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So this is it for eve, is this the future, is it?

First post
Author
Khemax
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#81 - 2013-08-28 11:45:39 UTC
At the end of the day it is all about passive income....that is why the goons biatches take all the systems.

It is simple get rid of ALL passive income form the game and all these territories would not be taken. It would cost them to fight to protect their territories, and then they would have to generate some sort of income in the meantime. The gewns have got this sussed, they don't even do the majority of fighting all their biatches do it for them, then they send in some equipment and roll in the profits laughing all the way to the bank.
At the moment they make far more isk then they spend so they can afford to replace entire lost fleets at the alliances expense. And because of the death mechanics when or if this fleet dies they just reship into more ships and roll out again creating a wave like effect.
Like the sea it will always win because it is never ending.....there will always be another wave behind the next one.

Cut out the passive income and it will stop these blobs repeatedly coming at you, because people would actually have to stop and play the game.

But this will never happen because CCP is so far up the gewns they can lick their tonsils. CCP doesn't run this game gewns do and the big alliances roll over and take whatever crap they are told to do. Until this changes this game will continue to stagnate.

CCP you want to know why your player base is relatively stable but rarely has a large jump in new members....It is simple you don't control the game, and the people that do make it their task in life to make the game unpleasant for newbies.
This game has so much potential but it is ruined by lack of control.
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#82 - 2013-08-28 11:46:32 UTC
JinSanJong wrote:
Fredfredbug4 wrote:
The alliances that hold the sov have worked hard and often had to fight another alliance for that sov. As long as they own it, they should be allowed to use the space however they want, even if it means renting it out. It's just like a real estate business. The people selling a piece of property to you don't necessarily have to be using it (that's probably why they are selling/renting it out in the first place).

The alliance renting out their space makes money, and the renters are able to live in nullsec without being tied down to said alliances. They an move in and do what they need/want to do for as long as they can pay for it. It's a win-win for everyone.

If an alliance doesn't want to rent out their space, they don't have to. Simple.


this is a game btw, just pointing that out. So shall we now put in the eve trailers. "Eve is no longer a sandbox, your game is controlled by others sorry, if you want to go into nullsec, just kiss someones ass, pay stupid amount of isk for even the worse systems, these are thew new microtransactions, oh but we still expect your monthly fee. Play on one server, but remember the players that have been playing for years have control of everything and you wont have the same level playing field as they did when only 3000 ppl ws online"

i mean lets be honest here...whilst we are at it.


You're actually serious, aren't you, that you think everyone should just have open access to premium real estate from day one. But if you think sov was claimed without anyone having to fight for it, you'd be sorely mistaken. You want it? Go take it, or die trying. As a player that spent a few weeks in sov without renting in my first year, I'm telling you now it's not impossible for new players to get out there, it just takes work. Renting would just make it more accessible, not less.

But if you're just talking about access to nulsec on the whole, then there is plenty of NPC nul to settle in. You can't claim it as your own, but you can pretend it's your own and blow up anyone else that enters.

Sov is earned. Even if it's rented, it's still earned. If you want the rewards, you have to put in the work. That's what makes EVE a sandbox. If you want to claim your own space for your own sandcastle, you're going to have to fight for it, or pay for it.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104

JinSanJong
Doomheim
#83 - 2013-08-28 11:48:54 UTC
Remiel Pollard wrote:
JinSanJong wrote:
Fredfredbug4 wrote:
The alliances that hold the sov have worked hard and often had to fight another alliance for that sov. As long as they own it, they should be allowed to use the space however they want, even if it means renting it out. It's just like a real estate business. The people selling a piece of property to you don't necessarily have to be using it (that's probably why they are selling/renting it out in the first place).

The alliance renting out their space makes money, and the renters are able to live in nullsec without being tied down to said alliances. They an move in and do what they need/want to do for as long as they can pay for it. It's a win-win for everyone.

