These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

[Odyssey 1.1] Dominix bonus change

First post First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Stridsflygplan
Deliverance.
Arrival.
#141 - 2013-08-08 22:59:59 UTC
Nice to see CCP being able to revisit and balance ships again just after they have been worked on. proves that CCP is actively looking at ships so they are working properly and are not to good/bad. When it comes to drones, I just want a new UI for them so they are easier to deal with.
ElQuirko
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#142 - 2013-08-08 23:00:50 UTC
Boooooooooooo. Now it can't hit anything.

Dodixie > Hek
Endeavour Starfleet
#143 - 2013-08-08 23:13:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Endeavour Starfleet
CCP Rise wrote:
We are going to put a small change in for 1.1:

Dominix's drone tracking and optimal range bonus lowered from 10% per level to 7.5% per level.

This brings the bonus in line with all other damage application bonuses we give, such as turret tracking bonuses or missile explosion velocity/radius bonuses. The Dominix hasn't been oppressively powerful but it is extremely strong and there is no need for the over-allocation with regards to this bonus.

In case some of you think this is a reaction to the way the Domi performed in the alliance tournament, I can tell you that we will never make balance decisions based on that environment. The tournament certainly highlighted the strengths of sentry drones and damps, which are both powerful on TQ as well, but it removed many of their drawbacks and so it is not an effective way to assess balance or power in normal EVE.


How about NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Drones have MANY disadvantages. They are the only weapon system that can be removed from the player using them and you are comparing them to turrets? What is wrong with CCP these days?

Please say you will not implement this. This is yet another HUGE nerf to those who bothered to focus their training and you are basically telling newer players to not bother focusing their skills because they are just going to be nerfed anyway.

Seriously what is the point of playing this game when you are doing things like this CCP Rise? You took a giant step forward with the changes to industral craft yet with this change the game is running backwards.

Why are you spending valuable development time nerfing ships you have JUST recently fixed? Why should the players find this acceptable?

Don't do this. Please say this is not happening.
Sigras
Conglomo
#144 - 2013-08-08 23:34:54 UTC
^^
So you would rather have the old CCP back where they would just balance change something and forget about it for 3-6 years?

(cough)Eos(cough)
Goldensaver
Maraque Enterprises
Just let it happen
#145 - 2013-08-08 23:38:22 UTC
Man, so many tears in this thread. At this rate there'll be enough to fill my stores. I'm actually quite appreciate of this change. It brings them more in line but still leaves them with advantages over turrets.
Endeavour Starfleet
#146 - 2013-08-08 23:43:10 UTC
Goldensaver wrote:
Man, so many tears in this thread. At this rate there'll be enough to fill my stores. I'm actually quite appreciate of this change. It brings them more in line but still leaves them with advantages over turrets.


In my opinion you have not spent the time training to use the ship properly. You simply do not understand how easy it is to remove a Domi's ability to do DPS. And neither does CCP in my opinion.

Instead of actually putting in the development time to fix drone UI weaknesses, change NPC aggro so that drones aren't primaried by them right off the bat. Or you know making changes to the game that are actually wanted "Like Logi on killmails" They decide to simply nerf the Domi and done with it?

For someone like me who actually had patience. Who actually bothererd to wait until I had the skill to make use of this ship. Why should I find this change acceptable? Why should I accept CCP comparing drones to turrets?
amurder Hakomairos
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#147 - 2013-08-08 23:46:38 UTC  |  Edited by: amurder Hakomairos
CCP Rise wrote:
We are going to put a small change in for 1.1:

Dominix's drone tracking and optimal range bonus lowered from 10% per level to 7.5% per level.

This brings the bonus in line with all other damage application bonuses we give, such as turret tracking bonuses or missile explosion velocity/radius bonuses. The Dominix hasn't been oppressively powerful but it is extremely strong and there is no need for the over-allocation with regards to this bonus.

In case some of you think this is a reaction to the way the Domi performed in the alliance tournament, I can tell you that we will never make balance decisions based on that environment. The tournament certainly highlighted the strengths of sentry drones and damps, which are both powerful on TQ as well, but it removed many of their drawbacks and so it is not an effective way to assess balance or power in normal EVE.



What a crock of sh*t. You say in your post that the Domi is not OP, so why in the hell are you nerfing it? This nerfing you guys do just for the sake of nerfing is a crock. Things should not be nerfed unless they are OP/gamebreaking. Every nerf devalues the training people did for these ships and modules.

How can you justify making this change just 2 months after the new bonuses when you yourself say the Domi "hasn't been oppressively powerful". So good in PvE, not OP in PvP is a reason for a nerf now?

