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Your opinion on Jaguar and Wolf these days?
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Meditril
Hoplite Brigade
Ushra'Khan
#1 - 2013-07-09 15:08:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Meditril
As the subject says, what is your opinion on Jaguar and Wolf these days. What fittings you found most useful for PVP? Would you consider them over or underpowered when compared to the other assault frigates?

Prior the T1 cruiser buff I found the Dual-Prop-Jaguar very useful in fighting T1 cruisers, but since now most of the T1 cruisers can easily fit dual webs this job turned into a suicide mission. How heavily is the TE nerv hitting the Arty-Wolf?
Chessur
Full Broadside
Deepwater Hooligans
#2 - 2013-07-09 15:52:21 UTC
Meditril wrote:
As the subject says, what is your opinion on Jaguar and Wolf these days. What fittings you found most useful for PVP? Would you consider them over or underpowered when compared to the other assault frigates?

Prior the T1 cruiser buff I found the Dual-Prop-Jaguar very useful in fighting T1 cruisers, but since now most of the T1 cruisers can easily fit dual webs this job turned into a suicide mission. How heavily is the TE nerv hitting the Arty-Wolf?


So AF's are always going to be bad when compared to the T1 cruisers. T1 cruisers received such a huge buff, that frankly they are far and away the best ships in the game currently when you look at cost / effectiveness.

But for AF's:

Jag has always been MEH in my book. I don't really find it that good or useful.

On the other hand, the arty wolf is one of the best solo PvP frigs in existence currently. While the TE nurf does effect falloff boats, I feel that the wolf is still very effective when fit and flown properly. It is hands down one of the Top 5 Frigs ATM
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#3 - 2013-07-09 16:34:24 UTC
The Jag is ****. It has been **** for ages

Wolf is alright.

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

Shinjo Bajahnhosuu
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2013-07-09 23:15:19 UTC
Chessur wrote:
[quote=Meditril]
On the other hand, the arty wolf is one of the best solo PvP frigs in existence currently. While the TE nurf does effect falloff boats, I feel that the wolf is still very effective when fit and flown properly. It is hands down one of the Top 5 Frigs ATM


Share a preferred fit?
Zarnak Wulf
Task Force 641
Empyrean Edict
#5 - 2013-07-09 23:44:12 UTC
Minmatar has a total of three ships with an optimal range bonus:

Thrasher
Jaguar
Muninn

I can make an argument about Destroyers being special snowflakes and balancing with regards to the Thrasher. The other two ships simply struggle. It's probably time to do away with the optimal bonus for Minmatar. Change the Jag's optimal bonus to a falloff bonus. Damage projection is it's Achilles Heel. Give it more Armour so it has a multitude of fitting options. My two cents.
Chessur
Full Broadside
Deepwater Hooligans
#6 - 2013-07-10 01:44:45 UTC
Shinjo Bajahnhosuu wrote:
Chessur wrote:
[quote=Meditril]
On the other hand, the arty wolf is one of the best solo PvP frigs in existence currently. While the TE nurf does effect falloff boats, I feel that the wolf is still very effective when fit and flown properly. It is hands down one of the Top 5 Frigs ATM


Share a preferred fit?


[Wolf, artywolf]
Micro Auxiliary Power Core I
Co-Processor II
Gyrostabilizer II
Tracking Enhancer II
Fourier Transform Tracking Program

Warp Disruptor II
Limited 1MN Microwarpdrive I

280mm Howitzer Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP S
280mm Howitzer Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP S
280mm Howitzer Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP S
280mm Howitzer Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP S
[empty high slot]

Small Projectile Collision Accelerator II
Small Projectile Ambit Extension I


[Wolf, artywolf easier fitting]
Micro Auxiliary Power Core II
Co-Processor II
Gyrostabilizer II
Fourier Transform Tracking Program
Fourier Transform Tracking Program

Warp Disruptor II
Limited 1MN Microwarpdrive I

280mm Howitzer Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP S
280mm Howitzer Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP S
280mm Howitzer Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP S
280mm Howitzer Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP S
[empty high slot]

Small Projectile Collision Accelerator II
Small Projectile Ambit Extension I

[Wolf, artywolf meta point]
Micro Auxiliary Power Core I
Fourier Transform Tracking Program
Gyrostabilizer II
Nanofiber Internal Structure II
Fourier Transform Tracking Program

Faint Warp Disruptor I
Limited 1MN Microwarpdrive I

280mm Howitzer Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP S
280mm Howitzer Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP S
280mm Howitzer Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP S
280mm Howitzer Artillery II, Republic Fleet EMP S
[empty high slot]

Small Projectile Collision Accelerator II
Small Projectile Ambit Extension I

Just some pretty standard fits really

From Crendraven
Milton Middleson
Rifterlings
#7 - 2013-07-10 03:07:29 UTC
The Jag is probably the weakest Assault Frigate when considered as an Assault Frigate, but it has some practical application as a durable chase tackler. But AFs are basically expensive toys right now anyway.

I don't think much of the Wolf, either, but I also almost never fly it.

Quote:
Change the Jag's optimal bonus to a falloff bonus.

