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Warfare & Tactics

 
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Tech 2 weapons really are better

Author
Chancey Pants
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#41 - 2013-08-27 12:14:38 UTC

"And before anyone ask why I didn't spot them on D-scan it was because I warped to the target when it was too far to detect them on D-scan. And they were sitting on the gate. And the reason why I warp directly to the gate is because if I don't and have to burn to the gate it gives the people in the site too long and they often warp out so I try to limit the ammount of time I'm in 1 au range so I have the best chance to engage"

So trying to understand what happened here. What I think you mean is you warped all the way to an accel gate without hitting scan at all, and landed on a gate only to find two hostiles who probably saw you coming. After you landed and by the time you realized what was going on you were pointed.

Alright well from now on I would recommend hitting scan a few times while in warp so you always know what's is in the general vicinity. Once you get in range of where you are landing point your camera in the direction your ship is headed and do a narrow scan of about 15-30 degrees. That way you will know what you are about to land on and can make the decision to stay and fight or run before you ever even land. That will offer a much better chance to escape if needed.

Also if you decide to stay and fight you should try to drop your scan range to very close right before you land. Then pound scan as much as possible while fighting to have a heads up if the person you are fighting is about to drop his whole gang on you.
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#42 - 2013-08-27 13:42:28 UTC
Of course t2 are better, most t2 things are better o.o

Its counterbalanced through increased fittings.

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

Thanatos Marathon
Moira.
#43 - 2013-08-27 15:50:48 UTC
all plexes are scannable using long range Dscan with a minimum of effort.
Paul Otichoda
Perkone
Caldari State
#44 - 2013-08-27 16:09:46 UTC
Chancey Pants wrote:

"And before anyone ask why I didn't spot them on D-scan it was because I warped to the target when it was too far to detect them on D-scan. And they were sitting on the gate. And the reason why I warp directly to the gate is because if I don't and have to burn to the gate it gives the people in the site too long and they often warp out so I try to limit the ammount of time I'm in 1 au range so I have the best chance to engage"

So trying to understand what happened here. What I think you mean is you warped all the way to an accel gate without hitting scan at all, and landed on a gate only to find two hostiles who probably saw you coming. After you landed and by the time you realized what was going on you were pointed.

Alright well from now on I would recommend hitting scan a few times while in warp so you always know what's is in the general vicinity. Once you get in range of where you are landing point your camera in the direction your ship is headed and do a narrow scan of about 15-30 degrees. That way you will know what you are about to land on and can make the decision to stay and fight or run before you ever even land. That will offer a much better chance to escape if needed.

Also if you decide to stay and fight you should try to drop your scan range to very close right before you land. Then pound scan as much as possible while fighting to have a heads up if the person you are fighting is about to drop his whole gang on you.


No I meant I warped to a FW plex that was 30au away from me while D-scan can only scan up to 14au (or so) and even if I detect something once I get into scan range there is nothing I can do about it until I come out of warp. Sometimes the enemy I don't want to fight is in plex and I can warp out. Other times they're sitting in the game and I die.

And I do use d-scan at lot.
Thanatos Marathon
Moira.
#45 - 2013-08-27 16:16:23 UTC
warp to a nearby celestial and scan from there.
Speedkermit Damo
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#46 - 2013-08-27 17:06:07 UTC
Paul Otichoda wrote:
Donbe Scurred wrote:
But I thought you didn't have time to train themRoll

In other news, the sky is blue and water is wet....


well I got around to it eventually. I also trained from overheating but it doesn't do much good because you still die too quickly,


Where are you based? because I'm really keen to come blow you up quite a lot.

Protect me from knowing what I don't need to know. Protect me from even knowing that there are things to know that I don't know. Protect me from knowing that I decided not to know about the things that I decided not to know about. Amen.

Inxentas Ultramar
Ultramar Independent Contracting
#47 - 2013-08-27 19:17:32 UTC
OP, the idea is that should you happen to fly the perfect counter against any given ship, you are going to win in a straight up 1vs1 situation. Should you happen to fly a ship that fairs well against the fit of the opponent, you might win. If your fit is balanced versus his, you are going to lose if he packs T2 equipment and you are not.

In paper-scissors-rock terms, T2 becomes a greater concern when scissors fights other scissors, but rock will steal beat them. Then again, even a rock will break if you hammer it with enough scissors. What I mean to say is that a certain hull/fit will make it damn hard for it's typical target to even hit it. In those situations it doesnt matter if you do 200 or 250 DPS, since those stats go through a percentual grinder (resistances) before even being applied anyway, and your opponent has a hard time even applying effective DPS against you.

