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Making a gank cost something

First post
Author
Lipbite
Express Hauler
#21 - 2013-07-01 05:17:10 UTC
There are players who literally farm suicide gankers in mission hubs - both during ganks (often saving target ship by killing gankers faster) and afterwards by using killrights. You can do the same - including podding.
Ace Uoweme
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#22 - 2013-07-01 05:19:30 UTC
Q 5 wrote:
With the introduction of these "tags" ganking means nothing to pirates and mega corps like Goonswarm and other 0.0 corps, put some kind of consequence in ganking (and no losing their ship means nothing)


Which makes PvP in EvE almost pointless.

The Goons said they wanted to destroy EvE, well this is how it's done: make it too expensive too PvP and control the means to create the best stuff ingame to hyper-inflate.

In WoW it's consequence free with the jackwads ganking; in EvE there's to many consequences that only the jackwads gank.

_"In a world of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act." _ ~George Orwell

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#23 - 2013-07-01 05:38:21 UTC
Ace Uoweme wrote:
Which makes PvP in EvE almost pointless.

The Goons said they wanted to destroy EvE, well this is how it's done: make it too expensive too PvP and control the means to create the best stuff ingame to hyper-inflate.
Which one is it? Is it almost pointless or is it very very expensive?

Also, no-one controls the means to create “the best stuff” in-game, and there is no inflation to speak of.

Oh, and tags have pretty much nothing to do with PvP having a point.
Q 5
999 HOLDINGS LLC
#24 - 2013-07-01 05:50:35 UTC
Hogarth Starbanger wrote:
What you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent suggestion were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this thread is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.


Yeah now everyone else is closer to where you have always been...I'm going to get me a kale juice straight up, night folksRoll
Eugene Kerner
TunDraGon
The Initiative.
#25 - 2013-07-01 05:51:53 UTC
With some luck tags drop from guys that farm them when I gank them...it would be like...magic!!!

TunDraGon is recruiting! "Also, your boobs [:o] "   CCP Eterne, 2012 "When in doubt...make a diȼk joke." Robin Williams - RIP

Ace Uoweme
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#26 - 2013-07-01 05:54:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Ace Uoweme
Tippia wrote:
Is it almost pointless or is it very very expensive?

Also, no-one controls the means to create “the best stuff” in-game, and there is no inflation to speak of.

Oh, and tags have pretty much nothing to do with PvP having a point.


It's pointless because it IS too expensive.

You're becoming inbred Tippia if you think 100% inflation since 2010 is "no inflation to speak of".

WoW controlled inflation despite every Chinese farmer in existence was there operating. It's why even with "free gold" now in WoW all over, when players see 15,000g boots they still balk. I left EvE in 2010, and came back in 2013 and it's outrageously priced now.

In RL market prices for goods doesn't sell for that high (people will riot!). I remember Polo shirts going for $25 in 1985 (the fad then), they aren't going for $250 now even with custom embroidery. It is in EvE, because of all the currency in circulation. The economists in EvE are Keynesian, and we know what Keynesian economics let too back in 1978.

_"In a world of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act." _ ~George Orwell

Q 5
999 HOLDINGS LLC
#27 - 2013-07-01 05:56:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Q 5
Eugene Kerner wrote:
With some luck tags drop from guys that farm them when I gank them...it would be like...magic!!!


I was thinking of parking a cloaky venture in a belt, say 4000km from juicy NPC waiting for farmer to come in, he pops rat and uncloak steal tags and run to safe spot, rinse and repeat Big smile.




Also my moobs O o
~
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#28 - 2013-07-01 06:32:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Ace Uoweme wrote:
It's pointless because it IS too expensive.
No. Which one is it? Is there no point to it, or is it too expensive? If it's the latter, then obviously there is a point: to ruin the other guy. If it's the former, then it's obviously too cheap since it has no effect.

Quote:
You're becoming inbred Tippia if you think 100% inflation since 2010 is "no inflation to speak of".
Good thing, then, that nothing of the sort has happened, and that we're looking at ~0% since 2007 and less than zero in an even longer perspective. You have to have been inbred and not travelled outside your own back yard to think otherwise (also, be clueless about economy in general).

Quote:
WoW controlled inflation
…in no way that is relevant to EVE since it did not have an actual player-run market as its centrepiece and engine. EVE controls its inflation by adjusting the influx and outflow of ISK and materials, and the market does the rest. In fact, just about nothing about WoW has any relevance to EVE so if you're using that as a point of reference, you are pretty much incorrect by default. Which explains a lot.

