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Wormholes

 
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Black Hole Systems

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Angsty Teenager
Broski North
#161 - 2013-09-09 21:18:03 UTC
Trinkets friend wrote:
How about we make warp speed increase by 25 / 33 / 44 / 58 / 85 / 100 percent. This would assist with ganking everything really quickly, especially if you rigged up a ceptor (60 AU/s baby!), with a concomittant increase in capacitor cost to enter warp.

So you arrive with no capacitor to actually fight, but w/e. You can deal with it. *sunglasses*


Too bad max warp speed has little to do with how fast you actually get somewhere outside of large systems. Maybe if CCP actually fixed the warp acceleration to actually be different between ship classes...
Le'Mon Tichim
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#162 - 2013-09-09 21:44:13 UTC
CeNSeR wrote:
System effects change every dt or randomly so when you log in some research has to be done everytime you log in.

Use existing effects and add some new funky ones so you dont know what the hell is going on without spending some time to find out.



So, every day you essentially change solar systems? You're aware that's what you're suggesting, right?

Go to sleep in a Pulsar, wake up in a Wolf-Rayet.

Yeah.

Can you hear them? They are calling to us. It is beautiful. http://thegreattichim.wordpress.com/
CeNSeR
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#163 - 2013-09-09 22:20:40 UTC
Le'Mon Tichim wrote:
CeNSeR wrote:
System effects change every dt or randomly so when you log in some research has to be done everytime you log in.

Use existing effects and add some new funky ones so you dont know what the hell is going on without spending some time to find out.



So, every day you essentially change solar systems? You're aware that's what you're suggesting, right?

Go to sleep in a Pulsar, wake up in a Wolf-Rayet.

Yeah.


Yep I am fully aware of what I suggested or I would have been unable to suggest it in the first place.
Trinkets friend
Sudden Buggery
Sending Thots And Players
#164 - 2013-09-09 23:51:55 UTC
Angsty Teenager wrote:
Trinkets friend wrote:
How about we make warp speed increase by 25 / 33 / 44 / 58 / 85 / 100 percent. This would assist with ganking everything really quickly, especially if you rigged up a ceptor (60 AU/s baby!), with a concomittant increase in capacitor cost to enter warp.

So you arrive with no capacitor to actually fight, but w/e. You can deal with it. *sunglasses*


Too bad max warp speed has little to do with how fast you actually get somewhere outside of large systems. Maybe if CCP actually fixed the warp acceleration to actually be different between ship classes...


Everything I suggest is utterly serious. Everything. All the time. We here at Trinkets Friendly Design labs pride ourselves on the workmanship of our theorycraft, and consider all variables before making facetious suggestions.

~~ Localectomy Blog ~~
Kojaxe LeAppljaxe
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#165 - 2013-09-10 06:31:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Kojaxe LeAppljaxe
What is a black hole.

1. Shouldn't have any planets, moons or sun. Its a black hole why would it have a steady system?
2. Make it a home for el33t sleepers drones/signatures/anomalies. hard to kill but drops tons of good loots.
3. like other have mentioned, no D-Scan.
4. Since there are no moons, no POS. You will not able to live there. So explorers can sell the black hole in market like DED.
5. Lower the speed of ships, like something pulling at you, make a black hole a black hole.
6. hard to detect the entrance and exit, must have astrometrics and other support skills to 5.
7. Probes have timer, like 5 mins or something, if you can't probe fast you lose your probes, why it got sucks by the black hole. simple reasoning science 101. Shocked
8, You can decrease everything like people here were saying missile effects/guns effects etc... cause its a black hole. but if you activate afterburner or mwd will speed up things a bit.
9. Drops should have like an officer sleeper mods or something. So people will explore, farm them regularly but not making it their home. All good for pvp/pve. like they're shooting each other on 10% tidi. Roll

To summarize.
1. explorer will scan the black hole.
2. explorer will sell the black hole or tell their corps to farm or look for pvp.
3. explorer will then move on and look for another signatures. Instant ISK making mechanics.
4. All will be happy puppy.


:)

mi english are bad. sorry.
Josilin du Guesclin
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#166 - 2013-09-10 11:02:37 UTC
Posting late to the party, but:

Cade Windstalker wrote:

Quote:
A sufficiently compact mass will deform spacetime to form a black hole, a region of spacetime from which nothing, not even light, can escape. Around a black hole there is a surface called an event horizon that marks the point of no return.
Black Hole Class 1 Class 2 Class 3 Class 4 Class 5 Class 6
Inertia Multiplier 1.25 1.44 1.55 1.68 1.85 2.00
Max Range Multiplier 0.90 0.81 0.73 0.66 0.59 0.50
Falloff Modifier 0.90 0.81 0.73 0.66 0.59 0.50
Missile Velocity Multiplier 0.90 0.81 0.73 0.66 0.59 0.50
Maximum velocity multiplier 1.25 1.44 1.55 1.68 1.85 2.00
Control range multiplier 0.90 0.81 0.73 0.66 0.59 0.50


So, from the look of things the original intent was to support MWD/AB PvP at basically knife range, except that's not exactly uncommon anyway and the speed change actually throws a lot of things out of whack as far as speed tanking goes. It's fun to like, zoom around in a cov-ops your first trip into one but I can't imagine living in one.

