Crime & Punishment

Well its a bit of a **** move for someone running what is advertised as a public channel to boot an alliance because they dont like a corp in that alliance eve though the alliance has done nothing wrong and that corp has no acsces to said channel.

Personnal hatred should be set aside as long as people are playing by the rules and not exploiting the channel.

This.

Not anymore sunshine.
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=277436&find=unread

The thing though is that it's not about it being political, it's about removing an entity from the channel which the alliance leader wants to stand in for, and the channel is telling him how to run his alliance. :p

While it did not affect Whores in space, or BAW with Kane.

I can't see the harm in having multiple channels providing those channels do function as advertised and actually promote all mercs providing they follow the rules setting aside personal preference and politics. We are all here to pick up contracts and get paid at the end of the day.

How wonderfully dramatic.

I'm sure this will all blow over shortly. Oh wait, no, it's highsec. This will last forever and much e-viagra will be consumed in the process.

Fly is a loose term to use.
http://evewho.com/pilot/Duncan+Norvelle

He's a forum alt and seems to have no kills at all in Red Fed when i searched our killboards.

I appreciate all the hard work the mods have put into the channel all these years, but I have to agree with Raz, Saeger and others on this matter (I know....whyyy TORA !! ). I understand why some mod(s) want to keep the old Rebirth out of the channel (I was told they scammed in there. Not sure of they really did), but that shouldn't be an issue right now. RB isn't the one taking contracts here, it's devils. If a RB guy takes a contract and scams, Raz is responsible and he knows what the result could be. So he is taking the 'risk' here, not the mods. I also still believe some RB's have seen the light and I personally would give Kai the benefit of the doubt here. We had some good chats and I think he really changed a lot. In a good way.

Merc channel is there for the mercs. If you make a decision which most mercs do not support, I would expect mod(s) to reverse it and respect the players they are doing it for.

Just my two cents on this matter.....

Here, breathe into this brown bag lol. They have been permanently black listed due to problems over the course of a long period of time and several alliances.


Nothing was, or is, "demanded" of Devils/Raz. He was contacted and reminded about Rebirth's black listing and the litany of reasons why they are so. I explained what that blacklisting would entail. I also explained that due to a recent "give an established alliance recruiting them the benefit of the doubt" exemption that didn't work out well that it would not be an option.

It wasn't an act of hostility; I'm not going to pretend I or any other mod is best friends with Devils but they've never done anything to earn negativity imo. Raz can recruit whoever he wants (i dont understand this choice but I dont judge it either except as it relates to the channel rules), but keeping channel integrity is not just a matter of blindly ignoring obvious problems to support some kind of mercenary old boys club. We have a responsibility to the customers/employers that use the channel as well.


1. While it makes sense if you take a second to think about it, you are correct that it is not explicitly stated that recruiting blacklisted units into another unit is a problem. That is why Lord Raz was contacted and the situation explained instead of just delisting them out of the blue (which I agree would have been a **** move)
2. They asked for the benefit of the doubt because their alliance leadership would take responsibility for and control Rebirth. It really worked out poorly all around, which is why we're not going to do it again.
3. As far as I know, while Vegas is kinda nuts and has been banned from the channel for trolling, as far as i know he is not himself a corporation/alliance or blacklisted for contract scamming.
4. I dont see any black listed corps in Break-A-Wish so I'm not sure what you are referring to.



A choice is always a choice and getting your name taken out of chat room MOTD is hardly a gun. Devils Warriors did not have a gun to their heads when they recruited a blacklisted corp and kept with them when reminded of their status. You are correct, the merc contracts channel mods are not a group empowered to do governance of the mercenary market and dont want to be. The channel was created to provide a scam-free environment for mercs and clients to find one another, enforced by community moderation to keep it that way. We did our jobs.

Of the three major rules (no scamming contracts, respect mod rulings, and treat other channel mercs with professional courtesy) two apply. Rebirth scammed contracts multiple times so were blacklisted for that. Every time they've been given a chance to come back into the community it's ended poorly so mods were not going to grant them another opportunity to cause trouble. Devils ignored the mod ruling of the blacklist and as you can see from this post could really care less about the rules or integrity of the channel they feel entitled to be listed in if it causes them inconvenience.


Pre-emptive means before you did something. You actually did recruit a black listed corp.
Guilt by association? No one cares if you're friends with them but THEY ARE PART OF YOUR ALLIANCE lol.

I'm not sure WHY you feel so entitled to stuff Feyd, but the Merc Contracts channel is a free service provided to mercs and clients which can obey its relatively simple, but necessary, rules. You didn't follow those rules and continue to refuse to, so you are no longer listed as a merc unit that does. It's not complicated, it's not an "abuse" or "political," it's not even hostile (it's not like delisting Devils was fun). But it is what it is.

Alekseyev Karrde, no matter what reasons you have, you should NOT blacklist a whole alliance with alot of other great corporations in for the crime a single corporation have done a long time ago outside of 'The Devil's Warrior Alliance'. Rebirth is permanently banned and not allowed back into the Merc channel anymore. So what are the problems?

The alliance we are in now haven't done anything wrong at any points, so why are you delisting them as a whole?

Do you think Rebirth is going to do contract scams and that kind of things on others as a seperate corp when the alliance leaders is the part who takes the decisions on what jobs / contracts we are going to take?

That would get us kicked faster than light speed if we would do that here. So, we as a Merc corp will do whatever the alliance wants us to do. And we always have to follow The Devil's Warrior Alliance's rules anyways as long we want to stay here. Delisting the whole alliance with alot of other great Merc coprorations in, in the Merc channel just because Rebirth decided to join this alliance is ******** beyond anything. I also want to hear your reasons on why you think it's fine to do it this way instead of just banning the seperate corporations in the alliances instead in the Merc channel?

Think about this for a second. One corporation in an alliance with 40 corporations in does something wrong that the alliance they are in can't do anything to stop that or fix it. Do you think it's fine to just let the rest of the 39 corporations in that Merc alliance suffer just because one corporations did something that they shouldn't have done and have got banned from the channel for it?

This decision is also there to prevent the way alliances ingame might runs. Also that this rule or whatever CAN be a brake to their ingame business just because someone decided to delist a whole alliance instead of just banning / delisting the corps. This rule is also a way to prevent alliances ingame to let corporations they like to join them, just because of the way someone runs the Merc channel. So this decision or rule might actually punishes the other corporations in those alliances who are affected by this kind of things more than it punishes the banned corps by being permanently banned from the channel. Think about that also.

Yes, this is just some examples to let you see how dumb that decision is.