Wormholes

How about increasing the base stats of all t1 figs, dessis and cruisers by a factor of 10 and reducing the base stats of all other ship types by a factor of 5. Pulling numbers out of thin air here lol...

People who are saying they need a "missile bonused" wormhole effect are misguided. Blackhole effects nerf turret ships more than missile ships; the falloff range penalty actually reduces damage when the ship fights in falloff, which in a Black hole system, is going to be almost always. Then, you will be fighting faster enemies, so tracking is vital.

Missiles, once you are in range, always hit for full damage (adjusted only by target speed). Ergo, fast-moving missile boats are less affected by fast-moving turret ships in black holes. Add a TD and turret ships suffer, but currently nothing reduces missile DPS. You can simply rig off the extra target velocity with flare cat rigs, and you hardly suffer at all except for having to use HMLs and not HAMs.

Drones are a problem;

• They go fast and track worse
• They are hard to scoop
• They require EW interfacing 5, or DLA's, to reduce the penalty = Domis and Carriers only

Additionally, if you are a fast-mover, you can drop your drones (eg, a MWDing Maulus) and be outside of your drone control range before the drone launches and loads onto grid. Luls.

The speed coupled with inertia penalty is really only a massive nerf to capitals, as everything else can i-stab or nano the problem away and take advantage of the speed. No one flies nano Nags, so you just get hit with the penalties (tracking, inertia, etc) - hence the complaints from C5/6 dwellers who get sluggish caps with poor damage projection, faster sleepers which are harder to web down for dread blapping = QQ forum time!

The targeting range penalty is a key part of black holes and I think is essential and must stay. The fun you can have with a Maulus, Arazu or a proper dampstar (5km lock range for sieges...lol) is quite extreme. In essence, this "penalty" can be gamed into a benefit. The drone penalties cannot, and the turret penalties cannot.


The problem is really one of refitting. You can fit or rig off the penalties quite effectively without gimping your fit, up to C4 space. In C5 space this process leaves you nett worse off with benefits that have turned into liabilities. The solution may be replacing or modifying the penalties while retaining the flavour of speed and damps.

Suggestions:
Consider other wormhole classes.

• Pulsars get 3 bonuses and 2 negatives.
• Wolf Rayet gets 3 bonuses and 1 negative. No wonder they are so popular.
• Magnetarsget 2 penalties, 1 ridicu-bonus, and its penalty...that you can web off with a Vigilant in no time. Hello blapping.
• Cataclysmic gets 2 penalties, 4 bonuses (really 1 penalty to local reps, 3 bonuses; RR, cap, recharge)
• Red Giant gets one mostly useless bonus outside of C6, and one nonevent except for T3's for 0.01% of the time you live there, when not desperately OH'ing to survive a gank.

If you look at Black Holes objectively you get two bonuses. One is absolute (speed) and the other relative to your play style (inbuilt damp), and 2 penalties - inertia and weapon range (but the weapon penalties are uneven, as explained above). If you haven't figured out kiting Maulus alt yet, it's really 3 penalties and 1 bonus that works against you.

Thus, Black Holes really need one less penalty, or one more bonus. Given extra bonus would make things complicated, it really is down to shaving down the penalties.

Keep the speed bonus
Keep the inertia or an agility penalty
Keep the targeting range "penalty" to people without a Maulus
Remove the weapon penalties and drone penalties entirely. Odds are you won't be shooting to full range anyway (see above).
Add a bonus to kinetic and explosive damage. Yes, uber Caldari and Barrage is a possibility, but this is a black hole...if things hit you, they will crush you hard.

Or, if you really want to make me happy...a bonus to hull hitpoints. Make it a hull-tanker's paradise. Million EHP man-tanked carriers ahoy.

Blackhole effect:
Reduces mass limits on incoming/out-going wormholes by 10/20/30/40/50/60%

Iv been struggling with this for a while, because it dose need to be changed although i don't currently have any real idea about how to do it.

But if you could please ask anyone from CCP, when they removed E-War effects from wormholes because of the exploit was a solution ever found or discussed to fix the exploit? or was it just removed and forgot about?

Maybe it would be interesting to bring the E-War bonus back if could be fixed, flip side of this would make the T3 variants more common something i really don't want to see but they are being nerfed tm. However would give a boost to recons/force recons as well as some BS hulls.

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From other peoples suggestions i think the industry idea is really interesting and may add a much needed dynamic to some new player driven WH content without CCP having to add a feature/content.