If an alliance doesn't want to rent out their space, they don't have to. Simple.


this is a game btw, just pointing that out. So shall we now put in the eve trailers. "Eve is no longer a sandbox, your game is controlled by others sorry, if you want to go into nullsec, just kiss someones ass, pay stupid amount of isk for even the worse systems, these are thew new microtransactions, oh but we still expect your monthly fee. Play on one server, but remember the players that have been playing for years have control of everything and you wont have the same level playing field as they did when only 3000 ppl ws online"

i mean lets be honest here...whilst we are at it.


You're actually serious, aren't you, that you think everyone should just have open access to premium real estate from day one. But if you think sov was claimed without anyone having to fight for it, you'd be sorely mistaken. You want it? Go take it, or die trying. As a player that spent a few weeks in sov without renting in my first year, I'm telling you now it's not impossible for new players to get out there, it just takes work. Renting would just make it more accessible, not less.

But if you're just talking about access to nulsec on the whole, then there is plenty of NPC nul to settle in. You can't claim it as your own, but you can pretend it's your own and blow up anyone else that enters.

Sov is earned. Even if it's rented, it's still earned. If you want the rewards, you have to put in the work. That's what makes EVE a sandbox. If you want to claim your own space for your own sandcastle, you're going to have to fight for it, or pay for it.


So you believe that the player today as the EXACT same level playing field as players from 5-10 years ago? Because they don't FAR from it
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#84 - 2013-08-28 11:53:05 UTC
JinSanJong wrote:

So you believe that the player today as the EXACT same level playing field as players from 5-10 years ago? Because they don't FAR from it

What can't you do that you could do 10 years ago*?

*excluding stuff that has since been designated unacceptable by CCP and removed from the game

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack

Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#85 - 2013-08-28 12:00:53 UTC
JinSanJong wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:
JinSanJong wrote:
Fredfredbug4 wrote:
The alliances that hold the sov have worked hard and often had to fight another alliance for that sov. As long as they own it, they should be allowed to use the space however they want, even if it means renting it out. It's just like a real estate business. The people selling a piece of property to you don't necessarily have to be using it (that's probably why they are selling/renting it out in the first place).

The alliance renting out their space makes money, and the renters are able to live in nullsec without being tied down to said alliances. They an move in and do what they need/want to do for as long as they can pay for it. It's a win-win for everyone.

If an alliance doesn't want to rent out their space, they don't have to. Simple.


this is a game btw, just pointing that out. So shall we now put in the eve trailers. "Eve is no longer a sandbox, your game is controlled by others sorry, if you want to go into nullsec, just kiss someones ass, pay stupid amount of isk for even the worse systems, these are thew new microtransactions, oh but we still expect your monthly fee. Play on one server, but remember the players that have been playing for years have control of everything and you wont have the same level playing field as they did when only 3000 ppl ws online"

i mean lets be honest here...whilst we are at it.


You're actually serious, aren't you, that you think everyone should just have open access to premium real estate from day one. But if you think sov was claimed without anyone having to fight for it, you'd be sorely mistaken. You want it? Go take it, or die trying. As a player that spent a few weeks in sov without renting in my first year, I'm telling you now it's not impossible for new players to get out there, it just takes work. Renting would just make it more accessible, not less.

But if you're just talking about access to nulsec on the whole, then there is plenty of NPC nul to settle in. You can't claim it as your own, but you can pretend it's your own and blow up anyone else that enters.

Sov is earned. Even if it's rented, it's still earned. If you want the rewards, you have to put in the work. That's what makes EVE a sandbox. If you want to claim your own space for your own sandcastle, you're going to have to fight for it, or pay for it.


So you believe that the player today as the EXACT same level playing field as players from 5-10 years ago? Because they don't FAR from it


Welp, it's not nor has it ever been about how even the playing field is. It's about how even you make it. But if you are suggesting someone who has barely started the game should be evenly matched against someone who has spent years carefully and studiously learning its breaks and nuances, then you are only deceiving yourself. But believe it or not, it is relatively easy for a new player to get into nul. I have a mate that I introduced to the game back in November last year. He's been in sov since December. I spent the last three of my first twelve months in sov and I'd barely pulled a few mil SP at the time. In case you haven't noticed, EVE is a social game, and the impressions you make are all about attitude. So it's little wonder you're complaining about sov being too hard, because your attitude is **** poor.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104

Benny Ohu
Chaotic Tranquility
#86 - 2013-08-28 12:01:03 UTC
Khemax wrote:
At the end of the day it is all about passive income....that is why the goons biatches take all the systems.

