:
Arthur Trueshot wrote:
Kirkwood Ross wrote:
Trust is the cornerstone of any relationship.


so if we follow this logic and the logic that it has to be risky to invite people to corp why not get rid of the roles. This way any player accepted in the corp can steal from the corp hangar and empty the corp wallet at day 1. If you trust the people you invite where is the problem? and if you are against it well you better work on your background check to identify those people before accepting them into the corp. Why accept roles to restrict what people do in corp but allow anyone to blow up you freighter, orcas, shinins etc. This just doesn't make sens.

The main problem with the shooting at corpmate is that you have to earn the trust before you join the corp so you actually destroy more or less the purpose of a corp. To earn the trust you have to have some kind of communication and do stuff together, so whats the point of a corp then? Taking risk? At least with the roles you can accept someone and after time give him more and more roles. Which means that he can work on the trust while being in the corp, and if someone want to spend months of his time to get the trust an then steal well respect for the effort. Its not like he can create a new toon join a more or less random corp and start shooting orca/freigther in less than 3 days.

And the other stuff please, you can web freighter by using the duel mechanic and if you want to make a tournament every one goes yellow in a safe spot in highsec. Don't tell me you fear loosing a pvp ship.



This basically....

I don't have to trust a new guy when it comes to theft.
Hell, I don't even have to invite him to fleet, and they're often not involved in fleets, nor allowed into important chat/voice until he is trusted.


Again though, awoxing is rarely (if ever) used for any type of tactical advantage.

I mean seriously, ...
You awox a SOV alliance... you become a permanent target
You awox a WH corp/alliance... you will become a permanent target.
You awox a low sec corp/alliance... Again, you become a permanent target,
You awox a large high sec corp/alliance in high sec... Basically the same outcome...
You awox a high sec pvp corp..... Same thing happens...

99.9% of the time it is used against soft, high sec targets. These targets are typically mining/missioning high sec corps.
I have never seen an awoxer attack a corp/alliance that is pvp centric.

They do it for trolling, isk, and KB padding.

Lastly, you awox a small pve corp with no holdings to anything.... You fly around trying to get more awoxes until you log and get kicked. Even if everyone leaves the corp, you're still not accomplishing anything.
Odds are they're simply starting a new corp with all the same people....
The corp they drop, had no pull on Eve and isn't effecting anyone, other than those few players.

My point is, awoxing is the most useless activity in Eve, and is practically always used against soft, small high sec corps that would be obvious easy targets.

If you support awoxing, you essentially support Eve easy mode...


As far as all the corp activities to have a little fun, well, we have this nifty little button that turns off safeties...
Perhaps you should be able to see in corp chat which players have their safety off, and they become a free target.
Also, as soon as you attack them, your safety is turned off as well.



Several counterpoints:

A.) Even the most PvP capable entities in the game are periodically nailed by AWOXers. This is a major reason why they have a more robust recruitment process. Go ask Black Legion or Goons or Test or PL about memorable AWOX events in their corp, and they'll have stories to tell (if they care to).

B.) Does an AWOXing event undermine the trust of corp mates? Absolutely. But this is a good thing. For trust to grow, it needs a place to start. You can restrict roles and access so a new corp member is nothing more than a neutral, with one MAJOR exception... they can attack your ships in space without Concord intervention. If you take that away, and suddenly there is no starting point for Trust, as there is nothing put at risk by bringing them on board.

EvE is a dystopia, and other players are allowed (and sometimes encouraged) to betray trusts. Have you even seen the EvE Causality Trailer?

C.) This game thrives on use-generated conflict. AWOXing is one of the tools that create this drama. It is not only used on small highsec dwelling PvE groups. Your biased because they are the ones that whine and complain the loudest about the mechanic because they don't understand how to or don't want to take precautions against it. As you grow a corp, learning to deal with this is one of your first major hurdles.
Joe Risalo
State War Academy
Caldari State
#42 - 2013-11-20 22:29:19 UTC
LOL56 wrote:
its cute how you don't see income disruption as a tactic.you see by disrupting their income you lesson their ability to kill you in future fights, thus making you more likely to win them.



Uhh, ever heard of a war dec?

Used to be in the good ol' days, you could simply war dec a corp and keep them locked in station... That's income disruption.
Awoxing for a couple hours might ger a kill or two, but ultimately you're cause way less earning disruption than a week long dec.
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#43 - 2013-11-20 23:04:42 UTC
Joe Risalo wrote:
LOL56 wrote:
its cute how you don't see income disruption as a tactic.you see by disrupting their income you lesson their ability to kill you in future fights, thus making you more likely to win them.



Uhh, ever heard of a war dec?

Used to be in the good ol' days, you could simply war dec a corp and keep them locked in station... That's income disruption.
Awoxing for a couple hours might ger a kill or two, but ultimately you're cause way less earning disruption than a week long dec.


A week long dec that is laughably easy to avoid you mean?

I think you might be playing the wrong game.
Psychoactive Stimulant
#44 - 2013-11-20 23:10:49 UTC
My RL friend's first kill was me in the same corp.

He thought he had targeted my drone that was on him, but no... sadface.

I was a bit buttmad at the time, but why shouldn't corp execs be able to punish puny children if they misbehave?



Basically, biomass yourself.
Arthur Trueshot
Four Pillar Production
#45 - 2013-11-21 09:51:55 UTC
Joe Risalo wrote:


This basically....



you really don't get sarcasm do you?


Gizznitt Malikite wrote:


B.) Does an AWOXing event undermine the trust of corp mates? Absolutely. But this is a good thing. For trust to grow, it needs a place to start. You can restrict roles and access so a new corp member is nothing more than a neutral, with one MAJOR exception... they can attack your ships in space without Concord intervention. If you take that away, and suddenly there is no starting point for Trust, as there is nothing put at risk by bringing them on board.



Actually the starting point of trust is time spend and effort. You start to trust people because they have spend time/effort, not because they haven't shot you. Like it says in the trailer you linked you start moving up the ranks and then you take revenge, you don't shoot at them at the first occasion.

Actually the only consequence of being able to shoot corp members is that you create a "new recruit corp" in your alliance and you keep people in there for a while until you start trusting them. But again this actually kind of destroys the whole idea of a corp.
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