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[Payment Option] Bitcoins. Yes. Bitcoins

Author
Dr0000 Maulerant
Union Nanide and Tooling
#21 - 2013-09-08 23:33:42 UTC
DrysonBennington wrote:
Bitcoins sound like an underworld form of currency that can be exploited for the amount of information that is collected through their use.

Information that can then be sold to third parties such as hackers who could then use the information of where the Bitcoin has traveled to launch worldwide Internet attacks similar to Sky Net.
.



Replying to a stealth "nerf the terminator" post.

Tell me again about how every playstyle you dont engage in "doesn't require any effort" and everyone who does it needs to die in a fire. Be sure to mention about how you tried it once but it was too easy/boring/ethnic-homophobic slur. 

Jasmine Jensen
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#22 - 2013-09-09 09:57:11 UTC
DrysonBennington wrote:
Bitcoins sound like an underworld form of currency that can be exploited for the amount of information that is collected through their use.

Information that can then be sold to third parties such as hackers who could then use the information of where the Bitcoin has traveled to launch worldwide Internet attacks similar to Sky Net.

If the government regulates Bitcoin use then sure but not unless the digital currency is regulated by a higher institution that could be tracked and controlled by Federal Regulatory Agencies.

Bitcoins are the currency of the hacker.


The hacker is not a bad person. An underground currency is meerly just an alternative to the worthless paper dollars that the 'higher institutions' put forward.

No personal information has to be gathered by using bitcoins, I have no idea where you got that information. In all my time mining and trading bitcoins nobody on the network is able to get my credit card information, personal information or the like.

Also hackers do not use private information. They're the ones that get information then sell it. Hackers have no use for your address or your maiden name.

The government regulating yet another thing is something that I could really do without. The establishments of today are extremely centralized and want to control 'all the things' ala communism but want to give their people the idea that they are operating as a republic (I do reference the united states here.)

Bitcoin is already regulated by itself by the fact that it is decentralized and in control by the people who use it, which is how all good things start. It's only when someone's a greedy ******* when you require a centralized government.
Jasmine Jensen
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#23 - 2013-09-09 10:04:10 UTC
RubyPorto wrote:

The first couple people in "on the ground floor" have hoards of bitcoins because of the ease by which the initial mining generated them. The "value" of the coin is entirely dependent on them not dumping their hoards to cash out.



You're claiming that the value of bitcoins rests on their continued inflation? That's a hell of a claim.



Fine, pyramid or airplane scheme.


The first couple people on the ground floor are basically living off of their profits for having faith in a new system. They are responsible for not dumping all their coins and crashing the value which I really appreciate. They respect the system that made them rich, and they do not want to destroy it because they believed in bitcoin since day 1.

Bitcoin doesn't rest on continued inflation, I'm saying that the inflation is controlled. Bitcoin has a static output of new currency being 'printed' that's very moderate and stable, whereas the Weimar Republic sort of just printed as much as they could because they were in massive war debts and having political issues with communism.

The value of bitcoin as always rests on the willingness for people to use it as a method of trade, which is the case for any currency whether it be gold and silver, or a fake currency like Dollars or Rubles.

Gold maintains value because there is a finite amount of it in the world. The same goes for bitcoin. There will be no more bitcoins produced somewhere around 2045. There also will be an end to gold mining, because eventually we will not be able to mine any gold.

This is not true for establishment currency, where they can print off as many dollars as quickly as they want whenever they want which pretty much makes the actual value of the currency null, and we only assign it a value when it's true value is nonexistant.
Jasmine Jensen
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#24 - 2013-09-09 10:09:46 UTC
Dr0000 Maulerant wrote:
Look, I'm not saying all bitcoin hacks are because of technical errors. The vast majority are due to stupidity and greed. When you make currency crypto-digital, and don't have the risk mitigating practices of a large bank there will be losses from attacks, scams, and exchanges doing really dumb things.

Whether or not you think it's a ponzi scheme or any other type of unstable does not matter, since CCP can accept it as payment without ever holding stake in the currency itself. Anchor it to the euro and have an exchange perform the B to € before sending plex.


Well do you think that your paper currency is any more safe? Most of those hacks can also be seen as bank robberies or just people being greedy like you say.

However, hacking or exploiting the actual blockchain is very secure, where only 2 instances of the blockchain being compromised have been recorded.

Don't try and use that argument against me when we all know well that paypal gets hacked thousands of times a day, and credit cards, ATM machines are hacked hundreds of thousands of times a day.

Bitcoin wallets and trading platforms have been relatively safe to real world alternatives.