It is simple get rid of ALL passive income form the game and all these territories would not be taken. It would cost them to fight to protect their territories, and then they would have to generate some sort of income in the meantime. The gewns have got this sussed, they don't even do the majority of fighting all their biatches do it for them, then they send in some equipment and roll in the profits laughing all the way to the bank.
At the moment they make far more isk then they spend so they can afford to replace entire lost fleets at the alliances expense. And because of the death mechanics when or if this fleet dies they just reship into more ships and roll out again creating a wave like effect.
Like the sea it will always win because it is never ending.....there will always be another wave behind the next one.

Cut out the passive income and it will stop these blobs repeatedly coming at you, because people would actually have to stop and play the game.

But this will never happen because CCP is so far up the gewns they can lick their tonsils. CCP doesn't run this game gewns do and the big alliances roll over and take whatever crap they are told to do. Until this changes this game will continue to stagnate.

CCP you want to know why your player base is relatively stable but rarely has a large jump in new members....It is simple you don't control the game, and the people that do make it their task in life to make the game unpleasant for newbies.
This game has so much potential but it is ruined by lack of control.

sov doesn't award passive income, just bills
Harry Forever
SpaceJunkys
#87 - 2013-08-28 12:01:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Harry Forever
William Walker wrote:
Harry, you should go into highsec and rally all the carebears, all of them, from all the realms and unite them in one conquest for glory. Unite them in great numbers, to rain down upon the nullsec coalitions and crush them with the weight of your ships!

What is that you say? Hypocrisy? Of course not! It is an entirely different matter if the highsec warbears unite, than a bunch of nullsec carebears with their sov, don't you agree Harry? Oh King of Highsec, protector of the 4 realms, enlighten us as to how real PVP looks. I think you said it yourself most poignantly:

"Le Harry Foreverface" wrote:
I did not join anybody out there because it just reduces the amount of enemies

You don't want friends, you don't want to unite anyone, you just want everyone to hate you and shoot at you. You claim it is injustice, only to garner... sympathy? I am not sure. More enemies to shoot? Rest assured Harry Forever, at this rate you will have your way. You will win, your way.


true gamers don't go out there, because nothing is happening in nullsec... you all think its because they are carebears, but the reason is, there is no gameplay going on out there, you just dock if more enemies are coming, I have seen it numerous times, its your tacktic some people told me, you just dock to assure not more people are coming, you make the game boring in your SoV space on purpose, to assure you don't get a problem

high sec never will go there, they prefer playing a game, doing missions, incursions or trading... you nullbears are the problem, you always have been... you don't fight eachother and you don't fight others... no issue with your big fights every few month, but the day to day dynamic out there is just zero... the dynamic in highsec is ok, just check the map, because things are happening there

like I said, nullsec = retirement club

maybe you all wait for the attack orders from your leaders, but those are long gone who knows... yea I want you to hate me, to make the game at least a bit exciting out there... 10-20 people camping the gate just for me, that was fun the other day... jump with your titan fleet on me, just do something! if you are scared to fight other corps and just hugg eachother in the CFC, no problem chase me instead, at least i get the kick I need
Elizabeth Aideron
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#88 - 2013-08-28 12:05:40 UTC
actually i think retirement club is in lowsec now
Bi-Mi Lansatha
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#89 - 2013-08-28 12:06:09 UTC
JinSanJong wrote:
...So you believe that the player today as the EXACT same level playing field as players from 5-10 years ago? Because they don't FAR from it

"Level playing field". Is that code for fair?
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#90 - 2013-08-28 12:06:13 UTC
Harry Forever wrote:
William Walker wrote:
Harry, you should go into highsec and rally all the carebears, all of them, from all the realms and unite them in one conquest for glory. Unite them in great numbers, to rain down upon the nullsec coalitions and crush them with the weight of your ships!

