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Exploration, data and relic sites

Author
Secunda Tiro
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#1 - 2013-06-05 10:21:41 UTC
Because I'm seeing a lot of complaining about the new hacking mechanic, the mini-game, and the retrieving of the containers after a successful hack, I thought I'd make myself unpopular with my first forum post by saying I'm thoroughly in favour of the whole thing.

In terms of scanning, I'm finding the co-ordination of probes makes things much more enjoyable than micro-managing formations probe by probe.

And once I find sites, I love the little hacking game - in fact I've often said I'd love to see a similar feature for mining. I saw someone make a scathing reference to the mining in Star Trek Online when this subject came up elsewhere, but honestly, I truly think it'd be a good thing.

I'm even happy with the apparently much-despised spray of cans. Sure, I can't catch them all, but I know I'm not supposed to be able to. If I want every one of them, I need to bring friends, and that's fine. EVE's designed to reward co-operation.

Admittedly, I tend to be a bit of a fan type. I appreciate the amount of work and thought that always goes into EVE, and although there have been changes that haven't worked out in my favour I prefer to look on the bright side of things. I can't see any reason for me to complain about the Odyssey changes to exploration, even though I was quite worried about which way this was going to go. For myself, I'd like to thank CCP and let them know that at least one subscriber is very happy with the exploration changes.

Oh, and the stargate animation is gorgeous. Big smile
Maggie Dezno
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2013-06-05 16:46:43 UTC
I concur. the mini game is kind of fun. and I have yet to fail twice and have a structure explode on me, and I'm using an Imicus with no enhancements (although my relevant skills are probably all at IV or V)

and yes, the mini-containers floating out becomes a bit of a frantic lottery, and I sort of don't mind that. I've collected about 15 million ISK in loot from 3 sites so far, and since I'm not a isk/hr kind of guy, that doesn't seem too bad to me.
Korban Askiras
Doomheim
#3 - 2013-06-05 16:56:57 UTC
All agreed.


Hack Loot Cans - Gotta Catch 'Em All!
Mipe Kamach
Doomheim
#4 - 2013-06-05 17:40:31 UTC
I personally find the new exploration system downright idiotic. It is like gambling on your gambles. Inception!

Seriously, whose idea was it to bury vabuables among multiple short-lived floating cans of junk? That is just frustrating.

And this frustration comes after the frustration of finding a site that is not contested. Everyone and their mom are exploring now, so I have to head to less-traveled systems to find data/relic sites. Often low-sec.

90% of my finds are wormholes. Worm here, hole there. The data is in another castle.

When I finally find a data site, I can only hope I am the first there. If I am, I proceed iwth hacking - not too bad, just a pain to do in low-sec with everyone and their mom ganking explorers. Do not go without cloaking or your own man guns.

Done hacking, the loot sprays out. I typically catch about 50%, ignore scrap, material and such, shoot straight for equipment, data and parts. This is the most frustrating part. From cargo scans I know there is some valuable loot, but most of the times I only catch the junk. After I'm left with pathetic haul after a long tour of flying and scanning, I find myself wondering: is this really worthwhile?

I think not. As long as the exploration only serves one frustration after another, I personally feel discouraged from it.

Take it however you will.
Elaine Shandrate
Luna Decrescentia Celeris
#5 - 2013-06-05 18:27:58 UTC
Mipe Kamach wrote:


And this frustration comes after the frustration of finding a site that is not contested. Everyone and their mom are exploring now, so I have to head to less-traveled systems to find data/relic sites. Often low-sec.


However, what i did notice so far is that is harder to pinpoint some sites.
Sometimes - more often than before Odyssee - i can't get to 100% with the standard probe lay-outs (0.25AU / ~90%).
Most people will then stop looking.

Which is great for me, since those are usually the data or relic sites - which can be found if you know how to even without bonussed ships.
Secunda Tiro
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#6 - 2013-06-05 20:10:22 UTC
Mipe Kamach wrote:
And this frustration comes after the frustration of finding a site that is not contested. Everyone and their mom are exploring now, so I have to head to less-traveled systems to find data/relic sites. Often low-sec.

Actually, that is a good point... Hmmm. I've had a rethink.

Quote:
most of the times I only catch the junk. After I'm left with pathetic haul after a long tour of flying and scanning, I find myself wondering: is this really worthwhile?
I think not. As long as the exploration only serves one frustration after another, I personally feel discouraged from it.


