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Is the guessing of a password on Eveboard illegal?

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Rordan D'Kherr
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#121 - 2013-07-19 16:15:08 UTC
Damage control by trolling?

Don't be scared, because being afk is not a crime.
Murk Paradox
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#122 - 2013-07-19 16:31:22 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Thorn Galen wrote:
There's nothing "meta' about it, it is illegal, plain and simple.
What law does it break?


Quite a few countries have laws against unauthorised access.

Of course it's really only against the law when it embarrasses a big corp or the government but eh



Not to mention there's a difference between a civil violation and criminal violation.

/shrug

This post has been signed by Murk Paradox and no other accounts, alternate or otherwise. Any other post claiming to be this holder's is subject to being banned at the discretion of the GM Team as it would violate the TOS in regards to impersonation. Signed, Murk Paradox. In triplicate.
Murk Paradox
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#123 - 2013-07-19 16:32:16 UTC
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
RoCkEt X wrote:


data isn't private when it's on eveboard; passworded or not, you are sharing your API. the only way this effects the individual is ingame. and does nothing to their RL privacy. Technically the data doesn't belong to them, as all EVE online accounts and such are property of CCP... and as CCP states that all information gained by sharing of API keys is solely the responsibility of the player who shares them.... :)

Stop whining, my ribs are hurting from the laughter :)


If it is passworded and you have come by the password via illegal means including guessing, it is private.
If I 'guess' the combination to your safe, I can't take whatever is in it without it being stealing, what you did is no different.
Personally I consider this good grounds for the player to request CCP reimburse him, as for all it wasn't particularly secure, he was hacked as part of the attack on his titan.



Well, the eve-board is not ran by CCP, but from Chribba.

Compensation would not be due from CCP.

This post has been signed by Murk Paradox and no other accounts, alternate or otherwise. Any other post claiming to be this holder's is subject to being banned at the discretion of the GM Team as it would violate the TOS in regards to impersonation. Signed, Murk Paradox. In triplicate.
Manfred Hideous
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#124 - 2013-07-19 16:36:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Manfred Hideous
Aylanaa wrote:
So this RoCkEt X guessed Mino IV's password on Eveboard, which allowed him to figure out when Mino IV would log his titan chararcter on enabling RoCkEt X to kill said titan. The story is here http://themittani.com/news/legion-alts-downs-avatar-low-sec, and here http://pastebin.com/u9XjXtAa Too me it seems in the grey area just curious on other people's thoughts.


He got the PW from The Sphere. Blink

Really 1234? He deserved to lose his space pixels.
Jayem See
Perkone
Caldari State
#125 - 2013-07-19 16:38:31 UTC

[/quote]


Well, the eve-board is not ran by CCP, but from Chribba.

Compensation would not be due from CCP.[/quote]

I agree. Chribba should refund the poor chump.

Nice patience on the kill Rocket - gratz.

Fake Edit. Also - this thread was absolutely hilarious.

Aaaaaaand relax.
Lucius Exitius
Brave Newbies Inc.
Brave Collective
#126 - 2013-07-19 16:51:04 UTC
Sounds like Rocket x got the password from the application he sent in to PL. If he can see the password in the application it means that he was authorized to look at the account, therefore he broke no laws, he was authorized to look, anytime you give out free intel like that expect it to be used against you. That being said I have my characters up on eveboard as well so I don't see the issues, if someone wants to work that hard for a kill then they deserve it.
Zaxix
State War Academy
Caldari State
#127 - 2013-07-19 16:58:11 UTC
theelusiveyoda wrote:
No but if you let the person keep the car keys that implies that you allow them to keep using the car at will and you then cant SHOUT THAT THEY STOLE YOUR CAR.

Tippia wrote:
If you don't want him to keep using your car, maybe you should take the key back?

This is the problem with using analogies; inevitably someone tries to extend the analogy beyond the confines of the actual point.

If we were to continue using the car analogy, you've got a copy of the key, not my personal key. Even if you have a key, unless I gave you permission to use the car, whether you have a key or not is irrelevant. It's called "taking without owner's consent." It's illegal, and it's illegal pretty much everywhere. The key issue here isn't the key or password, it's whether or not the access is authorized. There are tons of examples of people accessing ex-boy/girlfriend's email/facebook/whatever accounts using a password given to them by the ex and getting in trouble for it. It's still illegal. Permanent consent to access would only be assumed in cases where ownership is an issue, for example, a couple who is separated but who still jointly own their house.

Quit pulling arguments out of your ass. You clearly aren't familiar with the legal framework.