How about you spend some time fixing the god awful drone interface that we have to deal with to use the Dominix instead of nerfing things that dont need to be nerfed.
Endeavour Starfleet
#148 - 2013-08-08 23:47:04 UTC
Sigras wrote:
^^
So you would rather have the old CCP back where they would just balance change something and forget about it for 3-6 years?

(cough)Eos(cough)


The Domi is balanced with a 10 percent bonus. There are so many other ships in the game that need a balance pass and the Domi is not one of them. Especially when removing their DPS is EASY compared to removing DPS of a turret or missile ship.

So yes It could have stood that way for 3-6 years and been fine. Only fools were complaining about the domi and it is saddening to see CCP accepting the arguement of fools instead of focusing development time on aspects of the game that need changing now. (Logistics need so much development time)
Irya Boone
The Scope
#149 - 2013-08-09 00:24:23 UTC
I don't really understand the need of nerfing of Gallente ships ,
when you "balanced the BS" you put some EWar bonus on other BS of the other races but ... Gallente NO.

We Have to get close to do some good damage but our PvP tank is generally passive armor tanking ...so making your ship an anvil...

railguns ... don't even talk about it ....( except some mega fit )

And we had domi with sentries ... and now because of your ****** tournament you nerf it too.. what's wrong with you people

For years we are asking for some changes and you don't give a **** .. but you spend Dev time on things NO ONE ASK YOU...
i don't get

Really ..THX ccp

and for god sake be honest and tell people to stop skilling drones or Gallente ships because you don't like them

ps: don't forget to make the Domi uglier , and more uglier too!!!

CCP it's time to remove Off Grid Boost and Put Them on Killmail too, add Logi on killmails .... Open that damn door !!

you shall all bow and pray BoB
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#150 - 2013-08-09 00:45:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Tyberius Franklin
Endeavour Starfleet wrote:
Sigras wrote:
^^
So you would rather have the old CCP back where they would just balance change something and forget about it for 3-6 years?

(cough)Eos(cough)


The Domi is balanced with a 10 percent bonus. There are so many other ships in the game that need a balance pass and the Domi is not one of them. Especially when removing their DPS is EASY compared to removing DPS of a turret or missile ship.

So yes It could have stood that way for 3-6 years and been fine. Only fools were complaining about the domi and it is saddening to see CCP accepting the arguement of fools instead of focusing development time on aspects of the game that need changing now. (Logistics need so much development time)

Logistics aren't even up on the table yet and I severely doubt that this is taking any real amount of time save looking over the usage and effectiveness of the ship on TQ, which is what they should be doing anyways. The revised bonus leaves you at 87% of the effect in range and tracking you had before and the ship was useable even before that bonus was applied. A single Omni tracking link more than makes up the loss.

Edit: Math Fail, I compared lvl 5 of the current to lvl 4 of the revised, you're actually getting ~92% range
Rain6638
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#151 - 2013-08-09 00:49:54 UTC
lol i don't mind. for what it's worth, I just want you to know you had me going until this:
CCP Rise wrote:

In case some of you think this is a reaction to the way the Domi performed in the alliance tournament

[ 2013.06.21 09:52:05 ] (notify) For initiating combat your security status has been adjusted by -0.1337
Endeavour Starfleet
#152 - 2013-08-09 01:01:58 UTC
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
Endeavour Starfleet wrote:
Sigras wrote:
^^
So you would rather have the old CCP back where they would just balance change something and forget about it for 3-6 years?

(cough)Eos(cough)


The Domi is balanced with a 10 percent bonus. There are so many other ships in the game that need a balance pass and the Domi is not one of them. Especially when removing their DPS is EASY compared to removing DPS of a turret or missile ship.

So yes It could have stood that way for 3-6 years and been fine. Only fools were complaining about the domi and it is saddening to see CCP accepting the arguement of fools instead of focusing development time on aspects of the game that need changing now. (Logistics need so much development time)

Logistics aren't even up on the table yet and I severely doubt that this is taking any real amount of time save looking over the usage and effectiveness of the ship on TQ, which is what they should be doing anyways. The revised bonus leaves you at 87% of the effect in range and tracking you had before and the ship was useable even before that bonus was applied. A single Omni tracking link more than makes up the loss.

Edit: Math Fail, I compared lvl 5 of the current to lvl 4 of the revised, you're actually getting ~92% range


This is indeed not taking any real time. Not any proper time at all looking at the realistic use of this ship as opposed to a stupid tournament.

The nerfs have to stop now. You let this change go through on this already balanced ship. And it will be Drake 2.0 The Domi will be the cause of all EVE Online's ills and then CCP will be more than happy to nerf it again and again.

The Domi is being turned into a scapegoat. And I do not accept that.
Louis Robichaud
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#153 - 2013-08-09 01:06:26 UTC
This is a fairly minor tweak - not earth shattering by any mean.

