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Simulation Sickness / Motion Sickness

Author
Maximus Aerelius
PROPHET OF ENIGMA
#21 - 2013-06-05 09:06:56 UTC
r00t b33r wrote:
There are obvious frame rate spikes... -snipped-.


A nice post there. Could you also add this to Official Odyssey Feedback Thread and help get this hammered home perhaps? I would quote it but would rather you got the Likes from it (don't like to be a credit stealer).

+1
Aya Shinomiya
State War Academy
Caldari State
#22 - 2013-06-05 09:40:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Aya Shinomiya
Maximus Aerelius wrote:
Aya Shinomiya wrote:
The Tracking Camera appears with Odyssey. Before there was none.


Actually the Tracking Camera was in before Odyssey...it came with Retribution.


I have read about this. Maybe it was deaktivated by default, so I did not noticed it. With Odyssey I noticed it and instantly search the posts how to deactivate it (again). I do not see any use for this except for causing me dizziness.
Aya Shinomiya
State War Academy
Caldari State
#23 - 2013-06-05 09:41:29 UTC
Maximus Aerelius wrote:
Add your support to changing this in Official Odyssey Feedback Thread.


I have already.
Aya Shinomiya
State War Academy
Caldari State
#24 - 2013-06-05 15:09:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Aya Shinomiya
r00t b33r wrote:
There are obvious frame rate spikes with the new jumping effect (and also undocking). My PC is no slouch but turn on the frame rate monitor with ctrl+F and see if the game is significantly dropping frames during the animation. Low frame rates in games can make anyone get headaches or slight motion sickness. This is heightened by the fast animation through a tunnel. When a person gets motion sickness while driving a car, there are symptoms such as if there are rows of trees on either side of the row, it will start to look like a slide show. I'm pretty sure this has a relation to low frame rates in games visibly simulate motion sickness, and can cause it by this affect. Another note is the ear is in tune with what the eye sees. The sound effects for traveling through the jump gates is smooth while the visuals are not. It must be mentioned that no one has said anything about undocking. The first couple seconds of undocking I notice frames dropping as well. I'm not a game designer so I don't know what is causing this or how to improve it but this is surely one of the reasons why people are getting headaches/nausea.

I for one love the automatic camera and jump animation. It definitely seems like getting to the next system is quicker. I find myself going a few jumps and before I realize it I'm at the destination. Also having the automatic camera makes it easy for me to look at things in space that are on my overview by clicking them, instead of waving around the mouse trying to find stuff. However I understand why some people are getting motion sickness. On my older machine I tried running 2 clients across 2 1080p monitors which was rendering similar to 4 full-screen clients at the same time. It didn't pan out the way I wanted because going through warp the frame rate was not smooth and caused me to feel sick. This is similar to what the new jump animation does.

I'm happy with the changes and additions but it must be noted the frame rate drop during undocking and jumping sequences.

My specs are i7-2600 @ 3.4GHz 8 GB DDR3 RAM 180GB SSD NVidia GTX 650 Ti BOOST SuperClocked

The frame rate stutters several times through jump tunnels and also noticeable after undocking. Main reason why some people don't notice the frame rate drop is because of the high speed of the animation in the tunnel. Once you notice it's very obvious.


Could be one possible explaination. But I do not think it is all about the frame rate alone. I am no expert on this.

My system in comparism: AMD Phenom II X6 1055T 2.80 GHz, 8GB DDR3 RAM, Geforce GTX 660 OT

I do not blame CCP for what they do or not do or the mistakes they make in my eyes. It is their product and we are the customer. But in my eyes it is too often the show effect only what determinates what CCP introduces into the game and lesser the actual necessity of it. Some people love good presentations and shows, others like to see real content and meaningful things. I believe it is hard for a company to find the middle way to please both groups.

When it comes to effects than in my opinion developer, not CCP alone, tend to exaggerate the things. Everything must be bombastic and great. But you can also have beautiful WOW(not World of.. you know)-effects with more humility in the things you create. Hard to explain. It is a philosophical and cultural question. Beauty is not always everything what is big and eye-catching. What I try to say is, more smooth and harmonical and less aggressive and unsteady effects would also have a more possitive effect on the perception of the gameplay. Again, this is only my opinion. In nature everything strives for balance. Humans mostly strive for extremes. And this extremes are making our body sick because the body, like all nature, tries to find the balance which we humans disturb with our mostly unbalanced creations.
Stalker Dellacort
Sarpati Research Institute
#25 - 2013-06-05 18:01:36 UTC
To be clear, this is not caused by the tracking camera. I have had the tracking camera turned off since it was released and confirmed it was still off after my first post-odyssey jump. They are separate animations. Also camera shake does not remove the effects.
Maximus Aerelius
PROPHET OF ENIGMA
#26 - 2013-06-05 18:17:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Maximus Aerelius
Just been on SiSi and the post-jump camera pan back to the gate has now gone. Not sure if this is going to stay obviously this is the TEST Server but it's promising.

EDIT: With Tracking enabled it does pan back to the gate you came through though.
Substantia Nigra
Polaris Rising
The Bastion
#27 - 2013-06-05 18:54:17 UTC
Ouch, having just done a long hisec run I'm feeling quite sick. Could we please have an option to turn off all that new unhelpful bling? The first time I saw the effect I thought "awesome", now I view it as unnecessary, unhelpful, nauseating (literally), and bad use of bandwidth / processor.

I guess I am almost a 'vet' by now. Hopefully not too bitter and managing to help more than I hinder. I build and sell many things, including large collections of bookmarks.

Aya Shinomiya
State War Academy
Caldari State
#28 - 2013-06-05 18:56:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Aya Shinomiya
Maximus Aerelius wrote:
Just been on SiSi and the post-jump camera pan back to the gate has now gone. Not sure if this is going to stay obviously this is the TEST Server but it's promising.