But i think there should be some neg effect that makes them more vulnerable in some way, because with the new scanner systems its impossible to catch a miner that's paying attention.

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Also anything that encourages the usage of battle ships in WH's would be good but i'm not sure how you would balance this for the classes of WH's that don't allow there passage.

But i feel encouraging this with buffs to large guns would only make the tier 3 battle cruiser to powerful.

You, sir, are a nincumpoop.

Here's the rock-paper-scissors thing about missile velocity and frigs in black holes; any frigate which is MWDing so fast it cannot be hit by a missile, is essentially doing it outside of its own targeting range, after taking into account the 85% penalty to lock range. Any frigate which is within lock range so it can tackle you is within slingshotted OH web range and is not a threat.

Secondly, nanos don't make the inertia go away. I never said that. They allow the pilot, who has fit them, to make his ship behave properly versus idiots - like yourself - who don't refit stubbornly and come here whining about black holes. Adapt, deal with it, and gain the advantage.

Your opinion on the lock range penalty is like saying you shouldn't fit shields in a Pulsar because your sig is up 25%. Deal with it, use it to your advantage, and thrive.

This seems to be your whole problem. You whine and blub about the effects and even say

This is my whole point: work around it, not beat your head against a wall or create straw man fallacies like the mythical dramiel gang which locks from 30km and can bust you AND get back to the WH before you warp off the other side. Sheesh.

I learned to live with a C4 BH effect and did very well by adjusting my tactics. Even so, my allegedly subjective view is based on what is still crap about black holes even if you actually DO adjust to them. Its still a difficult place to be, even in low-end black holes.

As for what tactics I can tell you to use if you ever get over your crying about how it doesn't fit your play style? Let me reiterate:

• Nano's. Fit them!
[*} TE's > gyros/stabs/sinks (at least you hit with TE's)

• Rig for missile velocity and explosion velocity.
• Damps! You get one for free versus every enemy; abuse them!
• Rapier. Do you has?
• Vigilant. Do you has?
• Manual piloting. Can you does?
• Kitey TD Drakes with appropriate rigs. Can you refit? Better yet, HML Cyclones or Prophecies!
• Geddons! No nerf to neut range - try kiting at 44km in a Dram, with no cap, I dare you.

Etcetera.

Me being the industrialist that i am would like too see the mining/harvesting bonuses. Hell for good measure (and if it possible too code) let it have buffs too build speeds, reaction speeds, and bp research and invention speed. chalk it up too being in the proximity of the black hole you gain insite on how stuff works or something.

I know I would fight tooth and nail too have a lab in a black hole if this was the case.

Not this, bonuses to things that require you to leave POS bubbles to use please.

I don't think the black holes are actually located within the system boundaries. I have always thought that these black hole systems were close enough to the black hole(s?) to experience significant gravitational pull but far away enough from the event horizon to "exist" in its current state.

Giving them a double static would be an awsome effect, but failing that I'd like too see bonuses that encourage more battleship/BC brawling, and lean away from the Dread blapping, T3 blopping of damn near every other WH, but without completely crippling isk farming.

Possibilities
(in a C6, scaled down for lower-class WHs)
+100% to Siege Module duration

I see this effect as a way too discourage using dreads and triage carriers, without comepletely crippling them. Pretty much just brings the risk/reward of using them more in line with the massive combat multiplier they provide in WH space. The longer siege timers mean that, when used, they are commited too the field for much longer, and also makes it so that there are longer periods of time between when your carriers can cap up and rep your dreads.

+80% to Large turret tracking

This bonus is present too simply narrow the gap between T3 and BS damage application. Between this bonus, and the reduction in the effectiveness of blapping, it should make close range BSs far more attractive as DPS ships.

+80% to explosion velocity of cruise missiles and torpedoes

Same as above.

-50% mass of all ships

This will make it somewhat harder too collapse WHs, but, again, it encourages the use of BSs since now they will put substantialy less of a dent in WH mass limits. Also makes blackholes more attractive too aggressive PvP corps. More fights more fun!

-75% effectiveness of Target painters

Again, helps kill dread blapping, but shouldn't be much of an issue for PvPing in BSs (due too the crazy tracking large guns will have), and also won't effect PvE terribly much.

-50% to efficiency of capital remote armor repairers and capital remote shield boosters

Too keep these WHs from just being a competition between who can bring the most carriers

It occurs to me that having a bonus to repair range would compliment the speed nicely and remove one of the main issues with said speed bonus.

Not suggesting we keep all the current effects but this could be an interesting new one if the speed stays.