Bokononist

 
Kat Ayclism
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#128 - 2013-07-19 17:02:23 UTC
Zaxix wrote:
theelusiveyoda wrote:
No but if you let the person keep the car keys that implies that you allow them to keep using the car at will and you then cant SHOUT THAT THEY STOLE YOUR CAR.

Tippia wrote:
If you don't want him to keep using your car, maybe you should take the key back?

This is the problem with using analogies; inevitably someone tries to extend the analogy beyond the confines of the actual point.

If we were to continue using the car analogy, you've got a copy of the key, not my personal key. Even if you have a key, unless I gave you permission to use the car, whether you have a key or not is irrelevant. It's called "taking without owner's consent." It's illegal, and it's illegal pretty much everywhere. The key issue here isn't the key or password, it's whether or not the access is authorized. There are tons of examples of people accessing ex-boy/girlfriend's email/facebook/whatever accounts using a password given to them by the ex and getting in trouble for it. It's still illegal. Permanent consent to access would only be assumed in cases where ownership is an issue, for example, a couple who is separated but who still jointly own their house.

Quit pulling arguments out of your ass. You clearly aren't familiar with the legal framework.

How long have you been practicing e-law?
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#129 - 2013-07-19 17:07:52 UTC
Zaxix wrote:
This is the problem with using analogies; inevitably someone tries to extend the analogy beyond the confines of the actual point.

If we were to continue using the car analogy, you've got a copy of the key, not my personal key. Even if you have a key, unless I gave you permission to use the car, whether you have a key or not is irrelevant. It's called "taking without owner's consent." It's illegal, and it's illegal pretty much everywhere. The key issue here isn't the key or password, it's whether or not the access is authorized.
…and the other issue is one of assumed and implied consent. There are plenty of situations where the continued use could be reasonably assumed.

There are also numerous examples where access has been given once, and then been turned into effective ownership because the details of the initial verbal agreement can't be established.
Quote:
Quit pulling arguments out of your ass.
Stop altering the argument.
Murk Paradox
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#130 - 2013-07-19 17:08:29 UTC
Kat Ayclism wrote:
Ace Uoweme wrote:

If it's hidden behind a password it isn't public, even if the player used a simple password, as the INTENT was to keep it out of sight.

If only it wasn't posted on a public board.... something something not a reasonable expectation of privacy *vaguely legal related words*

-9 billion einsteinbrains

zzzzz...



Unfortunately, if I were to post my SSN, that would not give you permission to acquire it by trying all the door handles to my house and reading it from the card inside that same house.

Sine he was able to kill the titan through legit ways, grats to him on his hunt.

Unfortunately, he TRIED to do it through nefarious ways, so boo to that.

This post has been signed by Murk Paradox and no other accounts, alternate or otherwise. Any other post claiming to be this holder's is subject to being banned at the discretion of the GM Team as it would violate the TOS in regards to impersonation. Signed, Murk Paradox. In triplicate.
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#131 - 2013-07-19 17:09:20 UTC
If I were to guess any password of another user on any site, that would be hacking. Even if it was a game board.

Still under US law, at best, it's a matter of the mood of a prosecutor. Basically, if you are "of the system" of control you can get away with murder but if you are an activist then merely publishing an unsecured link, having not even done any hacking, will get you years in prison.

So, we'll see who is who in the pecking order of the real world by the consequences of an action that can either be dismissed as nothing or raised to a felony.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Lucius Exitius
Brave Newbies Inc.
Brave Collective
#132 - 2013-07-19 17:12:19 UTC
Zaxix wrote:
theelusiveyoda wrote:
No but if you let the person keep the car keys that implies that you allow them to keep using the car at will and you then cant SHOUT THAT THEY STOLE YOUR CAR.

Tippia wrote:
If you don't want him to keep using your car, maybe you should take the key back?

This is the problem with using analogies; inevitably someone tries to extend the analogy beyond the confines of the actual point.

If we were to continue using the car analogy, you've got a copy of the key, not my personal key. Even if you have a key, unless I gave you permission to use the car, whether you have a key or not is irrelevant. It's called "taking without owner's consent." It's illegal, and it's illegal pretty much everywhere. The key issue here isn't the key or password, it's whether or not the access is authorized. There are tons of examples of people accessing ex-boy/girlfriend's email/facebook/whatever accounts using a password given to them by the ex and getting in trouble for it. It's still illegal. Permanent consent to access would only be assumed in cases where ownership is an issue, for example, a couple who is separated but who still jointly own their house.

Quit pulling arguments out of your ass. You clearly aren't familiar with the legal framework.