What is that you say? Hypocrisy? Of course not! It is an entirely different matter if the highsec warbears unite, than a bunch of nullsec carebears with their sov, don't you agree Harry? Oh King of Highsec, protector of the 4 realms, enlighten us as to how real PVP looks. I think you said it yourself most poignantly:

"Le Harry Foreverface" wrote:
I did not join anybody out there because it just reduces the amount of enemies

You don't want friends, you don't want to unite anyone, you just want everyone to hate you and shoot at you. You claim it is injustice, only to garner... sympathy? I am not sure. More enemies to shoot? Rest assured Harry Forever, at this rate you will have your way. You will win, your way.


true gamers don't go out there, because nothing is happening in nullsec... you all think its because they are carebears, but the reason is, there is no gameplay going on out there, you just dock if more enemies are coming, I have seen it numerous times, its your tacktic some people told me, you just dock to assure not more people are coming, you make the game boring in your SoV space on purpose, to assure you don't get a problem

high sec never will go there, they prefer playing a game, doing missions, incursions or trading... you nullbears are the problem, you always have been... you don't fight eachother and you don't fight others... no issue with your big fights every few month, but the day to day dynamic out there is just zero... the dynamic in highsec is ok, just check the map, because things are happening there

like I said, nullsec = retirement club

maybe you all wait for the attack orders from your leaders, but those are long gone who knows... yea I want you to hate me, to make the game at least a bit of exciting out there... 10-20 people camping the gate just for me, that was fun the other day... jump with your titan fleet on me, just do something! if you are scared to fight other corps and just hugg eachother in the CFC, no problem chase me instead, at least i get the kick I need


Aww, Harry. Nobody ever really actually hates the village idiot.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104

William Walker
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#91 - 2013-08-28 12:22:49 UTC
Harry Forever wrote:
true gamers don't go out there, because nothing is happening in nullsec...

So, all the true, elite, gamers are in highsec and all the losers, antisocial, incapable of playing the game are in nullsec? They aren't playing? Then why are they in nullsec?

Harry Forever wrote:
high sec never will go there, they prefer playing a game, doing missions, incursions or trading...

Ah yes, playing a game:
Doing missions, which you can do in nullsec.
Incursions, you can do in nullsec.
Trading, you can do in nullsec.

Harry Forever wrote:
you nullbears are the problem, you always have been... you don't fight eachother and you don't fight others... no issue with your big fights every few month, but the day to day dynamic out there is just zero... the dynamic in highsec is ok, just check the map, because things are happening there

But we do fight each other, all the time. Literally, all the time. Anytime two people who have no standings to each other shoot at each other, all the time. Every day, probably ever hour, of every given day. Always. Highsec is dynamic? It is the most static place in all of EVE. There are no dynamics in highsec. At all. Do you think highsec warriors would undock their 5 billion navy fit ravens if there was no concord?

Harry Forever wrote:
maybe you all wait for the attack orders from your leaders, but those are long gone who knows...

They are alive and well actually. Just yesterday there was the order for a large coalition of players, around 30.000 guys, you might have heard of them, to invade another region. It's called Delve. It's in nullsec.

Harry Forever wrote:
yea I want you to hate me, to make the game at least a bit exciting out there... 10-20 people camping the gate just for me, that was fun the other day...

EC-P8R is always camped, for everyone. All the time. Look at the system description.

ヽ(⌒∇⌒)ノ へ(゜∇、°)へ (◕‿◕✿)

JinSanJong
Doomheim
#92 - 2013-08-28 12:24:05 UTC
Bi-Mi Lansatha wrote:
JinSanJong wrote:
...So you believe that the player today as the EXACT same level playing field as players from 5-10 years ago? Because they don't FAR from it

"Level playing field". Is that code for fair?


