EVE General Discussion

People who want WiS and think that Incarna just needs 'a little more effort' are poorly informed who haven't actually kept up with the info that the community has access to. CQ on its own was poorly optimized at best and in a larger station environment current engine couldn't handle more than 2-3 (iirc) avatars. The technology simply doesn't work for what the people want it for. Cry and moan all you want for the space barbies you desire so badly, but all you'd get is a little room to sit in by yourself. WiS is a stupid waste of resources and until technology catches up it has absolutely no place in EVE. Incarna's development almost killed EVE and I don't think CCP has any intentions to risk that again any time soon.

Incarna's what caused that huge drop in subscriptions. The community backlash against Incarna was so bad and subscription losses substantial enough they had to lay people off and practically shelve development on their other MMO - World of Darkness.

I think the message was pretty clear.

I feel an strange urge to post in this thread. I know I should not, but I must post nonetheless.

The fact that after a huge fallout, popular uprising and real voting (with our wallets) having crashed mostly everything that Incarna was supposed to be and mean, all I can remember is the Sig of someone in the forums saying shortly something like this, need exact citation if someone can help me : A DEVELOPER SHOULD NOT SAY THEIR PRODUCT IS AWESOME AND THE CREAM OF THE TOP , ONLY SUBSCRIBERS SHOULD DO THAT.

Take the Mac for instance, the higher ADVERTISING they have is costumers themselves, even their motto of "Think Different" is not implying anything. YOU as an end user fill the gap.

Why I use this marketing ploy as an example on Incarna? Easy, Incarna went beyond regular game expansions by IMPLYING it was BETTER for US without asking. This 60 pages long thread is proof that the ILLUSION OF CHOICE IS a key point in selling everything, even the fecal matter Incarna was.

And this leads to another subpoint on my point building post, CCP for some strange reasons seems to OFFER limited choices in their sandbox game. This is not about how WE WANT OR NOT WIS or FIS or Flying Space Monkeys decked in rebalanced Blasters that shoot poo.

In a sense what everyone here is discussing is the lack of CHOICES CCP is presenting us and presented us, leading to their OBVIOUS downfall a couple months ago.

Its not about "bad attitudes' trollin', carebearism, lack of real life $ or whatever excuse you want to put.

The Problem lies with CCP itself, not the userbase, I have blasted over and over in the forums for quite a while, how CCP seems a bit shortsighted in the GIVING CHOICE department in their products.

"BUT, BUT THIS IS A SANDBOX GAME, you TROLL!!"

No sir, you going to the argument of the game is irrelevant to the higher point I'm implying. Same as talking about Nex or this or that.

What we are seeing here in this threadnaught is a clear lack of vision from CCP in the area of Game Direction. Though I admire Papercut's improvements, they boiled down to a long overdue PATCH. Crucible was a knee-jerk reaction to the plummeting value of CCP as a company.

People still think that the protesters , myself included, just wanted to vent "negative" vibes or some other nonsense. When you observe the social phenomena Monoclegate was, it was simply a reaction to the lack of choices and the perception of how the community was so alienated , both ingame and out of it, that even a simple MEME could topple CCP in the only place it hurts them, MONEY.

It is my extremely humble opinion, if CCP is reading this thread, they begin to collate and UNDERSTAND they have serious ISSUES in the way they Market their virtual goods.

Choice is a right, even if its an imaginary one.

Also as a protip: google product introduction theory

You failed.

You are right, Incarna sucked, but Incarna was not WiS. Equating them is a mistake.
Even from the WiS perpective, Incarna sucked. The backlash was because of the lack of content (only one CQ with the door closed), gameplay and the NEX-T-2-useless Store.

I, for one, want to get more WiS. CCP has to find the right balance or FiS and WiS in each expansion.
I would love to explore an abandoned BS or Space Station. I would love to hang out in my Corp lounge/offices. I would like to stroll down Jita promenade.

First comes WiS and then...pets.

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A lot of people are talking as if they know the facts when they really don't. CCP are the only ones who know but i'll give you my point of view...

There were multiple reasons why people reacted so badly to Incarna. The primary factor was the ludicrous prices seen on the NEX store. The issue of microtransaction games is a very touchy subject for the gaming community and it just so happened that CCP management made all the wrong decisions. Add this to the fact CQ not only effected the performance of some computers, CCP forced players to experience CQ by removing ship spinning. Nobody wanted this from WIS.

WIS was meant to be an addition, not a change to the existing experience. The first i saw of WIS was the fan fest video showing an avatar walking round a public area where we could interact with others and own retail. Then later we were told we would be able to do things like play games/gamble or deal boosters face to face. The last thing we saw came in the form of the Future Vision trailer that suggested we would be doing multiple things on stations including combat in some form...

Some would consider what we were told and what was delivered false advertisement.

The intention of this thread is to let CCP know that a lot of us want the WIS that was shown to us initially.

Now that some time has passed since that Hilmar guys (spelling?) letter to the community, and in response to the WIS threads that are around, i think CCP need to clarify what's going on behind closed doors.

You're right - people have been subscribing to this game for years just waiting for the day WIS would be a reality and unsubbed en masse when that wasn't realized



A lot of people who unsubbed aren't coming back. EVE has been on a downward trend since earlier this year (check the all-time concurrent users graph) and it only accelerated after Incarna. Crucible is a step in the right direction, but it may be too late.

Holy ******* ****! I read that and I swear to god I had an orgasm! Exploring an abandoned BS or Station as part of a mission or storyline would be ******* sweet. Yeah yeah...Carebear stuff...I know...but still.

Can you imagine what EVE would be like if all the whiners that dismiss Incarna as 'visual fluff', had their way?

We wouldn't have the trinity graphics engine, revamped planets, V3 textures, new warp effects, ship trails, new turrets, new shadows, new character creater, updated ship models, new weapon effects, revamped asteroid models.

Just to name a few.

All of these things enhance gameplay, even though they could be classified as 'visual fluff'.

you are making the assumption that it would be empty and that everyone would just be standing around which is based off of only your perception of what WIS could be or mean for the game. which means you have either no imagination or a very limited one.