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Competitive Gaming

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Harry Forever
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#381 - 2013-09-19 09:27:40 UTC
Roime wrote:
Harry Forever wrote:


1. you don't understand modern gamers

2. those 1000 will be fine and have a lot of fun

if you think arena fights will be so bad, just don't play in it, trust me, those other people will be fine with it

you play your sandbox, we play our arenas, not sure why you guys have issues with that

you keep repeating that you will never play in arenas, so all be fine

its just two different types of players, thats why it is seperated form the eve universe

you people act like if you want to decide what game a gamer should play

those eve dictators are so funny


1. you don't understand any games

2. no, they will be a chaotic mess with totally random outcomes

Yes, we play EVE, you are free to play other games with the consentual, meaningless and boring gameplay you like

You act like you are the one who knows what everyone else likes, when you know nothing of the game you are posting about, and continue trying to dictate what CCP should waste their dev time on.



sure dev time will be used to develope, you guys do not want new content so people have time for my ideas

by the way, the engine is already perfect for the gamemode, they just need to program a matchmaking system

thats not that difficult to bring a basic version out fast

you are free to continue to play your sandbox version of EvE, let the others decide on their own as well, its not you dictating what and how things should be done

you can play dictator in your corp. leave it there

Harry Forever vs. Goonswarm
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#382 - 2013-09-19 09:36:43 UTC
You can play a dictator in your basement, the same place where you can easily code a matchmaking system that makes it possible to get 2000 people to fight in spaceships in just 30 seconds every time they happen to login!

Your idea is still terrible, badly presented and you're uncapable of having any kind of discussion about it. You are either a very dedicated and innovative troll, or then just plain batshit stupid. I will give you 10/10 for still keeping us undecided whether you actually are serious or not.

.
Harry Forever
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#383 - 2013-09-19 09:54:01 UTC
Roime wrote:
You can play a dictator in your basement, the same place where you can easily code a matchmaking system that makes it possible to get 2000 people to fight in spaceships in just 30 seconds every time they happen to login!

Your idea is still terrible, badly presented and you're uncapable of having any kind of discussion about it. You are either a very dedicated and innovative troll, or then just plain batshit stupid. I will give you 10/10 for still keeping us undecided whether you actually are serious or not.



all modern games have a matchmaking system for pvp and arena style gameplay, its already serious business since years

however you maybe missed it in your cave, try to look outside your box just once every 10 years

Harry Forever vs. Goonswarm
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#384 - 2013-09-19 10:03:24 UTC
Harry Forever wrote:

all modern games have a matchmaking system for pvp and arena style gameplay, its already serious business since years

however you maybe missed it in your cave, try to look outside your box just once every 10 years


Very few games have functional and challenging open world, full loot PVP, and that's why we play EVE

You don't like challenges and risk, that's why you want instanced arcade mode, but Harry here's one more time- go play any of the millions of casual PVP games with matchmaking and arenas if that's your style.









.
SKINE DMZ
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#385 - 2013-09-19 12:03:10 UTC  |  Edited by: SKINE DMZ
Harry, realise that maybe this is one of the unique games that don't(and probably shouldn't) offer arenas, for reasons many have already explained to you. You can't just keep going "lalalala i am not going to listen because modern games have this so gamers want it", childish communication. You can not hold a discussion in the slightest, any of your points or arguments are simply weak and not thought out.

It's funny you tell us to look outside the box, yet you want everything the linear standard MMO provides.

I give up, your just a little bit stupid, and that's okay. I sincerely hope you are a troll, for you because if you have been serious with your posting then you are a lost cause.

I disagree
Barzai Mekhar
True Confusion
#386 - 2013-09-19 13:22:11 UTC
Oh look, this thread is still around.

SKINE DMZ wrote:
You can't just keep going "lalalala i am not going to listen because modern games have this so gamers want it", childish communication.


