Player Features and Ideas Discussion

You must be joking, debating a null miner on null mining...

Ok Lucas, I'm going to do you a favor. Pay attention and you'll learn a few details.
I may never convince you about local, but at least I can teach this much about mining.


Profit for what? I never suggested this was anything except for benefit to the corp / alliance.
Oh, it's faster all right...


The Venture is not just for newbies. Get that drivel out of your head, it is not helping you by believing it.
To take it from it's own CCP written description: "The Venture is a Frigate designed for mining in hostile environments."
Mining barges are for newbies, Exhumers are for supported Ops, and the Venture is for exactly what it says.

If you are mining for a group with decent planning ability, they will set up a POS and park a rorqual in it, and have a fleet running constantly that you can join for boosts.
Not everyone has the luxury of being able to rearrange their real life for a mining op, so this at least helps them to meet the needs for ice and ore needed by their respective team.
For ice, yes, you need an exhumer. That pretty much means you need a system free of hostiles too, since they have poor solo survivability. At best, you can plan to get safe if a hostile sticks it's nose in. You can't compensate for one landing on grid or decloaking there, the ship's defenses are not designed for it. Even the skiff's warp bonus was removed to drive this point home.

Strip mining exhumers with rorq support.
And in this perfect world, they call that a mining op, too.
If you are solo, even if you have a booster present who is otherwise AFK in a POS, use exhumers with caution. These ships do not forgive pilot error, and a hostile can eat these like pinatas.
Do not EVER undock with a hostile listed in system. You are easy to scan down, you are easy to lock up and kill. And, like it or not, local gives them a good idea about whether a possible bait ambush is likely.

Now, getting back in touch with the realities of this job, mining ops do not happen daily. They happen when the right people show up with the right support.
They do not happen when there is no decent boosting.
They do not happen when a roam hear's about them.
And most of all, because real EQ players quite normally have lives that prevent it from occurring more often, they happen about once a week at best.

If you MUST operate with a hostile present, and the irony here is you may need to, use the Venture.
If a hostile corp realizes they can block your mining, they don't need a single kill mail. They will park a ship in every system they think you can mine in, and siege you that way. Wars are nasty, and fair is not an issue to them.
The Venture is the only mining ship worth using under hostile conditions.

I recommend this fitting:
Only about 90 days to train for a new character to fly properly.
If you want ALL the mineral crystals capable at T2 benefit, increase that to add another 35 days at least. You may decide some ore types don't matter, and those can of course be left out.
[Venture, Forums Example1]
Mining Laser Upgrade II

1MN Afterburner II
Survey Scanner II
Medium Shield Extender II

Modulated Deep Core Miner II, Bistot Mining Crystal II
Modulated Deep Core Miner II, Bistot Mining Crystal II
Prototype Cloaking Device I

Small Processor Overclocking Unit I
Small Processor Overclocking Unit I
Small Drone Mining Augmentor I

Mining Drone II x2

You may notice this example is fitted to mine Bistot, and I can tell you according to EFT it takes in 940 per minute unboosted.
(For my character with no implants plugged in)
Boost it up, get the proper implants, and you will do just fine.



You mine a lot, eh? You got some funny ideas, but maybe we just think differently.

As to the ice going faster, I'll say it does. I have found too many ice belts cherry picked for all of the ice we wanted, and left behind with the scrub items. I live in the wrong time zone, and the unknown other miner dashed off to a different belt to cherry pick it instead of clearing the mess he left behind.

OH, did you know, the belt does NOT respawn if the scrubs are left? Yep, lucky folks gettin to the belt after our mysterious cherry picker can clean it up, and then 4 hours later, POOF, new ice.
Assuming, of course, you actually have that much time.

OMG do I see this right? Two miners arguing about... mining?

Eve surprises me every day.

It's not effective to run boosts from only a second account, when that account could increase the overall yield more significantly by just jumping into a second mining ship.
The boosts only get justified, (when the math was last done), after you were boosting at least 4 hulks. Then the boosts equaled more overall yield than being in another exhumer directly.

Oh, and that Venture comparison on Bistot, I left out a detail. The numbers from the exhumers.

Yield from a comparably fit Mack: 1,127
A Hulk: 1,419
These are unboosted, with no implants. (Same as the venture was)

A 940 on the Venture is quite respectable, especially considering the lack of need to stop when a hostile is present in system.
You can operate right up until they appear on grid, at which point you leave.
No exhumer can operate as practically with a hostile in system.

So, IF you can guarantee the system is secure, by either blocking hostiles completely, or PvP deterrent proven effective, then you can of course use exhumers. You just described an op, effectively, where they should be used.

But, if you have an area worth mining, but it is inflicted with unavoidable hostiles doing the AFK Cloaking gambit, the ventures are the best answer. Even if they are watching, they don't know how you are fit, and locking one down to drop is neither practical or cost effective.

I assume those numbers are for Bistot specifically.

I don't have a rorqual, the corp has several.
Duplicating that role would have been pointless, so I use the boosts normally already present.
I do have the means to boost, and the skills, if it were to become wanted on an op. I have been a booster on past events, but as pointed out, the rorquals are simply more effective. I defer to them whenever available, since they bring better results.

And yes, I use a second box quite often. But even with great boosting, it doesn't double the output, so a second box is most efficiently used with directly mining in a second ship instead.

As to fitting, I am not at liberty to share that, since it came from others who deserve the respect of not publicly exposing their ideas without permission. I will say they have defensive aspects in place, that keep them from being paragons of min maxxed mining perfection.

Regarding the Venture, it has 5k ore hold, while the hulk has an 8k one. If hauling is an issue viewed as undesirable, you must endorse macks for this. Under secured conditions, I quite agree.
For unsecured, I advocate taking the time and effort of can mining, and the can to be in a POS.
This eliminates exposing a second account in a ship that is far less defensible, as well as keeping the can out of reach from frustrated would-be gankers.

This is exactly why certain ore is not available in high, and my example used bistot ore.

Also, I lack the play-time to plex accounts, so having two is a practical limit for multiple reasons.
That shifts the emphasis to quality over quantity, or else your multi-box idea would be preferable.