These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Warfare & Tactics

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Killrights fully explained?
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Kyra Quinn
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2013-08-02 10:37:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Kyra Quinn
In a few weeks I'll start doing solo PVP so I dove into the subject of Kill rights, I asked around a bit but it seems most people don't really know the full story; the official Wiki doesn't really state much on it at all and while the EVE Uni wiki helps a bit more it's still not enough.

Per EVE Uni Wiki: "therefore, gaining a kill right varies across security levels: In high-sec, a kill right is gained if your ship is attacked; in low-sec, if your pod is attacked; and in null-sec, if your pod is destroyed."

Someone I talked to showed me a kill of his where he destroyed a pod in low sec space, while he was the aggressor but it didn't result in kill rights. Our "logical conclusion" was that as he attacked the target's ship (which is fine in regards to kill rights) and the target shot back it became a "normal" fight and he thus was able to kill the pod without gaining kill rights. But that's just a theory, we don't know if this is true or not.

Also, the pod kill in 0.0 would need some explanation because that to me seems too simple a statement, I didn't know 0.0 gave kill rights.


Any explanation and help is very much appreciated, right now it all sounds very random to me.
Caerfinon
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#2 - 2013-08-02 13:33:33 UTC
pretty clear

"Kill Rights are your chance of retribution and are provided to you in those cases where you have been wronged by another player in the eyes of CONCORD. This means that if a pilot has performed an illegal act of aggression by activating an offensive module against you, causing him to receive a Criminal flag, you will be provided with a Kill Right. Kill rights are not generated in null-security space or during Limited Engagements." [Emphasis mine]

http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Kill_rights

Cheers C.

@Caerfinon - Twitter
Kyra Quinn
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2013-08-02 14:14:35 UTC
That doesn't explain why people attack someone in low sec, kill the target and the pod and don't get kill rights.
Karak Bol
Low-Sec Survival Ltd.
#4 - 2013-08-02 14:23:28 UTC
1. No Killrights in Null or WH
2. No Killrights for Criminals, Suspects or -10. Limited Engagements also provide no killrights.
3. In High: Killright for Ship aggression
4. In Low: Killright for Pod aggression

So basically: If someone shots back, no Killright for him
Caerfinon
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#5 - 2013-08-02 14:31:04 UTC
Kyra Quinn wrote:
That doesn't explain why people attack someone in low sec, kill the target and the pod and don't get kill rights.


I read it again and it is still clear...

1. in those cases where you have been wronged by another player in the eyes of CONCORD
2. Kill rights are not generated in null-security space or during Limited Engagements

Cheers C.

@Caerfinon - Twitter
Kyra Quinn
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2013-08-02 15:07:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Kyra Quinn
Karak Bol wrote:
1. No Killrights in Null or WH
2. No Killrights for Criminals, Suspects or -10. Limited Engagements also provide no killrights.
3. In High: Killright for Ship aggression
4. In Low: Killright for Pod aggression

So basically: If someone shots back, no Killright for him


ok, that's what we thought would be the case. Thanks a lot.


Caerfinon wrote:
I read it again and it is still clear...

1. in those cases where you have been wronged by another player in the eyes of CONCORD
2. Kill rights are not generated in null-security space or during Limited Engagements



This is obviously not correct because attacking a player's ship in low sec is deemed ok in regards to kill rights.
Pannax Ni
Pinch n' Plex
#7 - 2013-08-02 15:54:33 UTC
Kyra Quinn wrote:

This is obviously not correct because attacking a player's ship in low sec is deemed ok in regards to kill rights.


Wrong in eyes of CONCORD would be the GCC timer.

Shooting in low-sex earns you suspect, not a GCC.

And jesus christ, read the dev blogs about crimewatch, it / they have all the details.
Kyra Quinn
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2013-08-02 18:17:02 UTC
Why would one have to search for some blog from months ago to find specific info on the game, That's silly. Either way, answers have been given, problem solved.

Many thanks.
Trevor Dalech
Nobody in Local
Of Sound Mind
#9 - 2013-08-02 23:25:38 UTC
I am comparing two situations here, both in low sec, in both cases I was the aggressor.

1) I attack player A, blow up his ship and then kill the pod. Player A now has a kill right against me.

2) I attack player B, blow up her ship and then kill the pod. Player B does NOT have a kill right against me.


The only difference I could find is that player B had a light missile launcher fit. I suspect that during the attack she managed to fire off one single missile which did such insignificant damage I never noticed it (and here I thought a manticore was rather flimsy...)

Now, apparently, whether I "wronged them in the eyes of CONCORD", appears to depend not on my actions but on whether they accidentally hit F1 during my attack. This is absolutely not clear from the wiki... It also seems very illogical, since my wrongdoing seems to be the same in both cases, I was just a bit too slow in killing player B perhaps...



