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Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
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Make all carriers and dreads prone to normal warp disruptors in lowsec.

First post
Author
SweetAshley
State War Academy
Caldari State
#101 - 2013-07-17 21:04:23 UTC
Whitehound wrote:
Perseus Kallistratos wrote:
Yeah you got it. When one moves to the forums its because they have moved to a higher plane of existence within EVE itself.

Your comment itself reads disconnected. Who do you mean by "one" and who are "they"?

And why are so many PL members not simply ignoring the topic when they are not interested to discuss it, but are trying to kill it by trolling? I thought the thread was not much alive to begin with, but you guys certainly have given it a new life.


Well that means the group and organization known as PL they are the they and the one means PK has moved to the forums at a higher existance :p, See PK I got your back :p
Elektrea
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#102 - 2013-07-18 00:27:53 UTC
I've seen better suggestions by Grarr before, let that sink in.
Sernum
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
#103 - 2013-07-18 00:28:18 UTC
Dez Affinity wrote:
Kings of Lowsec

gr ant
Perkone
Caldari State
#104 - 2013-07-18 00:36:03 UTC
I have a simple solution to your problem

unsub
Evangelina Nolen
Sama Guild
#105 - 2013-07-18 03:50:09 UTC
Bait & gank their caps. Caps go down very fast with 150k focused dps on them.
Tupac'alive'in Serbia
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#106 - 2013-07-18 03:50:51 UTC
if we are in supers and a super-scramming pos mod points one of us we just kill that mod and you pubbies still coward and don't fight

hope that helps


http://youtube.com/watch?v=pcyxFNuQlwo
Grace Ishukone
Ishukone Advanced Research
#107 - 2013-07-18 04:19:58 UTC
Grath Telkin wrote:
This can't be a real thread


Big smile We have a winner! Big smile


Well spotted Grath. It's not - other than it is real in that it has pulled out the views of players from one of the nullsec corps that is currently responsible for undermining the Odyssey changes. It is clear from the above that such players consider there is nothing wrong with a tiny proportion of the game playerbase controlling vast quantities of the gamespace due to the current SOV and station mechanics. It would have been inappropriate to continue pushing for changes to the game mechanics without seeking the views of such players, so I did.

The reactions from the Pandemic Leigon players simply make the real point - that rapid travel and the decade old nullsec map are enabling absentee ownership and denial of game growth for this game.

EVE Online has been growing year after year, for many years. Sure. So what? It is about return on commercial investment in the face of increasingly sophisticated competition in a very small niche game space. If EVE Online wants to be more than an ancient curiosity, they need to continue to improve their game - and they have made many design changes in the past 3 years that mirror changes made in other games, which in those other games contributed to the ending of service of those products.

I wasn't kidding or trolling when I said many of my friends have quit over losing our home in nullsec. That 'get a home,. love the game, lose your home, quit the game" dynamic has been present ever since Ultima Online invented and added player housing. How to balance the security of your home, against preserving pvp, is one of the major design challenges in modern MMOs. That there are so many underused "homes" in EVE that are empty because of the map and players preventing others who would otherwise bring pvp to those dead and pointless areas smacks of poor design choices by CCP.

The question becomes what to do about it.

Yes I trolled you guys into saying more than you probably ever intended to, however the point remains the same - the game is currently broken from a pvp perspective. There is a major schism between ants and tank drivers, and between highsec and low/nullsec. Odyssey was unashamedly designed to pull and push players into low / nullsec, and while it has worked to some extent for lowsec, it is now clear that is at the expense of nullsec. If you want small ship pvp (ants), everyone moves to lowsec. Why? You never get that gameplay in most of nullsec - you get afk cloaky campers, people who simply dock when a neut is detected one system either side of where they play, and capital level play (tanks pvp). When people famous for their pvp in nullsec are moving to lowsec because they are not getting the pvp they want from nullsec, there is simply no question that there is an issue.

The solution originally posited above is effectively what would happen if Nullsec PVPers were locked out of lowsec by game mechanics? The obvious answer from PL players above is that they would cry, and cry a lot, to CCP.

But if nullsec players have been pushed to lowsec / highsec by the mega alliances players, and the mega alliance players themselves are now moving to lowsec too because they are so bored in nullsec, that really does underscore the point for CCP that the nullsec map and sov mechanics are simply not working. They need a massive overhaul. What shape that should take is of course up for discussion, but this thread has served its purpose - drawing out the views of players who are reluctant to say what they really think. Nothing quite like getting someone's guard down to then get them to speak their mind.