That being said... I was a bit leery of the previous domi re-balanced because it really shoved it in the "sentry drone boat" mold, removing flexibility. But at least it could do that role very well. Nerfing that weakens the ship - it's not like the domi won't be using sentries.

And yes sentries are potent, but they are also a pain in the butt to use for several reasons outlined in this thread already.


CCP Rise, do you have statistics on dominix usage, damage inflicted etc? Or is this nerf - well tweak - more of a gut feeling thing?

I blog a bit http://hspew.blogspot.ca
Kristina Rin
Squid Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#154 - 2013-08-09 01:24:18 UTC
now i have to buy one more Federation Omni ...

2014 !!!
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#155 - 2013-08-09 01:29:08 UTC
Endeavour Starfleet wrote:

This is indeed not taking any real time. Not any proper time at all looking at the realistic use of this ship as opposed to a stupid tournament.

The nerfs have to stop now. You let this change go through on this already balanced ship. And it will be Drake 2.0 The Domi will be the cause of all EVE Online's ills and then CCP will be more than happy to nerf it again and again.

The Domi is being turned into a scapegoat. And I do not accept that.

What loss is it suffering from real use? If you don't like it try forming a coherent counter argument rather than spewing paranoid delusions that CCP is out to get a ship that hasn't been the focus of any such attention. All you're doing so far is further proving that CCP not acting on every bit of feedback from all the players is the best thing they can do.
uyguhb
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#156 - 2013-08-09 01:34:08 UTC
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
Roime wrote:
Lic Tarek wrote:
The tank has always been solid on this ship but the DPS was always abysmal


If by "abysmal" you mean the highest dps of any T1 subcap, then yes.

I have to agree "Abysmal"=1500 DPS with its current iteration in a lolgank shield tanked fit.

The navy version will get up to 1700 DPs and have better tank.


and a typhoon cant get that?
Endeavour Starfleet
#157 - 2013-08-09 01:37:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Endeavour Starfleet
What feedback where they getting to start? Where were the countless topics saying "OMFG DAT DOMI TOO GOOD NERF IT NAO!!!111"

Who asked them to make this change? Especially when there have been countless topics to do something about the ability to AFK while cloaked, Logi UI issues and lack of Killboard, Drone UI, etc..

We were idiots when we thought the first nerf to the Drake was going to be anything but a long line of blame the Drake for everything. And now we want the Domi to be that again? I think not. Stop the nerf to an already balanced ship now and it won't be further nerfed later.

This is an unwanted, pointless change that further punishes those who bother to train to actually fly these ships. On a ship that is already balanced.

It is a complete waste of development resources when far more important changes need the time now.
Nyancat Audeles
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#158 - 2013-08-09 01:40:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Nyancat Audeles
CCP Rise wrote:
We are going to put a small change in for 1.1:

Dominix's drone tracking and optimal range bonus lowered from 10% per level to 7.5% per level.

This brings the bonus in line with all other damage application bonuses we give, such as turret tracking bonuses or missile explosion velocity/radius bonuses. The Dominix hasn't been oppressively powerful but it is extremely strong and there is no need for the over-allocation with regards to this bonus.

In case some of you think this is a reaction to the way the Domi performed in the alliance tournament, I can tell you that we will never make balance decisions based on that environment. The tournament certainly highlighted the strengths of sentry drones and damps, which are both powerful on TQ as well, but it removed many of their drawbacks and so it is not an effective way to assess balance or power in normal EVE.


FINALLY, F*CK YES

I can't tell you HOW many times I have been 1 or 2 shotted by Domis when I'm in a 7km/s frig with max transversal. This OP bonus will finally make it so frigate pilots are viable if a Dominix is on field.

EDIT: lol @ all the butthurt domi pilots who are sad that they won't get easy kills

Sentry drones can't be tracking disrupted, this ship was completely OP before this nerf
uyguhb
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#159 - 2013-08-09 01:46:16 UTC
So the ishtar has 7 drone bonuses with with T2 resists on a cruiser but you cant just leave the domi in the solid sniper role it is in?

When are you going to change the drone mechanics themselves? how come there is no proper "watchlist" for my fragile, immobile drones? (which still doesnt have a module for health)

Change the tracking if you must But leave the range alone.
Bigg Gun
T.I.E. Inc.
#160 - 2013-08-09 01:49:08 UTC
fuсk you - it's a carrier - it should be good at hitting everything. The one BS that's not afraid of smaller ships . In fact all BS's should get a drone bonus just for being slow and fat. I can just imagine: 50% to speed and tracking of drones for all BS's - that intie will think twice before trying to sink my BS.