Example: it doesnt matter if you are orbiting a T2 fitted artillery Tornado with a T2 fitted Jaguar or a T1 fitted Rifter. It's tracking is so bad at short range, the chance it will hit you at all is near-zero. The T1 Rifter will just take a bit longer to grind through it's tank, but ammo choice is more important then T2 guns. These typical sniper nado's (I hear they spawn on lowsec gates) are also fun to engage with destroyers, especially in a small gang.
Donbe Scurred
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#48 - 2013-08-27 20:54:34 UTC
Speedkermit Damo wrote:
Where are you based? because I'm really keen to come blow you up quite a lot.


He's been hanging out in and around black rise, last seen in Nennamaila.Blink
Cannibal Kane
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#49 - 2013-08-28 06:38:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Cannibal Kane
Not to mention with the amount of DPS a Neutron Fitted Harpy can put out. He could prolly pop you with 1 shot. Not to mention engaging with a shop meant for kiting under 10km range is a major nono.

And you can kill T2 frigates with T1 frigates. As with most things in EVE everything is dependent on both parties fittings and situation at the time of the engagement.

"Kane is the End Boss of Highsec." -Psychotic Monk

Lugia3
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#50 - 2013-08-28 09:38:05 UTC
Thank you for making this discovery that T2 weapons are better than T1 weapons. I never would have figured that out on my own without the help of Paul, the genius.

"CCP Dolan is full of shit." - CCP Bettik

Aesheera
Doomheim
#51 - 2013-08-28 10:27:34 UTC
Paul Otichoda wrote:
Myriad Blaze wrote:
Paul Otichoda wrote:

Also is there anyway for a standard frigate to be able to win lone fights against faction frigates/assault frigates/destroyers/cruisers?

Sure. Depends on your skills and fittings and friends and their skills and fittings and friends.

1 on 1 it might be hard. Actually I think it should be hard. Imagine you're the one flying the assault frigate... would you still think a 90dps Condor should have a good chance at killing you? Especially if the Condor is at a range that favors you?
The Harpy in the killmail you posted was fitted with T2 Light Neutron Blasters. With Void and overheated I would expect over 300dps if I let him get close. And considering its resists I would expect a strong tank - probably 12k EHP or more - with excellent resists against kinetic damage. Not impossible to beat with a Condor. Just really hard. As it should be, imho.


in pratical terms you can't win.

In other words if they have tech 2 frigates you can't beat it in a normal ship unless you have back up.

Bull.

I've seen my fair share of T1 frigs molesting T2.

One example can be found here Atron vs Retri.

A bloody Atron with zero tank murdering a Retribution loaded with snake implants.

So in practical terms, yes, you can win.
Pick your fights, don't play dumb, use the advantages of your ship setup and delete enemy ship.

- I think my passion is misinterpreted as anger sometimes. And I don't think people are ready for the message that I'm delivering, and delivering with a sense of violent love.

Sgt Doakes XD
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#52 - 2013-08-28 11:13:58 UTC
Yep, it's true. Tech 2 are better than Tech 1, but why is that a bad thing?
Most tech 2 mods aren't very expensive at all, and don't take that long to train for.
Sar Carstic
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#53 - 2013-08-28 23:55:05 UTC
Jake Devlin wrote:
http://minmatar.eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=19311501

I seem to manage. Of course I understand the value of overheating, picking my targets and expect to lose as often as I win.

Frigate fights are fast, it's what makes them fun. I'd offer you advice but you don't listen to it so I wont bother.


I'll take the advice - and listen. Just getting into the mechanics of PVP and roaming lo-sec. I spent all last night practicing D-scanning other ships down, and without fail, every single time I jumped in on something that I might have lasted a few seconds against, they warped out. I was in an Atron and this included people in T2 cruisers ratting. There was fun to be had in imagining their heart rates spiking when they saw me jump in on them, but a fight would have been nice.

A nice, fast, adrenaline-pumping fight is what I am up for. Overheating is the very next thing I will be training, I can see from all your posts the value of it cannot be overstated.

Gentlemen you can't fight in here, this is the War Room!

Large Collidable Object
morons.
#54 - 2013-08-31 08:02:21 UTC
Thanatos Marathon wrote:
This has got to be one of the greatest troll characters of all time. That or very sad.



I agree - I find myself becoming a fan of Paul - he should start writing a blog. His posts are so hilariously dumb, I find myself chuckling even after reading them multiple times.

Great entertainment value and very creative - smartest 'forum stand-up comedy' I've read in a while. I salute Paul - he takes being a moron to an entirely new level.
You know... [morons.](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gjOx65yD5A)
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