I do like the theme though but the other sites have much more direct buffs to certain styles of play. Some more than others, certainly, but the black hole is more of a fun toy than somewhere you would want to live because of how it functions.


How about the following:

I'm going for a theme around missile based bonuses. They tend to not get a lot of love in PvP or elsewhere and I think it would be cool to have a wormhole where the Phoenix really shines as a dread of choice.

Missile velocity increase

Explosion Radius

Tracking Penalty

Falloff Penalty

Warp Velocity: This is more of a "just for fun" thing that may end up having interesting consequences. Lets let warp zip you around up to 50% faster. Maybe this will let your bomber beat that Noctis back to the exit hole, maybe not.

Velocity Bonus: After some mulling I think I'd leave this but at max 50% effectiveness. Yes, it hurts missile damage but in PvE you can web everything down anyway and the explosion radius boost helps mitigate it, especially with larger missiles. It supports a kiting setup which range boosted missiles would be absolutely scary in or short range brawls with heavy use of Webs.


Overall I think this would help give Black Holes a unique play style, similar to the other wormholes and allow owners of a Black Hole to make use of some less utilized ships in defense of their home (and for making tons of ISK).

[trimmed for space reasons]

It seems to me that the theme of the current Black Hole is 'increased velocity and inertia', and that the inconsistent part is that missiles get hammered rather than buffed. Consistent with that theme is more range for missiles, and more explosion velocity, rather than reduced explosion radius. This also off-sets the ship velocity bonus, and removes the 'my Phoenix was speed tanked by a titan' problem with capital missiles.
Josilin du Guesclin
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#167 - 2013-09-10 11:08:22 UTC
Kojaxe LeAppljaxe wrote:
What is a black hole.

1. Shouldn't have any planets, moons or sun. Its a black hole why would it have a steady system?

This argument applies to Pulsars, Red Giants (they'd have eaten their planets), and most other types as well. However, if you look at the skybox in a system you'll note that the Black Hole/whatever is not actually in the solar system, just nearby. Thus any system can have planets, etc.
Gypsio III
Questionable Ethics.
Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork
#168 - 2013-09-10 12:46:45 UTC
You used to be able to add the secondary suns to the overview and warp to them. I used to have a screenshot of my ship chilling at zero km of a Black Hole. They'd typically be some tens of AU from the main star.
Malception
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#169 - 2013-09-10 12:48:31 UTC
I've been quasi-following this thread and from what I can tell there seems to be a focus on creating system effects that would mimic what an actual blackhole might do to a ship, but this shouldn't be the case. For instance, a magnetar, for instance, would just rip our ships and clones to pieces. Then it would strip those pieces into smaller pieces. But that's not what the system effect is.

I do have a question about the things that can be suggested though. Are we limited to only the variables that are currently being modified within w-space or can we pick other ship stats? For example, could we suggest sensor strength or mass?
Keith Planck
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#170 - 2013-09-10 18:48:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Keith Planck
Malception wrote:
I've been quasi-following this thread and from what I can tell there seems to be a focus on creating system effects that would mimic what an actual blackhole might do to a ship, but this shouldn't be the case. For instance, a magnetar, for instance, would just rip our ships and clones to pieces. Then it would strip those pieces into smaller pieces. But that's not what the system effect is.

I do have a question about the things that can be suggested though. Are we limited to only the variables that are currently being modified within w-space or can we pick other ship stats? For example, could we suggest sensor strength or mass?


Were limited to simple stat changes that wouldn't be a programming nightmare.

Local rep + damage projection bonuses would be sick with the new marauders 8)

♞
Blodhgarm Dethahal
8 Sins of Man
Stray Dogs.
#171 - 2013-09-19 01:15:35 UTC
Give them Hull Tanking Bonuses... 5/10/15/20/25/30 % bonus to resist or hull HP ammount
Janeway84
Insane's Asylum
#172 - 2013-09-19 10:22:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Janeway84
James Solo wrote:
Combining suggestions I like most in this thread with a few of my own:
Wipe current bonuses.