In any case, if player B feels truly wronged by me, she's free to challenge me to a duel. I'll accept and pretend she activated that kill right against me... and kill her again... Having two identical frozen corpses in my cargo bay will be twice the fun on those cold nights in deep space...
Archibald Thistlewaite III
The Royal Society for the Prevention of Miners
#10 - 2013-08-03 01:05:34 UTC
Kyra Quinn wrote:
Why would one have to search for some blog from months ago to find specific info on the game, That's silly. Either way, answers have been given, problem solved.

Many thanks.


Shame the answer that was given is wrong.

Karak Bol wrote:
So basically: If someone shots back, no Killright for him


Shooting back has no effect on whether a kill right is generated.

User of 'Bumblefck's Luscious & Luminous Mustachio Wax'
Kyra Quinn
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2013-08-03 07:27:27 UTC
Archibald Thistlewaite III wrote:
Kyra Quinn wrote:
Why would one have to search for some blog from months ago to find specific info on the game, That's silly. Either way, answers have been given, problem solved.

Many thanks.


Shame the answer that was given is wrong.

Karak Bol wrote:
So basically: If someone shots back, no Killright for him


Shooting back has no effect on whether a kill right is generated.


Well, then explain what happened to Trevor then, because he's the one I was talking to about it. He has very recent pod kills in low sec against targets who obviously didn't start the attack and aren't suspect or anything, nor are they -5. But there's no kill rights for it.
Archibald Thistlewaite III
The Royal Society for the Prevention of Miners
#12 - 2013-08-03 11:40:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Archibald Thistlewaite III
Kyra Quinn wrote:
Archibald Thistlewaite III wrote:
Kyra Quinn wrote:
Why would one have to search for some blog from months ago to find specific info on the game, That's silly. Either way, answers have been given, problem solved.

Many thanks.


Shame the answer that was given is wrong.

Karak Bol wrote:
So basically: If someone shots back, no Killright for him


Shooting back has no effect on whether a kill right is generated.


Well, then explain what happened to Trevor then, because he's the one I was talking to about it. He has very recent pod kills in low sec against targets who obviously didn't start the attack and aren't suspect or anything, nor are they -5. But there's no kill rights for it.



Trevor's last two podkills, one was against a -7.7 sec. status player so they are a valid target. The other was against a new player with a neutral sec. status.

Trevor Dalech wrote:

I am comparing two situations here, both in low sec, in both cases I was the aggressor.

1) I attack player A, blow up his ship and then kill the pod. Player A now has a kill right against me.

2) I attack player B, blow up her ship and then kill the pod. Player B does NOT have a kill right against me.


Seems to be working just the way the Crimewatch devblog says it should.

User of 'Bumblefck's Luscious & Luminous Mustachio Wax'
Trevor Dalech
Nobody in Local
Of Sound Mind
#13 - 2013-08-04 06:44:46 UTC
The -7.7 was not in low sec, so that's irrelevant to this discussion.

I'm looking at 3 kills now:

1) 17-7-2013, unarmed heron + podkill in Soliara (0.2), player has 0.3 sec status, he has a kill right against me.

2) 27-7-2013, missile heron + podkill in Adirain (0.4), player has 0.1 sec status, no kill right generated. If she fired back it was so weak I didn't notice.

3) 3-8-2013, missile and drone heron + podkill in Aeschee (0.2), player has 0.1 sec status, no kill right generated. This player fought back.
Archibald Thistlewaite III
The Royal Society for the Prevention of Miners
#14 - 2013-08-04 07:28:12 UTC
In lowsec killrights are generated when you 'illegally' aggress a pod.

Unfortunately evekill is down, so I can't look at your killboard. I can see your sec. status however, which is 0.8 and I can't help but think it would be lower if you were going around shooting pods.

In your character sheet you can look at where you lost sec. status and if any of the losses match your podkills then it was 'unlawful' and a killright should of been generated.

User of 'Bumblefck's Luscious & Luminous Mustachio Wax'
Trevor Dalech
Nobody in Local
Of Sound Mind
#15 - 2013-08-04 09:57:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Trevor Dalech
I did get sec status messages when I attacked those pods. I do enough other activities aside from shooting explorers that it stays up though.

Now my sec status logs don't go back far enough for the other two kills, but for the kill on 3-8-13 I got a -0.39% hit for attacking the ship and a -0.96% hit for attacking the pod. But no kill rights were generated against me.
Archibald Thistlewaite III
The Royal Society for the Prevention of Miners
#16 - 2013-08-04 10:50:14 UTC
I would suggest you bug report it, but the bug reporting system is down. You could try a petition if you think its broken.

User of 'Bumblefck's Luscious & Luminous Mustachio Wax'