Except this is different. API keys in EvE online are used to check someones background, which is one of its intended uses. The website eveboard is an API key viewer. which means that it is a tool to see in game information. Scamming in EvE online is legal, if you give someone your API key in game then they can use it how ever they want, even maliciously. I would say since eveboard is a tool for eve online it follows EvE rules and therefore the information gained from it can be used for any purpose. To me eveboard is the same as adobe reader, its just a reader that puts your information in an easy to read format, doesnt stop it from being in game information just because its been pulled out of the game.
Murk Paradox
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#133 - 2013-07-19 17:20:20 UTC
theelusiveyoda wrote:
Alot of people seem to be basing there opinion on the fact that the api was accessed via guessing the password,
it wasn't the data that the API provides was shown on the page not the API not the account details or login details.

So saying that the api was accessed without permission is wrong because it WAS NOT ACCESSED, only the data it provides was accessed which the player Chose to be shown on eve board.

Things to learn here:

1) Don't Use 1234 as a password on eve board (ESPECIALLY IF YOUR IN A SUPER CARRIER OR TITAN)
2) Don't Log off a titan like a ****** without safe log off
3) Everyone thinks they are expert lawyers
4) Everyone thinks everyone else is wrong even when they are wrong
5) The rage in this thread makes me laugh so hard it took me about 20 mins to write this reply.



I'd have considered understanding what "confession" means and how it can incriminate you... but I digress, the rest of your rule points are spot on!

This post has been signed by Murk Paradox and no other accounts, alternate or otherwise. Any other post claiming to be this holder's is subject to being banned at the discretion of the GM Team as it would violate the TOS in regards to impersonation. Signed, Murk Paradox. In triplicate.
Phoenix Jones
Small-Arms Fire
#134 - 2013-07-19 17:25:28 UTC
We're having this discussion? I think I guessed a pos password a month ago. Should I be banned?

It was not a email account, sometype of security portal, or to gain admin access to something. He put an api on a website. He has to attain some responsability for putting info on the web, regardless if be put a password up (1234 is a joke). He did his researched to make educated guesses on the guys schedule.

Good move.

You don't want your info public, don't put full api's on public servers.

Yaay!!!!
dexington
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#135 - 2013-07-19 17:29:16 UTC
Kat Ayclism wrote:
How long have you been practicing e-law?


and you are not?

I'm a relatively respectable citizen. Multiple felon perhaps, but certainly not dangerous.
Murk Paradox
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#136 - 2013-07-19 17:30:24 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Zaxix wrote:
Unless the PL application clearly states that the password will be used in perpetuity, repeated use is not automatically allowed. If i let you borrow my car once, it doesn't mean you can come borrow it whenever you want.
If you don't want him to keep using your car, maybe you should take the key back?



The conundrum with that is some keys do not require a dealership in order to make a copy =(

This post has been signed by Murk Paradox and no other accounts, alternate or otherwise. Any other post claiming to be this holder's is subject to being banned at the discretion of the GM Team as it would violate the TOS in regards to impersonation. Signed, Murk Paradox. In triplicate.
Kat Ayclism
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#137 - 2013-07-19 17:30:40 UTC
Murk Paradox wrote:
Kat Ayclism wrote:
Ace Uoweme wrote:

If it's hidden behind a password it isn't public, even if the player used a simple password, as the INTENT was to keep it out of sight.

If only it wasn't posted on a public board.... something something not a reasonable expectation of privacy *vaguely legal related words*

-9 billion einsteinbrains

zzzzz...



Unfortunately, if I were to post my SSN, that would not give you permission to acquire it by trying all the door handles to my house and reading it from the card inside that same house.

Sine he was able to kill the titan through legit ways, grats to him on his hunt.

Unfortunately, he TRIED to do it through nefarious ways, so boo to that.

Good thing that this is totes comparable to an SSN, the keys to your car, etc..

To be clear, I would download *your* car and vigorously stick my keys into it repeatedly and with reckless abandon while blaring your SSN over my sickass sound system wit da bass drops all up in that.
Templar Knightsbane
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#138 - 2013-07-19 17:30:45 UTC
Damn what an absolute waste of police time!
Schalac
Apocalypse Reign
#139 - 2013-07-19 17:35:59 UTC
If Rocket were to be arrested for this then the people that made the accusation should be fined as well for filing a false police report.

SCHALAC HAS SPOKEN!! http://eveboard.com/pilot/Schalac
Kat Ayclism
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#140 - 2013-07-19 17:37:07 UTC
Schalac wrote:
If Rocket were to be arrested for this then the people that made the accusation should be fined as well for filing a false police report.

Let's just go ahead and arrest all of eve, m8