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Report on POW treatment by Pyre Falcon Defence Combine
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Lucas Raholan
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
#21 - 2013-07-15 20:02:52 UTC
Ms Ambraelle..if you feel that Pyre are enslaving their POW's may I cordially invite you to the Amarr Empire where I can show you real Slavery...I assure you it will far worse then how they are treated under Pyres watch.

The reason their handing a few over to the Khanid is not because they wish for them to be enslaved. if you had actually read the Report you would know that they are wanted criminals in the Kingdom and under law Pyre is required to hand them over.

I suggest you sit you're Tests again and read some books on the Politics and culture of the Empires before connecting to this feed again

Shitposts so bad CONCORD gave me a 50 billion ISK bounty
Anslo
Scope Works
#22 - 2013-07-15 20:08:22 UTC
Lucas Raholan wrote:
The reason their handing a few over to the Khanid is not because they wish for them to be enslaved. if you had actually read the Report you would know that they are wanted criminals in the Kingdom and under law Pyre is required to hand them over.


That's a few though. Or by few do you mean any going to Khanid? Cause if you can source that, it'd shut just about everyone up (thankfully).

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#23 - 2013-07-15 20:11:05 UTC
Only POWs with legitimate warrants out for crimes against the Kingdom are handed over to Khanid authorities.

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.
Anslo
Scope Works
#24 - 2013-07-15 20:12:39 UTC
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
Only POWs with legitimate warrants out for crimes against the Kingdom are handed over to Khanid authorities.


And the rest of the POWs?

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#25 - 2013-07-15 20:16:19 UTC
Anslo wrote:
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
Only POWs with legitimate warrants out for crimes against the Kingdom are handed over to Khanid authorities.


And the rest of the POWs?


They're held in the system I described in my report until such time as they can be exchanged for Caldari prisoners. Or until hostilities end - which would be the better solution.

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.
Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#26 - 2013-07-15 20:16:32 UTC
Tali Ambraelle wrote:
So now the State turns to slavery to 'offset' costs of a system that was not needed.

Shocking.

I suppose it was only a matter of time.

Slavery is against the law in the State.
However, gallentean swines used to call slavery whatever they don't understand, just to attack and kill Caldari citizens.
And this is why the Federation must be destroyed.

Show them no mercy!

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.
Makkal Hanaya
Revenent Defence Corperation
#27 - 2013-07-15 20:17:40 UTC
While I appreciate the transparency, an agent of Pyre telling me how well Pyre treats its POWs isn't as meaningful as a non-affiliated, or even a Republic or Federation affiliated, person telling me the same.

Render unto Khanid the things which are Khanid's; and unto God the things that are God's.
Anslo
Scope Works
#28 - 2013-07-15 20:19:00 UTC
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
Anslo wrote:
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
Only POWs with legitimate warrants out for crimes against the Kingdom are handed over to Khanid authorities.


And the rest of the POWs?


They're held in the system I described in my report until such time as they can be exchanged for Caldari prisoners. Or until hostilities end - which would be the better solution.


And there you have it folks, facts from the source without Ad hominem!

Next time on Questions and Courtesy with Anslo, we learn how to ask for the time WITHOUT insulting someone's familial heritage!

Tune in and see you all next week folks!

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#29 - 2013-07-15 20:33:16 UTC
Makkal Hanaya wrote:
While I appreciate the transparency, an agent of Pyre telling me how well Pyre treats its POWs isn't as meaningful as a non-affiliated, or even a Republic or Federation affiliated, person telling me the same.


I don't see how I could deliver the report I promised in any way other than as an agent of Pyre.

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.
Scherezad
Revenent Defence Corperation
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
#30 - 2013-07-15 20:38:09 UTC
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
Makkal Hanaya wrote:
While I appreciate the transparency, an agent of Pyre telling me how well Pyre treats its POWs isn't as meaningful as a non-affiliated, or even a Republic or Federation affiliated, person telling me the same.


I don't see how I could deliver the report I promised in any way other than as an agent of Pyre.


Perhaps you could offer a tour to an uninterested third party? That would be the best way to clear this unfortunate allegation.
Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#31 - 2013-07-15 20:40:01 UTC
I'll pass the idea up the chain. Frankly, command is already irritated by this whole thing, so I'm not sure what kind of buy-in I could get.

Who would make a good third-party and be willing to do the tour?

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.
Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
#32 - 2013-07-15 20:42:09 UTC
Diana Kim wrote:
However, gallentean swines used to call slavery whatever they don't understand, just to attack and kill Caldari citizens.


Ok I will almost agree with you here. Looks like Tali is just looking for cheap political propaganda points in the sadly usual fashion, which is as you said: Slapping a "slavery" label on anything that didn't come from the Roden Approved PseudoDemocracy. The Federation loves to that, naturally, as it lets their government spoon feed a false sense of casus belli in their wars of aggression & conquest. Fooling themselves into thinking that they're "liberating" the people that they, themselves, are enslaving (oh sorry, "Offering new lives in the glorious Federation workplace ... whether they like it or not").

Yes, the Empire has used very similar arguments in the past during own age of expansion. This is not a denial. Just pointing out that the Federation does the exact same thing but then lies about it to their own people. The Empire is not afraid to call slavery slavery. The Federation, on the other hand, likes to peel that label off their own "indentured workforce" and slap it onto other people's instead. Pure classic Federation hypocrisy at it's finest.