  • Add a Dual static
    • This alone will make it extremely valuable for pvp corps. Because of this value, pve should be harder, not easier in higher class wormholes.
  • Local rep bonus (shield and armor)
    • Allows lower class black holes to be viable for smaller pvp corps and PVE becomes easier for them as well. Barrier to entry is low because tanking alone becomes easier.
  • Proportional remote rep nerf
    • Makes it a lot harder to run the higher class sites, still viable however(people always find a way)
  • 100% bonus to large hybrid, laser, and projectile turret damage, 100% to torpedo and cruise missile damage in a c6, scaled down accordingly for lower classes.
    • This way there is more room for playing with mass, teir3 battlecruisers can use the large guns in a c1 without having to build the battleship there. This will have interesting effects on stealth bomber damage as well.
  • 75% less effectiveness of webs and target painters in a c6.
    • This has the dual purpose of making dread blapping hard, but making sites still doable. You just have to use more webs or figure out other ways of killing sleepers. Also scaled down for lower classes.
  • Proportional bonus to range of webs, scram/point, and target painters


If a dual static cannot be done in a c5/c6 with the current programming, would it be possible to allow the ihub upgrade "Quantum Flux Generator" effects to the system by default? Essentially making them just very busy wormholes.




+1 would make them black holes more intresting, althought im not sure i like nerfing webs and target painter so hard...
Since alot of players depend on them for a few different purposes.
Would be cool if black hole wormholes had 3 statics perhaps to make them unique aswell?

Also what the dude below me said about adding bonus effects to modules added after 2010, to give them some love and player intrest? Im sure players could come up with intresting uses if the mods got used in holes with special fx.
Anselm Cenobite
Gold Ring Enterprises
#173 - 2013-09-25 19:09:33 UTC
Make Black Hole systems into Marauder Heavens. Have them slow all movement 20%, but cut the down-time for Microjump Drives in half, so teleporting Battleships become the norm--just because no other WH system has a similar effect. Then give each Black Hole system an extra static that randomly cycles from day to day between Class 1 to Class 6 WHs. Just a thought.

In general, if you are going to add new abilities/modules for ships that didn't exist before Wormholes were first introduced, and you want to shake up Black Hole systems generally, it makes a lot of sense to tweak Black Holes so they modify those new abilities/modules introduced after 2010--just because none of the earlier WHs before 2010 did that.
ISD Tyrozan
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#174 - 2013-09-30 06:47:38 UTC
A trolling post has been removed.

Forum rule 5. Trolling is prohibited.

ISD Tyrozan

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Alundil
Rolled Out
#175 - 2013-10-07 22:02:37 UTC
Chitsa,

Any updates on the progress here?

I'm right behind you
Joey Judas
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#176 - 2013-10-08 10:49:25 UTC
Leave Black Holes as they are. Smaller corps need some breathing space to grow in blob heaven...
Alundil
Rolled Out
#177 - 2013-12-24 23:08:08 UTC
Joey Judas wrote:
Leave Black Holes as they are. Smaller corps need some breathing space to grow in blob heaven...

I'm not certain the word means what you think it means.

"Blob" in w-space is not a common occurrence. Especially with the typical Eve-O connotations that "blob" carries with it.

That said, I don't dislike blackhole effects but would like to see more varied effects and I think that blackhole systems are good candidates as the effect is relatively meh in comparison to other effects.

I'm right behind you
Lucius Arcturus
Hard Knocks Inc.
Hard Knocks Citizens
#178 - 2013-12-26 00:44:24 UTC
I like the suggestion of more connecting WHs. An extra static is a possibility, but more traveling/random WHs could be more fun. A bit of unpredictability.

CAPLF WH Sales

Capitalization in EVE Online
Kalel Nimrott
Caldari Provisions
#179 - 2013-12-26 03:55:49 UTC
Now you can apply the warp speed changes to black holes.

Bob Artis, you will be missed.

O7
Rob Cobb
Probe Patrol
#180 - 2013-12-26 06:08:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Rob Cobb
I would like to see a hole that counters the cataclysmic variable.

e.g.

Effect c1 c2 c3 c4 c5 c6
remote rep amount -10% -19% -27% -34% -41% -50%
remote rep range -10% -19% -27% -34% -41% -50%
shield/armor/hull hp +10% +19% +27% +34% +41% +50%
local rep amount bonus +10% +19% +27% +34% +41% +50%

no bonus or penalty for cap transfer

I can see pve being doable still in upper class either using local reps on lokis and cap boosters or using archons which should have enough rep power even with the penalties in upper class to keep a loki up, and i see these wormholes being more sought after in lower class as less tank is needed for pve, therefore more damage mods, as with magnetars, pulsars, and wolf rayets.

i would be excited to see the multiple new pvp fleet doctrines developed for these, to go pure buffer and brawl, go local reps only and hope to survive alphas, a balance of both, whether to keep up huge fleet cap chains to power those local reps, etc.

Not to mention, with buffer and local reps bonuses, i will troll my fleet and take shield to an armour fleet, and vice versa.