In fact, I have to ask: do you enjoy being wrong about everything you say, or is it just something you're cursed with?
Ace Uoweme
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#29 - 2013-07-01 06:43:50 UTC
Tippia wrote:
No. Which one is it? Is there no point to it, or is it too expensive? If it's the latter, then obviously there is a point: to ruin the other guy. If it's the former, then it's obviously too cheap since it has no effect.


You're, again, splitting hairs, Tippia.

Tippia wrote:
Good thing, then, that nothing of the sort has happened, and that we're looking at ~0% since 2007 and less than zero in an even longer perspective. You have to have been inbred and not travelled outside your own back yard to think otherwise (also, be clueless about economy in general).


No, you're clueless if you can't see outside your narrow box and special interests. That's the problem with you, you're a dinosaur so interested in what you see for your interests, not the bigger picture.

The bigger picture is what is best for a game that is pleasing for m-a-n-y gamers. Not just a niche who likes their status quo.

You defend what's available, it's your comfort zone.

I'm showing the bigger picture and from someone not so inbred in EvE's culture. You may like the EQII quaintness of EvE, but I'd prefer EvE to be bigger and better...and with more real players (not more alt accounts running on IsBox).

How about you?

And the start is making the game cheap enough to actually play. I mean this game is even more expensive than some F2P P2W games, seriously.

Don't mistake what's easy for you as a vet, with what a newer player will face. It's a problem with dinosaurs.

_"In a world of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act." _ ~George Orwell

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#30 - 2013-07-01 06:47:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Ace Uoweme wrote:
You're, again, splitting hairs, Tippia.
No. I'm simply trying to resolve the contradiction of your statement.

So, which one is it: is PvP pointless, or is expensive?
Quote:
No, you're clueless if you can't see outside your narrow box and special interests.
…which are? The fact remains: the bigger picture is that there is little inflation and that, if anything, prices are being returned to normal (but are still a bit low).

Quote:
I'd prefer EvE to be bigger and better.
No. You prefer EVE to go down a road that has killed every game that has tried it, rather than continue the road that has led it to be constantly bigger and better — a feat unrivalled by any other MMO on the market.

Quote:
Don't mistake what's easy for you as a vet, with what a newer player will face.
It was hellalot harder when I was a new player, since prices were higher and ISK much more difficult to come by. So don't mistake what's happening inside your very narrow time perspective and limited experience with what's happen on a global and longer timescale.
Kijo Rikki
Perkone
Caldari State
#31 - 2013-07-01 06:49:08 UTC
Q 5 wrote:
With the introduction of these "bounties" losing a pvp ship in fleet engagements means nothing to f1 monkeys even without a ship replacement program and mega corps like Goonswarm and other 0.0 corps, put some kind of consequence into fleet engagements (and no losing their ship means nothing), they just farm rat bounties all day and replace their ship fast, pfft no consequence there.



I've replaced a few words to show you how stupid you look, and if you ever said anything like this to me I do believe I'd have to manipulate the laws of physics and reach through the monitor to punch you.

You make a valid point, good Sir or Madam. 

Urgg Boolean
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#32 - 2013-07-01 06:54:12 UTC
Laasttime I was ganked, I got the huge pay out:
I was in a Venture and got easily whacked for a total loss of about 10mil.

I warped off to my home base, got in my Navy Vexor and came back expecting the ganker to have returned wit buds for the mop up. The ganker was there solo in his pod, I targeted him, he fled.

In his wreck, I got a two faction mods plus a sister's launcher and abundant probes, and 2500 faction ammo for a total of about 100mill. Now, why this guy chose to gank me in high sec with a ship like that is beyond me.

I must admit that has been the only time I have profited from being the victim. But it sure was sweet. And it shows that there is sometimes a cost for the ganker too. If I had cowered in the staion until the GC timed out, he'd have got all his stuff back.
TharOkha
0asis Group
#33 - 2013-07-01 07:22:19 UTC  |  Edited by: TharOkha
Q 5 wrote:
With the introduction of these "tags" ganking means nothing to pirates and mega corps like Goonswarm and other 0.0 corps, put some kind of consequence in ganking (and no losing their ship means nothing), they just farm tags all day and get sec stat back fast, pfft no consequence there.


and you can go to lowsec, farm those tags too and sell them to gankers. (prices are pretty good)

Make an advantage from any situation and not just whine, for god sake. Roll
Cass Lie
State War Academy
Caldari State
#34 - 2013-07-01 08:06:29 UTC
Ace Uoweme wrote:


I'm showing the bigger picture and from someone not so inbred in EvE's culture. You may like the EQII quaintness of EvE, but I'd prefer EvE to be bigger and better...and with more real players (not more alt accounts running on IsBox).