You guys got drunk on tears, and basically admitted that Pandemic Leigon is a sov owning alliance who kick alliances who do not pay their rentals, even though you pretend in the beginning that you are not renting space at all and don't own sov. You do, in fact if not in name. You also have revealed that you are for want of a better word, bored. Nullsec should be providing ll the pvp you can handle, all the stories and tears you can stand. Yet you all took the time to fall for my troll post, and indeed have even admitted to moving gto lowsec to play, implicitly because there actually *is* pvp in lowsec.

So yes, CCP. Do it. Add highsec islands to all distant parts of the map, with attendant lowsec space around them, or redraw the map so that no-where is more than 2 jump cal 5 jumps from Highsec. The economics of the gamespace simply do not make any sense for anyone who is not a renter, because as PL themselves so helpfully explained, you can make more ISK for less risk in Highsec, without wasting time travelling. When the "elite pvpers" from nullsec have moved to lowsec because they are so beored between the occasional tank vs tank sov battle, it's time to scarp the current map and do it over. Every system should be worth playing in (i.e. better than highsec in one or more ways), not just 1 in 12 with most of nullsec being utterly pointless waste of data space and player time while they look for someone to pvp ... which usually means you see one person who made it to their POS or station, and system after system of the only people in local being the ones who flew in with you, even in outpost systems. That's not the sign of a healthy game, given nullsec is meant to be where the elite live. Most of it is currently just home for bots and moon harvesters, and the latest crop of newbies who have rented but not yet worked out that they are losing money over playing in high sec, and can (and often are) very spectacularly screwed over such as was demonstrated last week. So. Fix it, or watch this product continue to under perform commercially, with the risk that when a better equivalent game that *did* fix such issues comes along, EVE goes into mothball mode. 10 years - nullsec deserves love..
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#108 - 2013-07-18 07:09:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Dracvlad
I thought it was common knowledge that PL along with NC. and Nulli are running a rental business in 0.0. Though I cannot really see PL doing any protection for 'pubbies'.

Anyway what you are focussed on is that for a small or medium sized alliance moving into 0.0 as your natural development is not possible, you either rent or you stay in low sec/high sec, that is your ceiling. You cannot carve out an area of your own with the current sov system and the pure super/titan power of the major powers.

Your idea of pockets of High Sec surrounded by low sec is one way of sorting out the bases that smaller entities need to be able to operate, I was fixated on the put anywhere, stealth mode new POS system, but neither of them will happen because CCP is so focussed on the major alliances and their needs for the headline major battles that perk up interest in the gaming world, in fact with the recent changes to Grav sites not requiring probing they removed another group of independents from 0.0 and buffed the power of major sov alliances.

Over the last two months I noted three ex-corp mates who were very committed to this game at one point stop playing, because they could not go into 0.0 on their terms, and this is the reality that CCP has with their game, those players would have continued playing if they had a way to progress, but PL and their ilk refer to them as pubbies and laugh at them leaving a game that they hardly play themselves.

About a month and a half after the fall of IRC I took a trip from Cobalt Edge to Stain, I met 5 people the whole way before I arrived in Stain. Which had a lot more people. The major 0.0 entities are desperate to find ways of making it difficult to operate in NPC 0.0, wanting the ability to encap station services in those systems, I had the impression that CCP was listening to them, but so far they have not applied this and I hope they never do. Because if they did NPC 0.0 will be as dead as sov 0.0 with every single station service in NPC regions encapped.

At the moment all you have is the nerf HS crowd pushing things like removing perfect refine in HS, removing gun mining, etc., but that will kill the game, many of us just potter around building up assets waiting for changes to 0.0 which will never come based on CCP's attitude. The ice mining changes seemed to me to be aimed at removing the abilitry of these major entities to project power, however it also makes it even more difficult for small and medium sized entities to get a toe hold.

Personally I think that CCP need to make it so that if the NPC's are not kept down, then the sov modules will be degraded or even removed by the NPC pirates. Do that and perhaps we will see changes, but don't hold your breath on it, I doubt CCP have the bottle to do it!

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp

Xolve
State War Academy
Caldari State
#109 - 2013-07-18 09:47:23 UTC
ITT: 7 year old miners, that don't understand how to tackle capitals write manifesto about how not mad they are.
Kat Ayclism
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#110 - 2013-07-18 09:48:40 UTC
Grace Ishukone wrote:

:words:
:words:
Yes I trolled you guys into saying more than you probably ever intended to, however the point remains the same - the game is currently broken from a pvp perspective.
:words:
:holy hell more freaking words:
:more words:

Gosh you sure "got" us. Pro-tier trolling-with-your-actual-views there friend.
Grace Ishukone
Ishukone Advanced Research
#111 - 2013-07-18 11:11:54 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:
Anyway what you are focussed on is that for a small or medium sized alliance moving into 0.0 as your natural development is not possible, you either rent or you stay in low sec/high sec, that is your ceiling. You cannot carve out an area of your own with the current sov system and the pure super/titan power of the major powers.


