Player Features and Ideas Discussion

An excellent suggestion, if I may I will add it to the List.

A t2 fitted hac runs around 250 million, a t2 fitted t3 runs 500 million, if that, more like 275, so its barely twice as much for a platform that outshines the hac in every conceivable way, one might even argue that t3 Cruisers are what HACs should be.

Just because you spend an extra billion on your fit when you can get a really good strong fit from a t3 with just t2 items doesn't mean you get to skew the stay with it. The vanilla fit still outclasses the HAC in every way for barely double the cost, if even double in some cases.

Stop making things up and this will go along a lot better.

Stop discussing an area of EVE which you don't understand and this will go better. T3s aren't OP, they aren't flown often outside of W-Space. They are often flown in W-Space because T3s are the only ship that fit the requirements WH alliances need. You, a nullsec blobber with EVE's largest supercap fleet behind you, do not understand W-Space PVP, so do not pretend to have knowledge in this area.


HACs suck, that is why they aren't flown. If HACs were buffed to a point where they are worth the cost then they would be used. Get your head on straight, its not a T3 issue, its a HAC issue.

Lore(khanid) and diversity.

Demanding more eHP just because of Cynabal this and that won't help either.
And to add along: "balance/tradeoffs" must prevail; you can't just give huge raw eHP without some tradeoff. Anyone asking for big stuff for nothing of a tradeoff should just be ashamed.





That HACs were "replaced" by T1s was solely due to Tiericide hitting T1 first. However I must say that T2 ships are specialized ships. They do not have to always mean "I WIN" just because their more expensive.

I'd say focus more on the exact buffs that you want with plausible reasonings. Granted, comparing for instance Vaga with SFI and Cynabal is one thing, but I'd really suggest focusing on things that make the Vaga more viable. Same can apply for the other HACs.

Which brings me back to why it would be interesting to see unique Role bonuses, like AB Bonus for Vaga and another ships, as well as all these other interesting role bonuses that could make the HACs versatile despite the T2 specialization aspect.

Yeah.
It would be a clear difference vs other ships, because we never really have seen much of "anti-crowdcontrol" (excluding using ECM/E-drones). The only one anti-CC I've seen so far was the nullifier.

Anything around that subject could give HACs that advantage over the current debate about T1/SFI/Cynab being "better". Certainly would be something different.

I will reiterate a couple of points here with some reasoning:

Vagabond needs its utility high moved to a mid slot, it also needs some more powergrid and cpu so it can fit artillery to kite with, just because Kovorax used an ASB brawler before the ASB nerf doesn't mean everyone wants to. It's currently bad at auto kiting because of the TE nerf. If you remove the utility high it won't really have protection against mwd scram web frigs, that and the shield bonus would differentiate it from the Cynabal. It needs about 1125 base PG to do it's job and let you fit the long range weapons. An extra 5 base CPU wouldn't go astray as well.

I killed an asb vaga in my unbonused dual rep vexor the other day, it needs a lot of buffs, being able to run away really quickly doesn't let you kill things, it's the same problem the stabber had/has.

The Muninn needs another turret slot in that utility high, it's alpha is just soo much less than the Loki it's not worth it. It needs to be able to fit 720s and a 1600 plate with only one fitting rig or it's not really worth anything. To do this it needs an extra 130 base pg currently, plus an extra 180 base to fit the extra turret, so that's 1470 base pg against it's current 1160. It's a specialist long range artillery platform and unless the loki will be getting a HUGE nerf, the muninn will be a no trick pony without the extra turret and fitting. An extra 10-20km base lock range would be nice, so it could actually do its role.

The Deimos needs more damage, it's damage is terrible for a blaster boat, if you say it's supposed to be shield rail fit I have one word for you, TALOS, it's not one and a Talos does it way better. Change the ****** mwd cap bonus into another damage bonus or a tracking bonus. The signature radius on the Deimos is way way too big, there's simply no reason for it, the Ishtar as well. How do you expect these things to mitigate damage whilst mwd'ing if their sig is so large?

It needs enough powergrid to fit 1600 plate, mwd and neutrons with one ACR, the Zealot can, why can't the deimos?

Ishtar obviously needs more cpu, about 35 base extra should do it, that'll bring it up around the Vexor. It's also way too slow, why the hell did you nerf it? It shouldn't be slower than the T1 counterpart, since these things are specialist mwd attack ships. Integrate the drone bay bonus and put in a drone MWD speed bonus, it's a specialist drone ship after all. I like Trouser's idea of a 20% damage/lvl bonus and a 50 Mbit BW limit so can get good damage from mediums.

The SAC needs more damage, it's pathetic, change the cap bonus to a damage or missile speed bonus (at least then it gets damage projection). Integrate the cap bonus into the hull.

The eagle and cerb I leave to people who know them better, but I will say the cerb looks way too slow to kite.

Lastly, as I said before, they all need a capacitor boost, seriously how can you run your mwd and use the sig bonus if you have no cap? To the role bonus add a reduction in MWD capacitor usage or give them all much better cap recharge.

Soo guys if CCP reads this thread and wants to know what the main revisions are we need to come to some sort of agree ment..

Make sure you are liking the posts you stringly agree with


And for me I think we can all agree that

Hac's need to follow the tiercide appraoch.. with two distinct roles for each race.

I pretty surre the Arazel knows what she's talking about...

he Cebr still needs more PWD and CPU

Scram-Immunity helps only HACs using MWD.
That would only be viable for an Roaming-Role HAC (Vagabond).
For an fleet-HAC, we need something different.

Different approach:
For the fleet-hac would be an big resistance increase Role Bonus for the fleet-hac an different approach, that is only viable against Large and XL Weapons. Maybe even fixed Resistance values against Large/XL weapons. Which would offer FCs to use HACs only with Plates/Shield Extenders and more speed/damage slots, but with the risk that an BC/Cruiser fleet does a lot more damage or more well rounded fittings with resistance modules.