Also you don't have to deal with paypal being a bastard and freezing your funds all the time.
Mallak Azaria
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#25 - 2013-09-09 11:14:28 UTC
Jasmine Jensen wrote:
Don't try and use that argument against me when we all know well that paypal gets hacked thousands of times a day, and credit cards, ATM machines are hacked hundreds of thousands of times a day.

Bitcoin wallets and trading platforms have been relatively safe to real world alternatives.


Except when the bank is hacked & my money is stolen it gets replaced by the bank, whereas if your buttcoins are stolen they're gone.

This post was lovingly crafted by a member of the Goonwaffe Posting Cabal, proud member of the popular gay hookup site somethingawful.com, Spelling Bee, Grammar Gestapo & #1 Official Gevlon Goblin Fanclub member.

Girly'girl
Bitcoin Hegemony
#26 - 2013-09-09 15:39:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Girly'girl
Mallak Azaria wrote:
Except when the bank is hacked & my money is stolen it gets replaced by the bank, whereas if your buttcoins are stolen they're gone.


The security of a bank deposit is simply a form of insurance. The same thing can be achieved with bitcoins just as well, there can be a Bitcoin bank that offers that service. Entities that are almost like banks already exist in the Bitcoin economy.

The difference with Bitcoin is that you have the choice to own your own money. Money at the bank is not your money, it's money that you have access to. With Bitcoin you can actually own the money, and it can be backed up so that even if you somehow lose the money, you can get it back.

Obviously if you're careless enough to lose unencrypted Bitcoin private keys, then you're in trouble. It's not too difficult to safely store your bitcoins though, in paper wallets for example. Only keep small amounts in wallets that are not as secure, such as smartphone wallets. The same rule applies to keeping cash in a physical wallet.

Bitcoin Hegemony is recruiting. We're a cryptocurrency endorsing corp focused on PvP. Both newbies and veterans accepted.

Girly'girl
Bitcoin Hegemony
#27 - 2013-09-09 15:41:11 UTC
As for the topic in question, CCP should definitely add Bitcoin as a payment option. It's a perfect match. There are plenty of Bitcoin aware players in Eve and it's a superior payment method, so why not? It's likely also cheaper for CCP than the current alternatives.

Bitcoin Hegemony is recruiting. We're a cryptocurrency endorsing corp focused on PvP. Both newbies and veterans accepted.

RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#28 - 2013-09-09 15:59:03 UTC  |  Edited by: RubyPorto
Girly'girl wrote:
The security of a bank deposit is simply a form of insurance. The same thing can be achieved with bitcoins just as well, there can be a Bitcoin bank that offers that service. Entities that are almost like banks already exist in the Bitcoin economy.


When was the last time your bank manager called you up and said "Hey, so the bank's closing and you're not getting your money back?" Please point me to a "bank" that provides Bitcoin Deposit insurance through a reputable insurer.



Anyway, become an authorized GTC seller, and I'm sure you're free to accept whatever shady form of payment you want.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon

Sergeant Acht Scultz
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#29 - 2013-09-09 17:20:31 UTC
Mallak Azaria wrote:
Jasmine Jensen wrote:
Don't try and use that argument against me when we all know well that paypal gets hacked thousands of times a day, and credit cards, ATM machines are hacked hundreds of thousands of times a day.

Bitcoin wallets and trading platforms have been relatively safe to real world alternatives.


Except when the bank is hacked & my money is stolen it gets replaced by the bank, whereas if your buttcoins are stolen they're gone.



Not really.

Your bank for sure is insured by another bank etc for the real amount they have, however if they go pouf like Leman&Brothers you can ask all of those who lost all their life work what do they think about what you just said.

Your bank, will not reimburse you whatever penny if they're bankrupt, no insurance on planet earth will reimburse you the money or stocks your bank kept before going bankrupt, your government it self will never replace or make so you'll get any of said lost "money" or value.
All you're left when your bank goes bankrupt is your eyes and wet feeling of your tears flowing down your jaw while those who spend all their life making you believe you were a winner by trusting them will most probably be laughing drinking nice cocktails at the swimming pool with the nice looking blonde they just got with your money.

Blink

removed inappropriate ASCII art signature - CCP Eterne

Elizabeth Aideron
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#30 - 2013-09-09 17:35:28 UTC
Sergeant Acht Scultz wrote:
Mallak Azaria wrote:
Jasmine Jensen wrote:
Don't try and use that argument against me when we all know well that paypal gets hacked thousands of times a day, and credit cards, ATM machines are hacked hundreds of thousands of times a day.

Bitcoin wallets and trading platforms have been relatively safe to real world alternatives.


Except when the bank is hacked & my money is stolen it gets replaced by the bank, whereas if your buttcoins are stolen they're gone.



Not really.

