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CCP! Please clarify the future plans for WiS!

First post
Author
Hans Jagerblitzen
Ice Fire Warriors
#21 - 2011-10-24 20:22:38 UTC
Ranger 1 wrote:
The vast majority of the player base does still want WIS, there has been increasing demand for some years now.

However:

They want it implemented in the way that was outlined in the beginning, with engaging game play that made sense to take place in that environment.

They want it developed to the point that it is worthwhile before it is released.

They want it developed with a REASONABLE percentage of Dev resources devoted to it, not most of them.

They want it to be tech stable before it is released, and running smoothly.

They want it to be optional.

They want it to compliment and enhance FIS content.

They want any items produced by/for Incarna to be produced by the community and tie directly into the existing industry infra structure.

Simply put, they want it to be worth while, fun, and have a point.

Until they get a handle on how to do this, further development is pointless.

Work on the plan, not the product at this point.


They also want it delivered on their timetable,

they also want ponies

they also want it to cost them nothing

they also want their personal pet projects updated

they also want Hilmar's head as an in-game item they can loot and blow up

they also want the world.



It's easy to want stuff, its not easy to patiently accept the fact that this is all code that has to be programmed from nothing, and it takes time, costs money, and since its never been done before, its going to have bugs.

CPM0 Chairman / CSM7 Vice Secretary

Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#22 - 2011-10-24 20:24:48 UTC
Myfanwy Heimdal wrote:
Walking in Stations is a huge task and one which really hadn't been thought out properly.

We're talking stations of over 20 km in size. How are we going to walk around that lot? What are we going to do in there? In fact, what is in all those thousands of miles of corridors and how are we going to interact?

I've seen other games where we've had taverns in towns where players could meet and, always, they're empty. So, if we're wanting an Eve version of Mallory's Bar (The Gap) or that bar from Total Recall then we're going to have to have something worth our while going around walking in stations.

When I was playing other games I never once saw the point of towns or cities where we could meet other players. Not once did I say I'll spend the evening playing BadgerQuest or whatever and spend the time sitting around in a town. And neither did I once run into any players who were hanging around like extras in Westerns lounging around on the boardwalks.

In every MMO that I have played, players would come into town - because the had to - get whatever it was they had to have done done as fast as they could - and then beetle off to do some whatever they did out of the towns.

So, please tell me, and I mean this most sincerely, what possibly could CCP do to make walking in stations interesting or purposeful to the majority of players? I have, at the moment no interest in WiS and I can't see me every having any interest in doing so. CCP would have to pull a massive rabbit out of a hat to make me interested. And if they tried to force us to leave the pod to find an agent/repairshop/refinery then the recent rage would be nothing compared to that storm.

Walking In Stations/ It's not going to work.


There have been countless suggestions from the player base that would provide fun, logical, immersive Incarna game play... far too many to repost here. You'll have to look at some of the countless Incarna related threads to find them, that is if you haven't already made up your mind.

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.

Kengutsi Akira
Doomheim
#23 - 2011-10-24 20:26:40 UTC
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:


they also want it to cost them nothing



To be fair, CCP brought this demand upon their own heads.

"Is it fair that CCP can get away with..." :: checks ownership on the box ::

Yes

Kengutsi Akira
Doomheim
#24 - 2011-10-24 20:30:23 UTC
Anela Cistine wrote:
Mr. Gorbachev tear down this door!


and/or roll back the game to before CQ and get these people that came to this game for the wrong reason out

"Is it fair that CCP can get away with..." :: checks ownership on the box ::

Yes

mkint
#25 - 2011-10-24 20:30:24 UTC
Tristan North wrote:
Paragon Renegade wrote:
Tristan North wrote:
mkint wrote:
hooray, yet another thread about how "I want EVE to die, so I can Barbie!"

edit: and depending on how you interpret the pacing of that interview, it could very easily be that Hilmar's intention is "I am working on FiS because players are making me. Once we've done that with a halfassed winter expansion, the summer is going to be an Apocrypha-sized WIS expansion." And gawd, I hope that's not true, but I have the horrible horrible feeling that it prove to be, and that it will be the final end of EVE.

Hooray, yet another post about how "I want just play with colored squares!"
Get out? Hooray!


Eve is a game about spaceships & explosions.

Unless WiS suddenly becomes a TPS/FPS with pules-pounding action & buttloads of explosions for hours on end, flying around in a spaceship is going to take more priority in a game set in space featuring spaceships.

More priority, agree, where did i say stop FiS for WiS?
I want a game that have both, but the FiS trolls prefer a game that will never see any improvement/change that is not in their interest.