Ah right so your saying people who pay the same subscription shouldn't get the same chances and opportunities?
I guess that's why we have droves of new players staying in the game.. Oh wait

I guess that the selfish attitude we come to expect
Mayhaw Morgan
State War Academy
Caldari State
#93 - 2013-08-28 12:25:45 UTC
Bi-Mi Lansatha wrote:
What one man Corp do you belong to that holds sovereignty?

This is my only character. You can see that I am not in a one-man corp.
I find it ironic that a renter would challenge me to tell him what I have sovereignty over. I have sovereignty over myself. I think that's more than you can say.

Sgt Doakes XD wrote:
What's wrong with renting? it means a ton of people are active, and thus targets.
There won't be a "big blue donut" for long because all power and prosperity is relative.


Justify it however you want, but we can all see pretty clearly what is happening and why. Renters are greedy for space wealth and are willing to surrender their dignity to get at it. It's a lot easier to pay an overlord to occupy your space for you than to fight for it yourself. If the overlord had any respect for his renters, he'd make them members of his corp or alliance. If the renters had any self-respect, there are many other options than paying an overlord half their lunch money to let them eat in peace. The saddest part is that you don't even get to eat in peace, since anyone can still come and camp your system.

Renters are basically slaves, and by choice.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#94 - 2013-08-28 12:26:14 UTC
JinSanJong wrote:
Ah right so your saying people who pay the same subscription shouldn't get the same chances and opportunities?
Everyone has the same chances and opportunities.

That is something very different from the game being “fair”, since one of the opportunities people take at the earliest convenience is to ensure that the game isn't fair for the other party of a conflict.
Din Chao
#95 - 2013-08-28 12:27:50 UTC
Cool. A true Marxist thread!
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#96 - 2013-08-28 12:28:51 UTC
JinSanJong wrote:
Bi-Mi Lansatha wrote:
JinSanJong wrote:
...So you believe that the player today as the EXACT same level playing field as players from 5-10 years ago? Because they don't FAR from it

"Level playing field". Is that code for fair?


Ah right so your saying people who pay the same subscription shouldn't get the same chances and opportunities?
I guess that's why we have droves of new players staying in the game.. Oh wait

I guess that the selfish attitude we come to expect


Silly, the same opportunities do exist for everyone, including the opportunity to fight for your own slice of sov. Go get it, kiddo.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104

Sgt Doakes XD
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#97 - 2013-08-28 12:30:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Sgt Doakes XD
Harry Forever, are you even playing the same game I am?
Look up ships destroyed on the map and it proves you wrong.
Also, watch Kil2's videos. That guy would never get fights if there wasn't a lot of gameplay in nullsec, lol.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#98 - 2013-08-28 12:30:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
JinSanJong wrote:
Bi-Mi Lansatha wrote:
JinSanJong wrote:
...So you believe that the player today as the EXACT same level playing field as players from 5-10 years ago? Because they don't FAR from it

"Level playing field". Is that code for fair?


Ah right so your saying people who pay the same subscription shouldn't get the same chances and opportunities?
I guess that's why we have droves of new players staying in the game.. Oh wait

I guess that the selfish attitude we come to expect

They do have access to the same opportunities and chances, but they have to actually do something to take advantage of them. It's nobodies fault but their own if they're too damn lazy to do so.

CCP aren't going to give you a cookie for subscribing, they'll show you where the ingredients are and expect you to steal them and then make your own cookie.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack

Bi-Mi Lansatha
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#99 - 2013-08-28 12:32:45 UTC
JinSanJong wrote:

Ah right so your saying people who pay the same subscription shouldn't get the same chances and opportunities?
I guess that's why we have droves of new players staying in the game.. Oh wait

I guess that the selfish attitude we come to expect
What chances and opportunities are you being denied?
Din Chao
#100 - 2013-08-28 12:34:09 UTC
JinSanJong wrote:
...So you believe that the player today as the EXACT same level playing field as players from 5-10 years ago? Because they don't FAR from it

You're right, the fact that I was born in the U.S. totally ruined my chances of being the King of Spain. That's not a level playing field!!!