Your bank for sure is insured by another bank etc for the real amount they have, however if they go pouf like Leman&Brothers you can ask all of those who lost all their life work what do they think about what you just said.

Your bank, will not reimburse you whatever penny if they're bankrupt, no insurance on planet earth will reimburse you the money or stocks your bank kept before going bankrupt, your government it self will never replace or make so you'll get any of said lost "money" or value.
All you're left when your bank goes bankrupt is your eyes and wet feeling of your tears flowing down your jaw while those who spend all their life making you believe you were a winner by trusting them will most probably be laughing drinking nice cocktails at the swimming pool with the nice looking blonde they just got with your money.

Blink


Most countries have deposit insurance...
Elizabeth Aideron
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#31 - 2013-09-09 17:38:33 UTC
Guys real IRL banks are totally bad and dumb now let me tell you about bitcoin exchanges that are routinely "hacked" or have their assets seized.
Girly'girl
Bitcoin Hegemony
#32 - 2013-09-10 07:20:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Girly'girl
Elizabeth Aideron wrote:
Guys real IRL banks are totally bad and dumb now let me tell you about bitcoin exchanges that are routinely "hacked" or have their assets seized.



Routinely hacked is a strong statement, I think it's better to go through the hacks in detail. The hacks were more common before and starting to get less common now, as security of the exchanges has been ramped up.


Mt. Gox (largest exchange) was hacked once in 2011, did not result in losses for users.

Bitstamp (2nd largest, most reliable) never been hacked.

BTC China (3rd largest) never been hacked.

BTC-E (4th largest) never been hacked.

LocalBitcoins (a massive OTC trading platform) never been hacked.

BitFloor (once a large US exchange) hacked seriously, although users got mostly reimbursed in this case as well.

As far I know the only exchange hack where users lost serious money was Bitcoinica. And Bitcoinica was a shady platform for speculative trading. So there you go.


Bitcoin itself, never been hacked. It's the security of everything else that has been an issue, although a diminishing one. Asset seizure has been a problem for Gox but it's about US regulation & Gox, not a Bitcoin issue per se.


Finally, all of this is irrelevant for adding Bitcoin as a payment method. CCP can use a merchant service such as Bitpay or Coinbase to accept bitcoins without even touching bitcoins themselves. The service will send them fiat money instead. By doing this they have no exchange rate volatility risk either.

Bitcoin Hegemony is recruiting. We're a cryptocurrency endorsing corp focused on PvP. Both newbies and veterans accepted.

Little Dragon Khamez
Guardians of the Underworld
#33 - 2013-09-10 08:14:45 UTC
DrysonBennington wrote:
Bitcoins sound like an underworld form of currency that can be exploited for the amount of information that is collected through their use.

Information that can then be sold to third parties such as hackers who could then use the information of where the Bitcoin has traveled to launch worldwide Internet attacks similar to Sky Net.

If the government regulates Bitcoin use then sure but not unless the digital currency is regulated by a higher institution that could be tracked and controlled by Federal Regulatory Agencies.

Bitcoins are the currency of the hacker.


The government is incapable of regulating itself or indeed any markets, if they were capable the 1% wouldn't have so much wealth, by skimming it of the backs of hard working people. If the government had any regulatory power at all none of our banks would have been allowed to wind up on corporate welfare. Bitcoin is an independent currency and not the domain of any one governmen, so who would do the regulating? It belongs to everyone who participates in it regardless of nationality. It pisses of the banks which is why the government don't like it. Because we all know whose really in charge and it isnt one of our heads of state.

Dumbing down of Eve Online will result in it's destruction...

Little Dragon Khamez
Guardians of the Underworld
#34 - 2013-09-10 08:16:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Little Dragon Khamez
Double posted oops...

Dumbing down of Eve Online will result in it's destruction...

suid0
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#35 - 2013-09-10 08:24:43 UTC
Is this because you can't use bots in game to farm isk to pay your account? so you'd like to use bots outside of game to farm bitcoins to pay your account?

Terrible idea...

the entire enemy support fleet is dead except for one interdictor a titan could easily finish off with drones  - Commander Ted

Ix Method
Doomheim
#36 - 2013-09-10 08:55:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Ix Method
Girly'girl wrote:
Finally, all of this is irrelevant for adding Bitcoin as a payment method. CCP can use a merchant service such as Bitpay or Coinbase to accept bitcoins without even touching bitcoins themselves. The service will send them fiat money instead.

So pay the costs of exchanging your subscription into real money for... why? No one has really said why this is a good idea beyond Bitcoin new shiny woo.

Travelling at the speed of love.