From what I've read, it looks like the State is doing a fair & impartial job of handling their POWs. I'd rather be captured by them than plenty of other groups I could name. I'm just glad that my mother was Amarrian, because being, in the Republic's words, a "mongrel halfbreed" I was not eligible for the "Pureblood Warriors Motherhood Program" when they kidnapped me all those years ago. I can't say the same for all the other young women they abducted. And then there's the Blood Raiders, Sansha's Nation, along with various petty nullsec bandit kingdoms that make even them look sane & humanitarian in comparison. New Eden can be a very sick, sick place indeed.

All things considered, being a POW to Pyre looks like a nice vacation compared to the seemingly endless depths of cruelty & depravity that mankind is capable of.

http://youtu.be/t0q2F8NsYQ0
Steffanie Saissore
Tyrathlion Interstellar
#33 - 2013-07-15 21:56:03 UTC
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
I'll pass the idea up the chain. Frankly, command is already irritated by this whole thing, so I'm not sure what kind of buy-in I could get.

Who would make a good third-party and be willing to do the tour?


Pieter,
I would offer myself as an un-biased third party willing to take the tour. I am not associated with Pyre nor am allied with the corporation and I have no allegiances within Khanid.

We travel in the dark of the new moon,

A starry highway traced on the map of the sky
Desiderya
Blue Canary
Watch This
#34 - 2013-07-15 22:33:38 UTC
There won't be tours at this point. We're talking about high-security detention centres and not town fairs, after all, and it does not matter how much information is revealed - it will never be enough or credible for some, especially not those who like to see evil ghosts at every turn of the road.

Ruthlessness is the kindness of the wise.
Makoto Priano
Kirkinen-Arataka Transhuman Zenith Consulting Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#35 - 2013-07-15 22:41:25 UTC
I would suspect any Sisters-affiliated group would serve best in this role. Failing that, a moderate Federation agency; this is to say, someone other than Soter, or similarly-minded Gallente. Mind, any inspection of Pyre facilities would best be compared with an inspection of comparable Federal facilities to ensure equal review.

Ideally, the treatment of POWs will be equivalent between the nations involved.

As an uninvolved party, it sounds as if the Combine is engaged in a good-faith effort to ensure the fair treatment of its prisoners.

Ms. Kernher, what you suggest is tantamount to a war crime. When engaged in rescue activities, one is required to make a good faith effort to save as many survivors as possible regardless of their affiliation. To do otherwise is to knowingly abandon others to death; while one does not directly take their life, one ensures their death. We could argue situations where there are hazards, whether continued combat or environmental hazards. Still, despite this, the Combine and other forces in the warzone are duty-bound to offer aid to the crews of destroyed warships whenever possible. To do otherwise is to treat the foe as an animal, and to become one with one's abandonment of duty.

Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries: exploring the edge of the known, advancing the state of the art. Would you like to know more?
Veikitamo Gesakaarin
Doomheim
#36 - 2013-07-15 22:54:51 UTC
Makkal Hanaya wrote:
While I appreciate the transparency, an agent of Pyre telling me how well Pyre treats its POWs isn't as meaningful as a non-affiliated, or even a Republic or Federation affiliated, person telling me the same.


Whilst I may appreciate your concern, this report presented by Operative Tuulinen was a courtesy extended and largesse I have granted since I am at present under no legal obligations to do otherwise.

If it is deemed insufficient by some to act as placation of doubts, then that quite frankly is not my own particular concern at present.

Kurilaivonen|Concern
Katrina Oniseki
Oniseki-Raata Internal Watch
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
#37 - 2013-07-15 23:01:37 UTC
If, say, Ishuk-Raata arranged the development of labor programs for these POWs down in Syndicate, and Pyre were to transfer them to us... would this satisfy? Perhaps it would offer a more tasteful alternative, for PR purposes.

Do contact us if you're interested, Chairwoman.

Katrina Oniseki
Ralyn Longs
Czarni Husarze Uderzaja Drapieznie
Pandemic Horde
#38 - 2013-07-16 00:38:49 UTC
Tali Ambraelle wrote:
So now the State turns to slavery to 'offset' costs of a system that was not needed.

Shocking.

I suppose it was only a matter of time.


My dear pilot, if you think this slavery then I suggest you open your eyes.
Silas Vitalia
Doomheim
#39 - 2013-07-16 00:40:08 UTC
Welcome to Khanid!

I'm pleased to see Pyre Falcon Defence Combine enjoying our hospitality and making some profits at the same time.

My offer is still on the table to take all of those pesky POW's off your hands. I promise plenty of fun for everyone when in my custody.

Until that happens though, any of you crossing the border into Kingdom lowsec will be flayed. One and only warning! *smiles*



Sabik now, Sabik forever
Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#40 - 2013-07-16 01:01:31 UTC
Silas Vitalia wrote:
Welcome to Khanid!

I'm pleased to see Pyre Falcon Defence Combine enjoying our hospitality and making some profits at the same time.

My offer is still on the table to take all of those pesky POW's off your hands. I promise plenty of fun for everyone when in my custody.

Until that happens though, any of you crossing the border into Kingdom lowsec will be flayed. One and only warning! *smiles*


Only if the sluggish tinselled barges you fly can catch us, My Lady.

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.