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Intergalactic Summit

 
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Federation and Republic citizens, lets talk about the situation.
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Anslo
Scope Works
#141 - 2013-07-09 18:01:09 UTC
Repentence Tyrathlion wrote:
Steffanie Saissore wrote:
It seems that the following can describe the current point of views held by Republican capsuleers and Federation capsuleers on the matter:

  • Republicans who do not believe an apology is necessary
  • Federates who want an apology
  • Federates who want to invade the Republic to teach them a lesson
  • Republicans who think there should be reconciliation
  • Republicans and Federates who don't give a care

I admit these are pretty broad strokes and there is more going on in the details, but at the end of the day we have a group of highly powerful individuals expressing their opinion on a matter that, at the end of the day, almost doesn't matter. The Republic does not appear to even acknowledge the events surrounding this disaster and the Senate hasn't made any demands on behalf of the Federation.

Thousands of men and women were sacrificed in nothing more than a game of chicken played by two political entities.

I am beginning to wonder who is more the monster here...the capsuleer or the politician.


It's easy to get hung up on the Republic's lack of response and totally forget that the Federation has been curiously silent. Well remarked.

The only reasonable conclusion that can be drawn is that discussion simply occurred behind closed doors, and this discussion is actually out of date. Conspiracy theories, go!

Oh, and Anslo and Caellach... I've been giggling hysterically for several minutes. Never thought I'd see the day you two got into a catfight. Seriously, relax. You're both pretty.


Don't say that in public, Morwen will kill me for wooing you with my smoldering good looks.

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
Morwen Lagann
Tyrathlion Interstellar
#142 - 2013-07-09 18:13:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Morwen Lagann
Honestly, at this point, I'm more likely to kill her for keeping me awake with her giggling when I'm trying to take a nap.

Or just wait for her to asphyxiate from laughter. That might work if you and Caellach keep it up. P

Morwen Lagann

CEO, Tyrathlion Interstellar

Coordinator, Arataka Research Consortium

Owner, The Golden Masque
Anslo
Scope Works
#143 - 2013-07-09 18:22:45 UTC
Challenge accepted.

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
Shintoko Akahoshi
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#144 - 2013-07-09 19:30:40 UTC
Steffanie Saissore wrote:
It seems that the following can describe the current point of views held by Republican capsuleers and Federation capsuleers on the matter:

  • Republicans who do not believe an apology is necessary
  • Federates who want an apology
  • Federates who want to invade the Republic to teach them a lesson
  • Republicans who think there should be reconciliation
  • Republicans and Federates who don't give a care

I admit these are pretty broad strokes and there is more going on in the details, but at the end of the day we have a group of highly powerful individuals expressing their opinion on a matter that, at the end of the day, almost doesn't matter. The Republic does not appear to even acknowledge the events surrounding this disaster and the Senate hasn't made any demands on behalf of the Federation.


I've been pretty public about my position, which is that the Federation should not be in an alliance with a foreign power that invades them on a whim. That puts me in the list down between the "wants an apology" and "wants to invade": Wants to dissolve the alliance to help minimize the threat of future attacks.

While I'll acknowledge that both the Republic and the Federation have been oddly silent on the issue, I don't think that's a reason for us to be silent. The Federation, at least, is built upon the ideals of democracy and democracy requires frank discussion. We shouldn't shut up simply because our respective governments either don't care about the issue or have worked out some backroom deal.

Bio and writing

(Nothing I say is indicative of corporate policy unless otherwise stated)
Steffanie Saissore
Tyrathlion Interstellar
#145 - 2013-07-09 21:08:53 UTC
Shintoko Akahoshi wrote:
Steffanie Saissore wrote:
It seems that the following can describe the current point of views held by Republican capsuleers and Federation capsuleers on the matter:

  • Republicans who do not believe an apology is necessary
  • Federates who want an apology
  • Federates who want to invade the Republic to teach them a lesson
  • Republicans who think there should be reconciliation
  • Republicans and Federates who don't give a care



I've been pretty public about my position, which is that the Federation should not be in an alliance with a foreign power that invades them on a whim. That puts me in the list down between the "wants an apology" and "wants to invade": Wants to dissolve the alliance to help minimize the threat of future attacks.

While I'll acknowledge that both the Republic and the Federation have been oddly silent on the issue, I don't think that's a reason for us to be silent. The Federation, at least, is built upon the ideals of democracy and democracy requires frank discussion. We shouldn't shut up simply because our respective governments either don't care about the issue or have worked out some backroom deal.