What a boring solution. It'd mean the two Minmatar AFs have an identical set of bonuses and the same weapon system. Make the Jag a missile boat.
Vyktor Abyss
Abyss Research
#8 - 2013-07-10 18:08:16 UTC
Both are "meh".
Roweship
Doomheim
#9 - 2013-07-10 19:52:15 UTC
Welcome to the age of Mehmatar may it last a thousand years Big smile
Taoist Dragon
Okata Syndicate
#10 - 2013-07-10 21:05:19 UTC
I for one am glad that minmatar is no longer considered 'winmatar' however I feel that minmata ship feel even more 'minmatar' than ever before and I've been flying them more since the rebalance than ever.

They are no longer 'better' than most but they are still good at what they do. They are skirmishers at heart and still have that ability if you know how to do it.

As for the Jag I put that firmly in the same place that the rifter now shares - In the hands of a skilled pilot it will surprise people how effective it can be but is generally assumed as crap since the other AF got their buffs. It is still the fastest AF out there and can be faster than most of the T1 'combat' frigs (from the fits I have and have encountered)

Now the wolf I have always liked but I know a lot of people who automatically assume any ship with just 2 mids is bad. It is hard hiting with either AC's or Arty and can be a tough nut to crack when fitted to brawl.

In short I like them both, more so now that minmatar are seemingly getting the short end of the rebalances.

That is the Way, the Tao.

Balance is everything.
Derek Wiildstar
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2013-07-11 00:30:38 UTC
[quote=Milton Middleson
Make the Jag a missile boat.[/quote]

That would rock.
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#12 - 2013-07-11 03:11:42 UTC
Jag should be missiles and active shield tanking obviously.

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

Liam Inkuras
Furnace
Thermodynamics
#13 - 2013-07-11 03:27:40 UTC
Garviel Tarrant wrote:
Jag should be missiles and active shield tanking obviously.

Gimme 'dat T2 Breacher baby Cool

I wear my goggles at night.

Any spelling/grammatical errors come complimentary with my typing on a phone
Zarnak Wulf
Task Force 641
Empyrean Edict
#14 - 2013-07-11 04:24:08 UTC
*cough cough* Hawk! *cough cough* Roll
Maru Sha
The Department of Justice
#15 - 2013-07-11 08:08:26 UTC
The Jaguar as a missile boat? Hell no! Use a breacher if you have to have a missile boat.

I strongly agree with this guy here ... the Jaguar is all about versatility. I have roughly between 20 to 30 different fittings for it (solo, no gang boost, no special implants, no drugs). I think everybody with a little bit of creativity should be able to find his/her own nice fitting. I always found the Jaguar so much fun to fly ... I never really botherd with the wolf (which is a pity, I know).
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#16 - 2013-07-11 08:28:51 UTC
Zarnak Wulf wrote:
*cough cough* Hawk! *cough cough* Roll




You're right, silly hawk.. using a minnie bonus..

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

Syrias Bizniz
some random local shitlords
#17 - 2013-07-11 17:07:15 UTC
I like the jag. It works well. And everyone underestimates it. Like, they stay in hope of an easy kill and start panicking once they reckognize that they are the easy kill.
Brainbashi
Make-EVE-Great-Again
NO NEED LOOSE FACE
#18 - 2013-07-11 20:12:01 UTC
When you look into Wolf´s hull bonuses there is a lot of potential for awesome kiting platform. Dual damage boost is awesome on volley ship not to mention tracking and falloff bonus but the poor capacitor criples it. It is hard to run MWD and long point with those numbers.
But on the other hand. Small 5 man fleet where you have one Hyena, Keres and 3Wolfs can be really deadly.

Jaguar is ship what I personally haven´t yet found too much of a use. It also have potential expesially against Amarr ships but there another hulls what can perform equally well if not even better.
Major Killz
inglorious bastards.
#19 - 2013-07-11 21:53:23 UTC
ART Wolf is sh!t compared to rail-gun Harpy, Thrasher and Talwar. At least solo. Like I've said in the past; in fleets of 2 or more they can be deadly and end engagements hella quickly which is something you'd want.

The Jaguar is harder to judge because I can use set-ups that can if not win cannot lose against another assault frigate. There's a lot of interesting set-ups like 10mn-dual Asb-dual MSE-Interceptor-ART- dual SAR- Armour plate-JAGUAR.

I find a fleet of jaguars backup by logistics to be hella deadly compared to other such fleets. Obvi Retribution fleets with logi are more deadly. Same could be said about Ishkurs too but dont see much of those fleets.

So! I would say they'er not the best at anything but good at everything.

For skirmishing go: Harpy > Enyo > Wolf

For balls deep go -> Hawk > Vengeance > Ishkur (jag would most likely be at the end of this list, like the last..)

[u]Ich bin ein Pirat ！[/u]
Taoist Dragon
Okata Syndicate
#20 - 2013-07-11 21:58:53 UTC
Jag (like the rifter) is generally considered the weakest of the AF's

This is good....means you get more fights in them! Twisted

That is the Way, the Tao.

Balance is everything.
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