Bet you 10 ISK he can for at least 5 more pages.
Harry Forever
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#387 - 2013-09-19 13:29:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Harry Forever
Roime wrote:
Harry Forever wrote:

all modern games have a matchmaking system for pvp and arena style gameplay, its already serious business since years

however you maybe missed it in your cave, try to look outside your box just once every 10 years


Very few games have functional and challenging open world, full loot PVP, and that's why we play EVE

You don't like challenges and risk, that's why you want instanced arcade mode, but Harry here's one more time- go play any of the millions of casual PVP games with matchmaking and arenas if that's your style.




no, we are gamers who want both, eve is the only game that can offer both gaming types in a satisfying way, if you don't want arena gameplay you can stick to the sandbox only, we will not hold you up

however gamers like me want different options to choose, sometimes i want instant pvp, sometimes i want to go mining, sometimes i want to trade... I play all gamemodes, and arenas are missing in this game, thats why they have to add it

if you want to just play one part of the game thats fine, however modern gamers need more option, sandbox alone is not enough, eve can be much more, and the game engine would be perfect to use it in different ways to attract those gamers out there

Harry Forever vs. Goonswarm
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#388 - 2013-09-19 13:41:56 UTC
No, they don't have to add it anymore than they have to add markets, sov or wormholes to Halo.

Also, you are still alone so you can drop the "we".

.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#389 - 2013-09-19 13:46:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Lucas Kell
Harry Forever wrote:
no, we are gamers who want both, eve is the only game that can offer both gaming types in a satisfying way, if you don't want arena gameplay you can stick to the sandbox only, we will not hold you up

however gamers like me want different options to choose, sometimes i want instant pvp, sometimes i want to go mining, sometimes i want to trade... I play all gamemodes, and arenas are missing in this game, thats why they have to add it

if you want to just play one part of the game thats fine, however modern gamers need more option, sandbox alone is not enough, eve can be much more, and the game engine would be perfect to use it in different ways to attract those gamers out there
Harry, this is the short of it:
You can continue to ***** and whine and cry and tell us how you know best, but it's NEVER going to happen. Please, by all means continue paying CCP every month so you can continue filling the game with tears, but you will never get what you want. The day CCP decides to split EVE into a sandbox side and an arcade side is the day EVE dies on a conceptual level.
Nothing you say, no amount of what you seem to think is reasoning, no volume of tears is going to get you this change.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Harry Forever
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#390 - 2013-09-19 14:16:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Harry Forever
Roime wrote:
No, they don't have to add it anymore than they have to add markets, sov or wormholes to Halo.

Also, you are still alone so you can drop the "we".



why do you think did bungie the ex halo developer switch to an open world game called destiny, where you can have arena type experience as well as an open world feeling

you are not up to date buddy, gamers out there demanding all gametypes

you are the only one who lives in the past, we all got that

Harry Forever vs. Goonswarm
Harry Forever
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#391 - 2013-09-19 14:18:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Harry Forever
Lucas Kell wrote:
Harry Forever wrote:
no, we are gamers who want both, eve is the only game that can offer both gaming types in a satisfying way, if you don't want arena gameplay you can stick to the sandbox only, we will not hold you up

however gamers like me want different options to choose, sometimes i want instant pvp, sometimes i want to go mining, sometimes i want to trade... I play all gamemodes, and arenas are missing in this game, thats why they have to add it

if you want to just play one part of the game thats fine, however modern gamers need more option, sandbox alone is not enough, eve can be much more, and the game engine would be perfect to use it in different ways to attract those gamers out there
Harry, this is the short of it:
You can continue to ***** and whine and cry and tell us how you know best, but it's NEVER going to happen. Please, by all means continue paying CCP every month so you can continue filling the game with tears, but you will never get what you want. The day CCP decides to split EVE into a sandbox side and an arcade side is the day EVE dies on a conceptual level.
Nothing you say, no amount of what you seem to think is reasoning, no volume of tears is going to get you this change.


its common sense and gaming experience, you are the only one who sounds a bit like a crybaby

go on with your tears, gaming habbits won't change of the masses, sure you guys are some old gamers who can't keep up with the new developements, I'm sure CCP will take care you still find your place in eve after they add fresh new stuff

we all know how sensitive you are in regards of new things... trust me that

maybe they just add a puzzle at the login to assure arenas are not accessible for the weak minded, so you guys have the feeling it would not be there

Harry Forever vs. Goonswarm
Barzai Mekhar
True Confusion
#392 - 2013-09-19 14:27:57 UTC
Harry Forever wrote:

its common sense and gaming experience, you are the only one who sounds a bit like a crybaby


Talking about gaming experience, have you already explained how the following problems most MMO's with an arena system experienced and still experience are solved in a way that does not require changes to the general pvp functionality?

