Ships & Modules

Check your numbers. They're off to say the least.

Also, make sure you compare T2 to T2 or T1 to T1. That accounts for your price difference and then some.

@Zhilia Mann: I'm not trying to be daft, but what numbers, exactly, are off? I'm referring to the numbers under the "Attributes" tab in the Information window....

@Tsukino Stareine: I know I am comparing these two different Tech level / Meta level modules.

What I'm asking is, all this considered, is there something I am missing in the numbers?

Disregarding materials costs, etc. , which don't matter to me, as I am a potential buyer, why would I in theory choose one over the other, especially considering the price?

Ie, as a security mission runner, what's my motivation to buy the Tech II over the regular 220mm Vulcan?

I'm bored; let's look at the other comparison. Here, we compare D180 IIs to 220 IIs (same meta level; I could have picked the base item but I tend to like to use T2 for baseline comparisons for whatever reason).

D180s have:

+ Higher capacity; more time between reloads
+ Lower power requirements
+ Lower CPU requirements
+ Lower duration (less time between shots)
- Lower optimal
- Lower damage mod
- Less falloff
+ Higher tracking

If we just count up benefits, it looks like D180s come out on top of 220s. But they really don't. And it's all about range and that damage mod.

Unfortunately, the D180s have a wretched 8000m falloff; 220s get an extra 10%. 220s also get about 10% more optimal. As a result, 220s hit better further out, so you don't have to get as close to your target to apply significant damage.

And then there's the extra 10% base damage. Now, this has to be thrown into a comparison between rate of fire and raw damage to get a basic idea of base DPS for each gun. For D180s, we get 2.475/4.5 = .55 base comparison DPS. For 220s, we get 2.772/4.725 = .587 base comparison DPS. It's not a whole lot more, but it's definitely more.

Once we factor in falloff mechanics, we can safely say that the 220s will start to significantly outdamage D180s at about optimal+1/2 falloff for the D180s -- while the 220s are still safely on the "not too much falloff" side of things. (Optimal + 1/2 falloff is considered to be ~80% of raw listed damage.)

And so in general, the bigger gun here is better. Now, that gets complicated if you're orbiting or being orbited very quickly or very close. There, the increased tracking on the D180s overcomes the range issues -- and the end up being the better gun. But if you find yourself in that spot in missions with any regularity you're Doing It Wrong™.

"Doing It Wrong™."

Pretty much!

Just trying to strike some sort of balance for mid- / high-end Level 3's, on a budget.

I actively pilot on such missions, so I approach (for the line-of-sight ease) until about 14k - 11k, then I start orbiting at +/- 7.5k.

For most missions, this is OK, but for those with lots of opposition cruisers, or those with 1+ BS, I have a heck of a time.

I'm trying to work on a fit with < Tech II modules that can reasonably compete at this level.

Just to clarify--comping Tech I vs Tech II is meaningless? Ie, there are multipliers hidden in advanced skill levels and special ammo types?

Thanks again!

I wouldn't say it's "meaningless", but you do have to know what you're doing -- and yes, that involves accounting for the spec skills and T2 ammo types.

As a general rule, T2 guns are simply the best guns out there in common usage. They have the same paper stats as meta 4 guns (in the case of ACs, 'Scout' variations) but the T2s are harder to fit. What you don't see in there are the spec skills, which actually make T2 guns better than anything except officer guns, and officer guns a) are stupid to use, b) still can't use T2 ammo, and c) don't come in medium variations anyhow.

So yeah. There's a reason everyone uses T2 guns. Meta 4 guns are nearly as good -- but still not quite there. Doubly so when you have really great T2 ammo types (Scorch, Barrage, etc).

I really appreciate all the information everyone--definitely helping me pick a sensible approach to flying what are currently fairly difficult missions for me.

Also, @Sun Win, I appreciate your observation about the economy. It didn't occur to me initially, but since you mentioned it, I can see it everywhere, across almost all classes of merchandise.

T2 Ammo also isn't something to overlook. Scorch, Barrage, and Null all make a huge difference in the ability of close-ranged ships to project damage. I'd honestly go so far as to say that quite a few ship types really don't function without it (ie, a kiting Stabber without Barrage or a Talos without Null),

Did I just read that

The actual reason you're having trouble is that you're comparing a Dual 180mm AC II on the market to a 220mm Vulcan AC I on your ship.

The stats for the one on your ship are shown with skills, hull bonuses, and damage/tracking/range mods taken into account. Stats for a gun on the market are not. If you look at a 220mm Vulcan AC I on the market you'll find its base stats are dramatically inferior to the 180mm AC II, as expected.