You're absolutely right. Scanning and exploring is no fun at all, it's a complete waste of time and effort and everyone should stop doing it right now. You'll have much more fun doing something else.

/looks around hopefully.

Is it working? Big smile
Kult Altol
The Safe Space
#7 - 2013-06-05 20:21:14 UTC
I'm that everyone and their mother guy. I just starting exploring, it's pretty fun.

[u]Can't wait untill when Eve online is Freemium.[/u] WiS only 10$, SP booster for one month 15$, DPS Boost 2$, EHP Boost 2$ Real money trading hub! Cosmeitic ship skins 15$ --> If you don't [u]pay **[/u]for a product, you ARE the [u]**product[/u].

Luc Brinalle
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2013-06-06 20:13:43 UTC
I have to agree, I think the new hacking minigame is pretty fun, and I don't mind the whole loot spewing thing so much. I actually haven't failed a hack twice yet and my skills are pretty low. I assume the difficulty changes with security status?
Ohh Yeah
Jerkasaurus Wrecks Inc.
Sedition.
#9 - 2013-06-06 21:03:52 UTC
Mipe Kamach wrote:

And this frustration comes after the frustration of finding a site that is not contested. Everyone and their mom are exploring now, so I have to head to less-traveled systems to find data/relic sites. Often low-sec.


Meanwhile 85% of 0.0 is completely empty and you can burn around systems completely decloaked all the time running sites and literally never see anyone for 10x the reward. People are just too scared to try to get the big money, which is ironically a lot safer than lowsec.
Ohh Yeah
Jerkasaurus Wrecks Inc.
Sedition.
#10 - 2013-06-06 21:05:03 UTC
Luc Brinalle wrote:
I have to agree, I think the new hacking minigame is pretty fun, and I don't mind the whole loot spewing thing so much. I actually haven't failed a hack twice yet and my skills are pretty low. I assume the difficulty changes with security status?


Some of the cans in 8/10 - 10/10 sites can be frustratingly hard. They do, however, usually have 100m+ in them, so it's always worth giving it a go. Sometimes you get lucky.
Gasper
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2013-06-06 21:06:09 UTC
Luc Brinalle wrote:
I have to agree, I think the new hacking minigame is pretty fun, and I don't mind the whole loot spewing thing so much. I actually haven't failed a hack twice yet and my skills are pretty low. I assume the difficulty changes with security status?


I think it might be harder higher up. I have every skill at 3 and I blow up about 50% of cans in 0.0 =P
Dawn Harbinger
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#12 - 2013-06-06 21:37:01 UTC
Totally agree with OP.

And yes, the sites' difficulty seem to scale well with the security of space you're in. I've had a few blow up in my face with awesome loot, but then that makes the victorious hacks all that much sweeter :)
Mavnas
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2013-06-07 01:16:36 UTC
Elaine Shandrate wrote:
Mipe Kamach wrote:


And this frustration comes after the frustration of finding a site that is not contested. Everyone and their mom are exploring now, so I have to head to less-traveled systems to find data/relic sites. Often low-sec.


However, what i did notice so far is that is harder to pinpoint some sites.
Sometimes - more often than before Odyssee - i can't get to 100% with the standard probe lay-outs (0.25AU / ~90%).
Most people will then stop looking.

Which is great for me, since those are usually the data or relic sites - which can be found if you know how to even without bonussed ships.


Really? In high sec I sometimes scan down sites at like 1-2 AU. The worst I've seen I had to go to .25, but didn't have to fix the sub-optimal formation I started with, so it was still pretty easy.

I will say though, my probing legion is now terrible because with it's maneuverability/speed I can only get 1/3rd of the cans. If I had a frig, I'm sure I could get half. The legion also can't do 3/10s and 4/10s which used to be the only high sec combat sites worth doing, so really I have a half billion probing frigate now post patch that can't spare a mid slot for the new modules. On the bright side, it won't pop if some dude shows up in a destroyer.
Tanya Spade
Echos of Starla
#14 - 2013-06-07 05:20:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Tanya Spade
Secunda Tiro wrote:
...
I'm even happy with the apparently much-despised spray of cans. Sure, I can't catch them all, but I know I'm not supposed to be able to. If I want every one of them, I need to bring friends, and that's fine. EVE's designed to reward co-operation.
...Big smile


So how does one effectively collect these cansQuestion
I've read people say both to double-click, whilst others tout not to double-click on them. But neither to my experience so far seems very effective at all. Double-clicking gets your ship moving in the direction, but that is the only consistent/reliable outcome so far. I don't expect to be able to collect them all.