-Organized groups vs. Random people. Organized groups with a fixed setup are usually highly superior to unorganized random groups and will mercilessly annihilta them, causing randoms to quickly lose interest, yet limiting peoples ability to queue as a group is generally considered an unsocial move.
-"FOTM"-setups; once a certain setup (here: ship type + fitting) has been identified as superior, everyone plays it, resulting in an overall more boring gaming experience. Usually handled by swinging the nerfbat twice a year.
-Nonfunctional / unbalanced group composition in randomly assembled groups.
-High alpha damag in mass battles causes people to die without any available defence (which is generally not considered fun).
-Long term motivation to guarantee sufficient arena participation once the initial hype is over which does not include monetary or item gain.
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#393 - 2013-09-19 14:31:16 UTC
Harry Forever wrote:
Roime wrote:
No, they don't have to add it anymore than they have to add markets, sov or wormholes to Halo.

Also, you are still alone so you can drop the "we".



why do you think did bungie the ex halo developer switch to an open world game called destiny, where you can have arena type experience as well as an open world feeling

you are not up to date buddy, gamers out there demanding all gametypes

you are the only one who lives in the past, we all got that


Why didn't they add sov, wormholes and markets to Halo?

Why do you think CCP made Dust instead of arenas into EVE?

Right, because EVE is not CoD and Civilization is not Fallout and GTA is not Super Mario.

Why there are no FPS arenas in Farmville? Why can't you skill train your Tetris pieces?

You are not up to date buddy, in the real world there are different games for different audiences, offering different experiences. They are not all smashed into one game.

.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#394 - 2013-09-19 14:44:11 UTC
Harry Forever wrote:
its common sense and gaming experience, you are the only one who sounds a bit like a crybaby

go on with your tears, gaming habbits won't change of the masses, sure you guys are some old gamers who can't keep up with the new developements, I'm sure CCP will take care you still find your place in eve after they add fresh new stuff

we all know how sensitive you are in regards of new things... trust me that

maybe they just add a puzzle at the login to assure arenas are not accessible for the weak minded, so you guys have the feeling it would not be there

*slow clap*
So the fact that I enjoy EVE and don;t want to see it ruined is being a crybaby eh?
Grow up kiddo. You clearly know NOTHING about game design, or even gamers in general. All you know is that you love COD and you don't like EVE therefore EVE must become COD.
Just go play DUST or something. Oh wait, what? You are terrible at DUST too?

The joke of it is, EVEN IF CCP made arenas in EVE, you would STILL get destroyed in 10 seconds, and you'd be back in the queue. Making it an arena won't suddenly make you good at EVE, and people will probably not take cyno ships into the arena. Basically this whole thread has started as your tears from being killed so often, and you somehow think in an arena you'd be super amazing and successfully kill everyone. Guess what? You wouldn't.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Harry Forever
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#395 - 2013-09-19 15:00:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Harry Forever
Barzai Mekhar wrote:
Harry Forever wrote:

its common sense and gaming experience, you are the only one who sounds a bit like a crybaby


Talking about gaming experience, have you already explained how the following problems most MMO's with an arena system experienced and still experience are solved in a way that does not require changes to the general pvp functionality?

-Organized groups vs. Random people. Organized groups with a fixed setup are usually highly superior to unorganized random groups and will mercilessly annihilta them, causing randoms to quickly lose interest, yet limiting peoples ability to queue as a group is generally considered an unsocial move.
-"FOTM"-setups; once a certain setup (here: ship type + fitting) has been identified as superior, everyone plays it, resulting in an overall more boring gaming experience. Usually handled by swinging the nerfbat twice a year.
-Nonfunctional / unbalanced group composition in randomly assembled groups.
-High alpha damag in mass battles causes people to die without any available defence (which is generally not considered fun).
-Long term motivation to guarantee sufficient arena participation once the initial hype is over which does not include monetary or item gain.