Girly'girl
Bitcoin Hegemony
#37 - 2013-09-10 09:51:01 UTC
Ix Method wrote:
Girly'girl wrote:
Finally, all of this is irrelevant for adding Bitcoin as a payment method. CCP can use a merchant service such as Bitpay or Coinbase to accept bitcoins without even touching bitcoins themselves. The service will send them fiat money instead.

So pay the costs of exchanging your subscription into real money for... why? No one has really said why this is a good idea beyond Bitcoin new shiny woo.


I don't understand the first sentence at all. Please clarify what you mean.

Adding Bitcoin as an alternative payment method is a good idea because CCP can make more money that way, and keep players happier. Plain and simple.

Paying for anything online with a credit/debit card nowadays is absolutely ridiculous. It's an ancient and horrible payment method. Have you actually tried paying for stuff with Bitcoin? It's so much easier.

This is not just about Bitcoin being superior currency to the national alternatives, it's also a more convenient online payment method. On top of this it's actually cheaper for CCP to accept bitcoins for subs than to accept credit card payments for subs, which means they would make more money per sub.

Not only this, the marketing boost would be insane. The Bitcoin community (which is over 1 million strong nowadays) would be all over this. It would be in news everywhere if Eve subs could be payed with Bitcoin. Leading again to more subs.

So, overall CCP has nothing to lose by doing this and is plain and simple losing money by not doing it.

Bitcoin Hegemony is recruiting. We're a cryptocurrency endorsing corp focused on PvP. Both newbies and veterans accepted.

Sgt Ocker
What Corp is it
#38 - 2013-09-10 10:26:14 UTC
Jasmine Jensen wrote:
Tarn Kugisa wrote:
you could run a miner and rat for your sub at the same time
+1

it should be set on a more stable currency, like USD or GBP, then converted using some special math


Bitcoins is tied to the value of the USD, and is always traded in terms of such.

One BTC is worth about 145$ USD right now if I remember correctly. BTC doesn't stand on it's own in terms of value.

It's value is also going up. I made I think about 50$ even when I wasn't mining because the price jumped up the past few days.

Yes the value is going up but due to the instability / legality of the currency - some not so legal activities are and will continue to plague it - I'd be surprised to see CCP take it up as a payment option. Looking at some of the places bitcoins are used would I think, also be a deterrent.

I accidentally did very well out of bitcoins, purchased 500 close to 3 years ago and the reason I purchased them did not come to fruition. They subsequently sat in my wallet untouched (forgotten) until 3 weeks ago, when I happened across an article about bitcoins.
It goes without saying, my bad memory has reaped a nice reward.

My opinions are mine.

  If you don't like them or disagree with me that's OK.- - - - - - Just don't bother Hating - I don't care

It really is getting harder and harder to justify $23 a month for each sub.

Girly'girl
Bitcoin Hegemony
#39 - 2013-09-10 10:59:17 UTC
Sgt Ocker wrote:
Yes the value is going up but due to the instability / legality of the currency - some not so legal activities are and will continue to plague it - I'd be surprised to see CCP take it up as a payment option. Looking at some of the places bitcoins are used would I think, also be a deterrent.


What we need is a plague that wipes out idiots from the face of the earth.

Blaming Bitcoin for its black market use is the same as blaming the dollar for all the numerous illegal activities done with them. It's not bitcoins or dollars doing those things, it's people.

Based on global studies approximately 20% of global economic activity is in the shadow economy. It ranges from 10% in the least shadowy countries to 50% in more shadowy countries. The level of corruption in a country partially determines this as well.

The Bitcoin economy does not, by any means, have a higher percentage of shadowy activity than the real world. There is nothing backing that claim up.

In addition, I have not seen any Bitcoin accepting service (the largest being WordPress, Reddit, Namecheap, Humble Bundle) getting bad press from accepting Bitcoin. On the contrary, they have got a significant amount of positive publicity. In Reddit approximately 3% of Reddit Gold subs are payed with Bitcoin right now.


Bitcoin Hegemony is recruiting. We're a cryptocurrency endorsing corp focused on PvP. Both newbies and veterans accepted.

Girly'girl
Bitcoin Hegemony
#40 - 2013-09-10 11:01:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Girly'girl
As far as instability or currency volatility is concerned, that can be an issue for a merchant if the merchant accepts bitcoins directly, but that is not necessary since you can use a service that handles that and takes the risk.

It's not really high risk to accept them directly either though, the expected volume of Bitcoin payments is perhaps 2% at this time.

That is such a portion from total sales that taking the volatility risk shouldn't be a problem for the business. Maybe just keep all of it as bitcoins as an investment. That can work out well, bitcoins have pretty much been the best investment in the world for years now, after all.

Bitcoin Hegemony is recruiting. We're a cryptocurrency endorsing corp focused on PvP. Both newbies and veterans accepted.

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