Shin, I am not advocating silence. The problem at this stage is, we have a bunch of capsuleers grumbling about what should or should not be done by the governments of two nations.

I do not know how things work within the Republic, but within the Federation, as citizens, we do have a voice. I realize that we have vast resources at our disposal, but we are a very small speck within the Federation, yet we can still make waves that the Senate and President cannot ignore. Instead of expending energy on an argument that is not going anywhere, perhaps turn your focus to the Senate and start demanding, as a citizen, them to stand up and be held to account for their lack of action in this issue.

Whether or not we maintain an alliance, dissolve it, or do something drastic is now moot. The offense is too far removed now that any demand or action would fail to achieve its desired effect. Instead, the Senate and President need to be held accountable for their silence on the death of so many of its people for no apparent reason.

We travel in the dark of the new moon,

A starry highway traced on the map of the sky
Caellach Marellus
Stormcrows
#146 - 2013-07-09 22:12:40 UTC
I've no interest in petty bickering; but if he's going to silence a person's opinion on a matter which involves them, he should find a more concrete reason than the ones being employed.

And yes this silence is unnerving, not so much for what's not being said, but knowing the way Roden and Blaque work, I hardly doubt the SDII are keeping themselves to the mere twiddling of thumbs here. Besides this is in their interest to keep going as relevant discussion, as it's seemingly made us all forget other recent events that just vanished into the night without resolution.

When your gut instincts tell you something is wrong, trust them. When your heart tells you something is right, ignore it, check with your brain first. Accept nothing, challenge everything.
Shintoko Akahoshi
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#147 - 2013-07-09 23:34:22 UTC
Steffanie Saissore wrote:
Whether or not we maintain an alliance, dissolve it, or do something drastic is now moot. The offense is too far removed now that any demand or action would fail to achieve its desired effect. Instead, the Senate and President need to be held accountable for their silence on the death of so many of its people for no apparent reason.


Oh, I don't think that's the case at all. Sure, the attack itself happened two months ago, but that in no way makes it too far removed for any course of action.

In my opinion the signifigance of the event was that it was an unexpected attack by a close ally. While the Federation Navy was able to stop the Republic force in Colelie by bringing in a fleet of equal size, this could have as easily not happened. What would the Republic strike force have done if they were able to defeat the FedNav fleet? We don't know. Would they have destroyed stations as was done in Yulai? We don't know. Would they have turned their attentions to inhabited worlds? We don't know.

With no context other than a few theories advanced by capsuleers, I have no confidence that the Republic will not attack again. Dissolving the alliance between the Republic and the Federation would cause the FedNav to reevaluate security along the border and hopefully put it in a position to be able to respond to any new Republic incursions with overwhelming force.

There's an old saying: hope for the best, plan for the worst. While I certainly hope that there can be a satisfactory resolution to this attack, I think it's foolish to ignore the obvious threat. The worst, in this case, could be pretty bad indeed.

Bio and writing

(Nothing I say is indicative of corporate policy unless otherwise stated)
James Syagrius
Luminaire Sovereign Solutions
#148 - 2013-07-10 01:46:10 UTC
Anslo wrote:
Who said anything about forgiving without reconciliation? Maybe if you actually had more substance to your own arguments, you wouldn't have to twist my words for your own purpose.

Look back at what I've said before. The Republic DOES need to answer for what happened, preferably in a non-violent manner such as sanctions. When I say both parties are at fault, I mean BOTH the Federation AND Republic. Not just the Federation.

What I'm NOT for is tearing up treaties and blasting up ships and stations in revenge. I like to think we're a weeee bit better than that. But hey by all means keep trying to twist my words, it's funny.

But the argument does have merit, though you seem to enjoy ignoring it. So, I'll spell it out for you. How do you have ANY credibility or action to stand on and call out the Republic for one skirmish when you pull **** like this everyday of the week as a normal business day?

Answer: None.

You can't complement some people.

As to missing points, your skill Sir is legion, so let me repeat myself... again.

The Federation did nothing wrong, the tribals did.

Your refusal or inability to see this speaks to your confused loyalties.

Convince your tribal friends to make amends if your so interested in preserving the alliance. If they are as noble and fair as you presume it should be an easy matter. I have a sneaky suspicion however you care more for the tribals pride than the Federations laws.

You condemn my argument because of my admitted affiliations. One wonders if you hold yourself to the same standard you hold others.

“Here also are the heralds of his praise."