That is what they did for 2 whole goddamned years. They had 6 dudes working on EVE, out of a company of 600 people. That's all kinds of fuckedup. CCP has NEVER said they are completely stopping development on barbie. I bet they are still keeping more than the 6 devs that EVE got. And for all those years that barbie was in development with most of that being focused on by 99% of the whole goddamned company, we got captains cupboard. Barbie was a BAD investment.

Fix EVE. Make it worth it to keep playing EVE. Extend the rookie burn rate beyond 6 months (the average career of the average rookie) out to 6 years. Then they can take all the time in the world to make barbie into more than just barbie.

Maxim 6. If violence wasn’t your last resort, you failed to resort to enough of it.

Paragon Renegade
Sebiestor Tribe
#26 - 2011-10-24 20:30:46 UTC
Tristan North wrote:

More priority, agree, where did i say stop FiS for WiS?
I want a game that have both, but the FiS trolls prefer a game that will never see any improvement/change that is not in their interest.


I would like establishments, smuggling & perhaps even WiS combat missions or whatever.

But putting WiS over FiS is a horrible idea, just by virtue of the game's premise.

The pie is a tautology

T'Laar Bok
#27 - 2011-10-24 20:32:41 UTC
WiS was CCPs attempt to appeal to the Agoraphobics niche of the market hence the single small room and big scary balcony of doom for the more brave.

Unfortunately they discovered its not that big of a niche.



Amphetimines are your friend.

http://eveboard.com/pilot/T'Laar_Bok

Kengutsi Akira
Doomheim
#28 - 2011-10-24 20:34:33 UTC
mkint wrote:
Tristan North wrote:
Paragon Renegade wrote:
Tristan North wrote:
mkint wrote:
hooray, yet another thread about how "I want EVE to die, so I can Barbie!"

edit: and depending on how you interpret the pacing of that interview, it could very easily be that Hilmar's intention is "I am working on FiS because players are making me. Once we've done that with a halfassed winter expansion, the summer is going to be an Apocrypha-sized WIS expansion." And gawd, I hope that's not true, but I have the horrible horrible feeling that it prove to be, and that it will be the final end of EVE.

Hooray, yet another post about how "I want just play with colored squares!"
Get out? Hooray!


Eve is a game about spaceships & explosions.

Unless WiS suddenly becomes a TPS/FPS with pules-pounding action & buttloads of explosions for hours on end, flying around in a spaceship is going to take more priority in a game set in space featuring spaceships.

More priority, agree, where did i say stop FiS for WiS?
I want a game that have both, but the FiS trolls prefer a game that will never see any improvement/change that is not in their interest.

That is what they did for 2 whole goddamned years. They had 6 dudes working on EVE, out of a company of 600 people. That's all kinds of fuckedup. CCP has NEVER said they are completely stopping development on barbie. I bet they are still keeping more than the 6 devs that EVE got. And for all those years that barbie was in development with most of that being focused on by 99% of the whole goddamned company, we got captains cupboard. Barbie was a BAD investment.

Fix EVE. Make it worth it to keep playing EVE. Extend the rookie burn rate beyond 6 months (the average career of the average rookie) out to 6 years. Then they can take all the time in the world to make barbie into more than just barbie.


Hell yes this.
Id much rather they turn away from this trend and work on the main game instead of a side game Ill never play. You WiS wanters saw the same chain of events we did, if you actually give a **** about this game and not just your feature of the month, youd shut the hell up and let CCP recover before making these demands. Id rather have EVE than let you guys **** it all up, **** over CCP and get this game destroyed listening to you.
If you want Barbie, there are a hell of a lot more games out there for you, get the hell out of the ONE that isnt this.
You wont be missed and you can even keep your stuff.

"Is it fair that CCP can get away with..." :: checks ownership on the box ::

Yes

Nick Bete
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#29 - 2011-10-24 20:35:47 UTC
Kudos to the unidimensional thinkers for creating a false dichotomy. To have Incarna fleshed out and delivered doesn't preclude the continuing evolution of the space combat portions of the game. They can peacefully co-exist; it's CCP's poor implementation of Incarna's debut that was the problem. Hilmar and company saw a well organized, very vocal and sizable group (whether that group truly represents the "will of the playerbase" I don't know) and got scared. Now they're moving the pendulum too far in the other direction and tossing us who wanted Incarna (as it was initially presented) under the bus.

A lot of people (me included) were, and still are, looking forward to being able to interact with other players in ways besides shooting at a soundless, zoomed out bunch of red icons on a HUD.

You guys saying "it's only 20%" who want Incarna (and you have no idea but, let's take your figure for the sake of argument) think about what impact it would have if CCP loses 20% of its subscribers. It probably wouldn't kill Eve but, in these economic times what business wants to risk cutting off 1/5 of its revenues like that?

Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#30 - 2011-10-24 20:37:31 UTC
Kengutsi Akira wrote:
Paragon Renegade wrote:
Tristan North wrote:
mkint wrote:
hooray, yet another thread about how "I want EVE to die, so I can Barbie!"

edit: and depending on how you interpret the pacing of that interview, it could very easily be that Hilmar's intention is "I am working on FiS because players are making me. Once we've done that with a halfassed winter expansion, the summer is going to be an Apocrypha-sized WIS expansion." And gawd, I hope that's not true, but I have the horrible horrible feeling that it prove to be, and that it will be the final end of EVE.

Hooray, yet another post about how "I want just play with colored squares!"
Get out? Hooray!


Eve is a game about spaceships & explosions.

Unless WiS suddenly becomes a TPS/FPS with pules-pounding action & buttloads of explosions for hours on end, flying around in a spaceship is going to take more priority in a game set in space featuring spaceships.


This.
Every time I see WiS people crying about their side game getting cancelled, I start hearing Charlie Sheen quotes. CCP deciding to work on WiS at this point is about as realistic as his claims.

Look, I know you all arent gonna realize this, but Ill take another stab at it anyways.

THE ONLY REASON WE FINALLY GOT WIS IS BECAUSE OF WoD.

WoD got SHELVED
WiS Got SHELVED

Its NOT a gigantic logical leap here guys n gals. WiS was Beta for WoD.

Check this out, I even have LINKS that support that claim
http://www.wodnews.net/Home/tabid/41/ctl/ArticleView/mid/401/articleId/69/New-WoD-MMO-info-from-The-Grand-Masquerade.aspx
Quote:
Incarna is actually considered a prototype, the rendering engine that will ship with the MMO will be much more advanced

They felt there was a reason to REASSURE THE WoD ppl that the engine in Incarna WASNT what was gonna ship with THEIR MMO

Now that WoD isnt coming out any time soon theyre not working on WiS. Hell they announced the "back burner"ing of both projects on the same day. They could have at least pretended there wasnt a connection but they didnt lol

Now I get that a lot of this delusional WiS crowd hasnt been in EVE long as they "Just signed up for WiS", but CCP has a track record. When they stop work on a feature. They dont go back to it. See Faction Warfare and a slew of others.
WiS will be worked on again when WoD is being worked on again, and not before.


You often make decent points and observations, but I need to point out...

CCP never kept it a secret that they were developing the Incarna tech for both games. Indeed, unifying development of one engine for both games is simply smart business. If you had a chance to develop a new and exciting Avatar based game AND use that technology to give your existing customers something they had been clamoring for years for you to develop, you'd do the same thing.

As for CCP never going back to something once they drop it, using FW an example is probably a bad choice considering that it will be a significant part of the Winter expansion. Big smile Not that they don't have a history of doing exactly that (with the exception of PI) but FW is a very bad example.

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.

xxxTRUSTxxx
Galactic Rangers
#31 - 2011-10-24 20:37:49 UTC
i think this is something that needs to be said.

with Fis you can DIE ! no matter where you are.

with Wis you can't, not even in low sec/null sec

how to fix FiS --------> oh hang on CCP already knows how to do this, nothing worth saying (many many threads about this)

how to fix WiS --------> do not release it until it is WiS and not WiCQ, also allow for the death of people on stations, use the exact same mechanics as high sec/low sec/null sec standings effect and concord response times.

then i bet WiS would be as much fun and have as much meaning as FiS.

walking around looking good,, this is what will make WiS a total failure, walking around shooting the **** out of people you have issues with,, now there's a game that people who love eve would be interested in and support fully. Big smile

anything else is NOT EVE !

oh on a side note, NEX store,, allow people to make **** and sell it on stations, CCP sell station production plex to allow people to produce and sell vanity items, CCP earns some extra cash and players get to drive the market.





Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#32 - 2011-10-24 20:37:53 UTC
I also want it. But if its just a fashion show, only a few role players will use it.

It needs content, and I want WiS with content. I do not want yet another feature to be abandoned.

Know a Frozen fan? Check this out

Frozen fanfiction

Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation
The Honda Accord
#33 - 2011-10-24 20:38:50 UTC
Written Word wrote:
We don't have WIS because the Carbon platform is a complete failure and they can't fix it within a remotely acceptable timetable. Nothing to do with customer outcry.


^^^^^
This

Bottom line, WiS station was promised before CCP bet on the new shiny of Carbon. Carbon is not a viable engine for WiS. CCP needs to go back and consider using another engine (like the one being used for Dust that will also has a PC version) and deliver this feature. Everyone I know wants WiS and just pulling the plug with CQ is lame.