How about you?

And the start is making the game cheap enough to actually play. I mean this game is even more expensive than some F2P P2W games, seriously.

Don't mistake what's easy for you as a vet, with what a newer player will face. It's a problem with dinosaurs.


You are making zero sense, aside from the statement that EVE is more expensive than a F2P game and we thank you for your deep insight.
Azrael Dinn
Imperial Mechanics
#35 - 2013-07-01 08:12:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Azrael Dinn
Tippia wrote:
Ok.
Making ganking cost something in one step:
1. Kill them right back.

There you go.

Quote:
Atleast have Concord pod kill ganker so they'll have to start wherever their clone is, and cost of replacement of clone + combat booster and any implants.
Why does it have to be more expensive than it already is? Also, if you're going to introduce NPC podding, I can only suppose that you suggest it happens across the board, because anything less would be rather silly, right?


It needs to be more expensive to gank because it should not be an activity in high security space that pirates, major alliances and other nerds can turn into a profitable gameplay. Yet balance some balance must be preserved but at this moment ganking is way underbalanced.

And hate me all you like it wont change the issue.

After centuries of debating and justifying... Break Cloaks tm

Elizabeth Aideron
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#36 - 2013-07-01 08:15:25 UTC
Azrael Dinn wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Ok.
Making ganking cost something in one step:
1. Kill them right back.

There you go.

Quote:
Atleast have Concord pod kill ganker so they'll have to start wherever their clone is, and cost of replacement of clone + combat booster and any implants.
Why does it have to be more expensive than it already is? Also, if you're going to introduce NPC podding, I can only suppose that you suggest it happens across the board, because anything less would be rather silly, right?


It needs to be more expensive to gank because it should not be an activity in high security space that pirates, major alliances and other nerds can turn into a profitable gameplay. Yet balance some balance must be preserved but at this moment ganking is way underbalanced.

And hate me all you like it wont change the issue.


ganking adds risk to highsec, risk that is desperately needed. of course it should be profitable
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#37 - 2013-07-01 08:20:07 UTC
Azrael Dinn wrote:


It needs to be more expensive to gank because it should not be an activity in high security space that pirates, major alliances and other nerds can turn into a profitable gameplay. Yet balance some balance must be preserved but at this moment ganking is way underbalanced.

And hate me all you like it wont change the issue.


Look at this


Now, you tell me who made this easy?
TharOkha
0asis Group
#38 - 2013-07-01 08:23:57 UTC  |  Edited by: TharOkha
Azrael Dinn wrote:

It needs to be more expensive to gank because it should not be an activity in high security space that pirates, major alliances and other nerds can turn into a profitable game-play.


Why should not be this a profitable activity in hisec? EVE is sandbox if you didn't know. And for every threat (no matter if in hisec, lowsec or any other sec) there is counteroffensive.

its just your fault if you haul expensive stuff in paper boats.
Its your fault if you fly officer fitted BS in busy L4 hubs.
Its your fault that you dont use undock safe spots.
etc...
etc...
Ace Uoweme
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#39 - 2013-07-01 08:31:39 UTC
Cass Lie wrote:
You are making zero sense, aside from the statement that EVE is more expensive than a F2P game and we thank you for your deep insight.


To you.

I'm perfectly clear and offer great examples *why* it is a problem.

The solutions I can't make myself, because I'm not CCP (nor privy to their data). But will express my views about the issue.

Anyone claiming the cost for ganking isn't high enough in EvE are vets or a member of some blob fleet, that seems from their explanations, pays even for their game time with free PLEX to play without even a penny invested.

_"In a world of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act." _ ~George Orwell

Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#40 - 2013-07-01 08:39:25 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Azrael Dinn wrote:


It needs to be more expensive to gank because it should not be an activity in high security space that pirates, major alliances and other nerds can turn into a profitable gameplay. Yet balance some balance must be preserved but at this moment ganking is way underbalanced.

And hate me all you like it wont change the issue.


Look at this


Now, you tell me who made this easy?


Procurer, Dominix BPO drops... Shocked

Someone got a visit from the Loot Fairy. Good Lord...

Anyway, if I can stop drooling long enough to type a response:

Ganking does have a cost already. You lose your ship, and you lose your sec status. And you are flagged, if anyone cares to do anything about it.

It is up to the potential victims, to make the profit of ganking you, LOWER than the cost of ganking you. The link above, did not do this.

In other words, stop being such attractive targets. That's like wearing a bodysuit made of steak in a tiger cage, can you blame the tiger for taking a bite?

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.