However, I do enjoy the 'mini-game' as some are calling it. Though I imagine CCP will continue to refine it over time; it feels a little crude at the moment, but that's only a minor grievance. Perhap if they take a little inspiration off the windows game minesweeper or similar to give a little more direction and reactivity when cracking.

I'm disappointed about the 'auto-scan' that happens whenever one enters the system. I fail to understand why in any way it is necessary?

[center]Sketches and Chronicles Inspired by New Eden Experiences: Echos of Starla.  A Member of the EVE Online Blogging Community.[/center]

Neor Deninard
Blackwater Coalition Forces
Harkonnen Federation
#15 - 2013-06-07 05:35:11 UTC
Tanya Spade wrote:
Secunda Tiro wrote:
...
I'm even happy with the apparently much-despised spray of cans. Sure, I can't catch them all, but I know I'm not supposed to be able to. If I want every one of them, I need to bring friends, and that's fine. EVE's designed to reward co-operation.
...Big smile


So how does one effectively collect these cansQuestion
I've read people say both to double-click, whilst others tout not to double-click on them. But neither to my experience so far seems very effective at all. Double-clicking gets your ship moving in the direction, but that is the only consistent/reliable outcome so far. I don't expect to be able to collect them all.

However, I do enjoy the 'mini-game' as some are calling it. Though I imagine CCP will continue to refine it over time; it feels a little crude at the moment, but that's only a minor grievance. Perhap if they take a little inspiration off the windows game minesweeper or similar to give a little more direction and reactivity when cracking.

I'm disappointed about the 'auto-scan' that happens whenever one enters the system. I fail to understand why in any way it is necessary?


Single. Click.

Take a note of what cans and what formations poop their cans in what direction and postion yourself around 1km from there so the cans all go past you when they spew. (less tracktor time = more cans)

And take notes (until someone tosses it on a wiki somehwere) to what type of can has what type of loot; use the caro scanner to check what 'good' parts are in the loot.

Eg. if there is a blueprint or high value research item, go for the cans that can have that (and then grab other cans)

Also zoom out a LOT when the cans pop, easier clicking and no camera moving around needed.

The only annoying thing I find so far, living in high sec most of the time, is that 99 out of 100 anomalies are worm holes. Every. Fricking. Time.
Tanya Spade
Echos of Starla
#16 - 2013-06-07 07:12:26 UTC
Neor Deninard wrote:
...
The only annoying thing I find so far, living in high sec most of the time, is that 99 out of 100 anomalies are worm holes. Every. Fricking. Time.


Yes, there are a lot of wormholes I'm finding too, and many don't seem to be used that much, least the one's I've found of late appear to have had little traffic going through them.

Hmm, I did not know the cans appear in a specific and repeatable place when you successfully crack into a site, depending upon the site type. Thanks for that.

[center]Sketches and Chronicles Inspired by New Eden Experiences: Echos of Starla.  A Member of the EVE Online Blogging Community.[/center]

Luc Brinalle
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#17 - 2013-06-07 12:38:30 UTC
Neor Deninard wrote:

The only annoying thing I find so far, living in high sec most of the time, is that 99 out of 100 anomalies are worm holes. Every. Fricking. Time.


I'm having the same problem. It started to get really frustrating to me last night.
Jake Pappottess
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#18 - 2013-06-07 23:54:25 UTC
I notice that in relic sites the best things are equipment, parts, and materials containers. While Data sites have the best data cans. Overall scrap cans are junk.
Silas Shaw
Coffee Hub
#19 - 2013-06-08 01:29:32 UTC
Neor Deninard wrote:
The only annoying thing I find so far, living in high sec most of the time, is that 99 out of 100 anomalies are worm holes. Every. Fricking. Time.



Those WHs are safe. promise.
bosonik
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#20 - 2013-06-08 01:36:26 UTC  |  Edited by: bosonik
this update to exploration was fun for about 5 minutes, now I am really annoyed by it and don't ever want to do it again! Bummer!

I mean it is already chanced based, then you have to hurry up and try to grab cans, ridiculous. Used to farm data and relic sites in WH but with this update, people are going to be pissed
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