the only problem other MMO face with arenas is that arenas reveal that their metagame is crap because nobody wants to play it anymore... EvEs metagame is sound, thats why people will keep playing it

- you have free for all arenas, and grouped arenas, like in starcraft with different leagues and matchmaking

- algorithms are setup to bring together even groups, thats not hard, at the beginning it could be frigates megafights, cruiser megafights etc. and then they develope more detailed groups with different shiptypes

- 100 vs. 100 are fun no matter what happens, if you don't loose your ship its all good, its free for all battles they add just stuff on the fly, this is total war

Harry Forever vs. Goonswarm
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#396 - 2013-09-19 15:05:32 UTC
Metagame, meta game = literally "what happens outside the game client".

What you are referring to is the core gameplay, which in EVE's case doesn't seem to interest you one bit.

What about all the issues Barzai listed, how could they be solved? How do you expect 2000 random people to form up for a fleet fight in 30 seconds whenever you feel like it?



.
Harry Forever
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#397 - 2013-09-19 15:10:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Harry Forever
Roime wrote:
Metagame, meta game = literally "what happens outside the game client".

What you are referring to is the core gameplay, which in EVE's case doesn't seem to interest you one bit.

What about all the issues Barzai listed, how could they be solved? How do you expect 2000 random people to form up for a fleet fight in 30 seconds whenever you feel like it?





I'm destroying goonswarm, I'm all into it while you play factional warfare without meaning, I'm all into the metagame

40.000 people are online only 10% need to go to the arena that we can have those fights easy, we can have a 1000 vs. 1000 each hour and a couple of 100 vs. 100 and 50 vs. 50 and 10 vs. 10 etc.

they decide ship they are put together and go, programmers know how they have to do it, and how they need to compose the two groups to assure its a fun fight

you take all frigates of simular strength divide it by 2 allocate it, and you just go on with the rest of the ships like that

tables will allocate ships based on class and strenght, the matchmaking system will take care and put it all together

Harry Forever vs. Goonswarm
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#398 - 2013-09-19 15:16:36 UTC
You sure are showing those ebil goonies.

You're especially good with the metagame part, goons have no chance against you in that area.

Well while you wait in your arena queues, rest of will keep shooting each others on TQ. Which you could do all the time as well, but you don't like competitive gaming and challenges, trust me that



.
Ustrello
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#399 - 2013-09-19 15:17:33 UTC
Harry Forever wrote:
Roime wrote:
Metagame, meta game = literally "what happens outside the game client".

What you are referring to is the core gameplay, which in EVE's case doesn't seem to interest you one bit.

What about all the issues Barzai listed, how could they be solved? How do you expect 2000 random people to form up for a fleet fight in 30 seconds whenever you feel like it?





I'm destroying goonswarm, I'm all into it while you play factional warfare without meaning, I'm all into the metagame

40.000 people are online only 10% need to go to the arena that we can have those fights easy, we can have a 1000 vs. 1000 each hour and a couple of 100 vs. 100 and 50 vs. 50 and 10 vs. 10 etc.

they decide ship they are put together and go, programmers know how they have to do it, and how they need to compose the two groups to assure its a fun fight

you take all frigates of simular strength divide it by 2 allocate it, and you just go on with the rest of the ships like that

tables will allocate ships based on class and strenght, the matchmaking system will take care and put it all together



If you are destroying goonswarm then I am single handedly ending the Syrian war myself
Barzai Mekhar
True Confusion
#400 - 2013-09-19 15:17:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Barzai Mekhar
Harry Forever wrote:

the only problem other MMO face with arenas is that arenas reveal that their metagame is crap because nobody wants to play it anymore... EvEs metagame is sound, thats why people will keep playing it


Sooooo.... when my guild in SWTOR had queuetimes upwards of one hour because on a server with 5000 active players, only three full groups queued up for the ranked battlegrounds, the problem wasn't that the arena system sucked but that the rest of the game sucked? Or when a few years back 8 million people played WoW but when you entered the arena you were instantly matched against high ranked enemies because low-ranked enemies just didn't bother to play?

Harry Forever wrote:

I'm destroying goonswarm

*cough* Well, there goes my coffee, thanks for that Smile