Issler
arcca jeth
Dark Alliance
#34 - 2011-10-24 20:39:21 UTC
Everyone knows the forum posters are the vocal minority, there are lots of players that never even come here. and with some of the regular posters, i wouldn't blame them. if someone doesnt like your idea or opinion you get the trendy "Get Out" or "Leave my game alone" or whatever the troll/flamer feels like spouting off because they really just have narrow minds and think that they are the supreme know it alls and "OMGWHYDOESNTCCPHIREMETOHELPTHEMDEVELOPTHEIRGAMETOMYLIKINGSWTFBBQSAUZEIOWN"
there are a lot of players with different play styles and varying different views on FIS/WIS. Like the decision has to be ONE over the OTHER, nope absolutely cannot be BOTH.

CCP should do the smart thing, survey their subscribers/non-subscribers. I wouldn't rely on trolls for my information on what the players want. all the naysayers are buddies anyways, and they will just swarm here to counter your idea or suggestion just to pummel you with negativity, then say "look CCP, see, we don't want this!"

I am happy just to see the EVE Devs working on EVE, a game that I subscribe to with 4 accounts. I'm not playing for WOD and I'm not playing for DUST. In the end, if i see progress in EVE, whether or not it suits my game play preferences, I am happy none the less.
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
#35 - 2011-10-24 20:40:27 UTC
Paragon Renegade wrote:


Unless WiS suddenly becomes a TPS/FPS with pules-pounding action & buttloads of explosions for hours on end, flying around in a spaceship is going to take more priority in a game set in space featuring spaceships.


LOL an MMO player talking about FPS. Like any of you have a clue.

EVE, like all MMOs, is easymode, low skill gaming. If you can PVP with a mouse in one hand and a slice of pizza in the other then you are the typical MMO player. Don't even dare to think about incorporating a game of skill into EVE.

This is why Dust needs to be released sooner than later. A lot of people want a twitch skill game. EVE is losing out on a vast part of the gaming market.

If you added anything in EVE that required the use of the WASD keys(walking, for instance), half the playerbase would (threaten to) quit. Oh wait...

Mr Epeen Cool
Khazarn Areth
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#36 - 2011-10-24 20:45:30 UTC
Id very much like WiS but what i want more than that is spaceship suff Pirate

Bloody Omir's coming back Monsters from the endless black Wading through a crimson flood Omir's come to drink your blood

Scatim Helicon
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#37 - 2011-10-24 20:47:29 UTC
I want interesting and usable content.

Captain's Quarters has been a pathetic failure on this count, so it can die in a fire.

Every time you post a WiS thread, Hilmar strangles a kitten.

Mina Sebiestar
Minmatar Inner Space Conglomerate
#38 - 2011-10-24 20:49:13 UTC
No walking in station is nonessential not working not interesting part of the game .

Vision that CCP shoved us is years(maybe never) away only thing we got and will got if wis is to continue is nex joke with poker and similar crap that are nothing more than "cheap lack of idea product" no thanks go ruin some other game.

You choke behind a smile a fake behind the fear

Because >>I is too hard

Tristan North
The Scope
#39 - 2011-10-24 20:51:35 UTC
Kengutsi Akira wrote:


Hell yes this.
Id much rather they turn away from this trend and work on the main game instead of a side game Ill never play. You WiS wanters saw the same chain of events we did, if you actually give a **** about this game and not just your feature of the month, youd shut the hell up and let CCP recover before making these demands. Id rather have EVE than let you guys **** it all up, **** over CCP and get this game destroyed listening to you.
If you want Barbie, there are a hell of a lot more games out there for you, get the hell out of the ONE that isnt this.
You wont be missed and you can even keep your stuff.

CCP didn't spend years with all the devs working on WiS, they weren't even working on EvE.
It's obvious untill you're ********.
Cyra Mangeiri
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#40 - 2011-10-24 20:52:19 UTC
All the trolls aside, yeah, some of us do want WiS, and have done so since who knows when. Current implementation aside (see what I did there?), it would be an awesome addition to the Science Fiction game with spaceships I started to pay for.

There's an immense amount of lore and backstory for EVE, but only one fourth of it is in the spaceship department. Spaceships do tie in with the rest of it, but it's not the whole damn thing. It's the arrogance of a few pilots that makes it seem more important than it is in the big picture, and the arrogance of few vocal ones was what led SOE astray with SWG... Don't do the same mistake all over again.

EVE is about spaceships, yes, but that's not ALL it is about, and there's only so much content for spaceships you can make in the end. Developing different types of content and making it all work together is a lot of work, but it will open up combinations that expand the amount of things you can do exponentially (at least in an ideal situation).

Also, people constantly crying about BARBIE are obviously upset with their current avatars, so allow them a makeover, please Roll.