Well put. Unfortunately that is the problem, because people who want to do that and who do not wish to join a mega alliance hit that "glass ceiling". Then being unable to advance past that point, their playstyle stagnates, their player activity tapers off over time, they bleed players, then cease to exist.

There needs to be someplace for such corps to go which does not require them to be serfs to the large empires. Because while the large empire having serfs is perfectly fine as a game dynamic, the tendency of Western players to simply quit rather than suffer becoming a serf with the grind elements and poor economic consequences that flow with that means that player social groups tend to rise though the game, and at the one - three year point hit that limit, and once enough have left, they all quit. That is still a decent retention path, however many more corps simply cannot achieve even that, and fail out much sooner. Bottom line, if we can keep those corps and get them out in nullsec playing as independents, it will improve the game.

Entire reigons being blue is fine - but you can't do that and also say EVE Online is a pvp game. It's a farming empire game, where a tiny number of pvp corps and players compete to control the farmers. Farmville in space. P
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#112 - 2013-07-18 11:21:55 UTC
Grace Ishukone wrote:
It's a farming empire game, where a tiny number of pvp corps and players compete to control the farmers. Farmville in space. P


That is what it is, farming either being ISK, resources, or kills and often all three, it would not surprise me that PL renters had PL alt accounts AFK cloaky camping them and hot dropping them too.

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp

War Kitten
Panda McLegion
#113 - 2013-07-18 11:30:14 UTC
Holy cow, the faucet never ends. We're drowning in tears over here.


OP - face it. One person whining that they can't succeed will NEVER succeed. Your friends are quitters, you're feeling entitled to gameplay you not only haven't, but apparently CAN'T earn, and you're blaming everyone but yourself.

HTFU

I don't judge people by their race, religion, color, size, age, gender, or ethnicity. I judge them by their grammar, spelling, syntax, punctuation, clarity of expression, and logical consistency.

suid0
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#114 - 2013-07-18 11:37:07 UTC  |  Edited by: suid0
Grace Ishukone wrote:

There needs to be someplace for such corps to go which does not require them to be serfs to the large empires.


What? like Syndicate, Great Wildlands, Venal, Curse, Delve (part of), Geminate (single station), Outer Ring, Pure Blind, Stain?

Yeah, if only Roll

Dracvlad wrote:
it would not surprise me that PL renters had PL alt accounts AFK cloaky camping them and hot dropping them too.


That would be like mugging your wife after she uses an ATM.... pointless and stupid.

the entire enemy support fleet is dead except for one interdictor a titan could easily finish off with drones  - Commander Ted

Dirk Action
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#115 - 2013-07-18 12:01:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Dirk Action
ah yes the old "oh shіt I look like a rеtard better pretend I was trolling" troll

you got me good, who should I contract all my assets to as I clearly must quit the game now
Dirk Action
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#116 - 2013-07-18 12:06:29 UTC
was the PM with Kat a troll too? that looked like pretty real crying and whining to me :iiam:
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#117 - 2013-07-18 12:17:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Dracvlad
suid0 wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
it would not surprise me that PL renters had PL alt accounts AFK cloaky camping them and hot dropping them too.


That would be like mugging your wife after she uses an ATM.... pointless and stupid.


That is a rather odd thing to call a pubbie renter that is likely to be bad at PvP, they are the ATM and are to be milked as much as they can bear, my suggestion fits in totally with your alliances attitude, wow you need to improve your forum warrioring, its pretty poor.

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp

Rek Seven
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#118 - 2013-07-18 12:26:52 UTC
Faction warfare and Dust mercs should play a part in cyno jamming low sec systems.
suid0
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#119 - 2013-07-18 12:38:19 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:
suid0 wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
it would not surprise me that PL renters had PL alt accounts AFK cloaky camping them and hot dropping them too.


That would be like mugging your wife after she uses an ATM.... pointless and stupid.


That is a rather odd thing to call a pubbie renter that is likely to be bad at PvP, they are the ATM and are to be milked as much as they can bear, my suggestion fits in totally with your alliances attitude, wow you need to improve your forum warrioring, its pretty poor.


Are you really that illiterate or just trying too hard?

the entire enemy support fleet is dead except for one interdictor a titan could easily finish off with drones  - Commander Ted

Joyfie
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#120 - 2013-07-18 12:45:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Joyfie