EDIT: With Tracking enabled it does pan back to the gate you came through though.


I personally would see this as improvement. If they could make it that the ship is shaking while warp traveling and not the camera I am very satisfied so far.
Dr Ted Kaper
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#29 - 2013-06-05 19:23:08 UTC
talk about emmersion, CCP should try to figure out how to use this to give the impression of G-force!
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
#30 - 2013-06-05 19:48:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Alvatore DiMarco
Maximus Aerelius wrote:
Just been on SiSi and the post-jump camera pan back to the gate has now gone. Not sure if this is going to stay obviously this is the TEST Server but it's promising.

EDIT: With Tracking enabled it does pan back to the gate you came through though.


...I am just.. ..so.. UNDERWHELMED with you people.

The post-jump camera pan has been "gone" for weeks now. Right after people started complaining about it on the test server, which was right after the new jump sequence went on the test server, they made it be linked to the tracking camera instead of being part of the jump sequence.
Aya Shinomiya
State War Academy
Caldari State
#31 - 2013-06-05 20:01:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Aya Shinomiya
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:
Maximus Aerelius wrote:
Just been on SiSi and the post-jump camera pan back to the gate has now gone. Not sure if this is going to stay obviously this is the TEST Server but it's promising.

EDIT: With Tracking enabled it does pan back to the gate you came through though.


...I am just.. ..so.. UNDERWHELMED with you people.

The post-jump camera pan has been "gone" for weeks now. Right after people started complaining about it on the test server, which was right after the new jump sequence went on the test server, they made it be linked to the tracking camera instead of being part of the jump sequence.


And why have not they include this in the official release? Not all of us play on the test server. So how should we know this?
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
#32 - 2013-06-05 20:05:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Alvatore DiMarco
...It has been that way on TQ since day one of the official release of Odyssey. I can't help it if your tracking camera somehow got turned back on. Mine didn't, so I don't know what happened to you.

With regards to "how should we know this", you can learn an awful lot if you poke around on the forums a little bit. Very very little of the information that exists to be had is spoonfed to you by way of ingame announcements with links and login banners.
Aya Shinomiya
State War Academy
Caldari State
#33 - 2013-06-05 21:17:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Aya Shinomiya
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:
...It has been that way on TQ since day one of the official release of Odyssey. I can't help it if your tracking camera somehow got turned back on. Mine didn't, so I don't know what happened to you.

With regards to "how should we know this", you can learn an awful lot if you poke around on the forums a little bit. Very very little of the information that exists to be had is spoonfed to you by way of ingame announcements with links and login banners.


You speak of the Tracking Camera. I believe I thought wrong what Maximus Aerelius means with "pan back". So obviously we both talk about different things. Sorry. My fault.
metalravenous
Pyramid Celestial
#34 - 2013-06-05 22:20:59 UTC
#416Posted: 2013.06.05 22:13 | Report
I get motion sickness from the moment of undock.

For the most part I really don't undock all that much to begin with but pretty much it is impossible for me to move around at all anymore.

The first thing is that scan that comes up when you undock. The scan is too flashy and tbh is not even necessary. I don't do sites I don't do sanctums. this is all frivilous crap that I could care less about.

The next thing iswhen you jump through gates. The camera pans to the gate and then you go through the gate effect and it shakes, both of those things make me nauseas...in fact I actually threw up going through a second gate.

I have been hitting f10 and just leaving the solar system map up but this isn't going to work to move a jf or anything large.

I get that these effects are pretty but they are not necessary for me to enjoy the game....with them I ca not play at all, pls fix

pressing C fixes none of my issues so please don't suggest it...it isnt my computer so dont tell me it is junk those answers are not helpful

I have already put in a petition but unless ithe issue is fixed i can not see myself subbing once my current month is done
Zak Breen
Breen Enterprises
#35 - 2013-06-05 22:50:55 UTC
I don't have any problems with the animation but I can see how it would make someone sick who is sensitive to it. I'm all for the option to turn it off or maybe stop the swinging motion.

Maturity, one discovers, has everything to do with the acceptance of not knowing. http://www.di.fm/spacemusic

Ordellus
Doomheim
#36 - 2013-06-06 03:19:08 UTC
Have people seriously sunk low enough as to come up with something like this in an effort to combat a change they do not like.

The camera tracking has been in the game for something along the lines of 6 months.... if it truly bothered you, you would have turned it off already. If odyssey magically turned it back on..... turn it off.

Problem solved. You are welcome.
Douglas Whyte
WhyteKream
#37 - 2013-06-06 04:10:00 UTC
This for some reason....

Reminded me of Clear Skies 1|

And Mr.Smith
Aya Shinomiya
State War Academy
Caldari State
#38 - 2013-06-06 05:27:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Aya Shinomiya
Ordellus wrote:
Have people seriously sunk low enough as to come up with something like this in an effort to combat a change they do not like.

The camera tracking has been in the game for something along the lines of 6 months.... if it truly bothered you, you would have turned it off already. If odyssey magically turned it back on..... turn it off.

Problem solved. You are welcome.


You do not understand. It is not about the tracking camera alone. This is only one factor. Do you think I would open a thread liks this only because of deactivatable tracking camera?
Douglas Whyte
WhyteKream
#39 - 2013-06-06 05:34:07 UTC
It's simulated...

Which mean's that YOU CAN push past it. Unlike real motion sickness, simulated motion sickness is the result of you actually REALLY not moving. It's confused... which to mean means A+ this effect did EXACTLY what it was intended... immersion.

I understand it bother's people and all I can say is focus on the center, and try remind yourself this is a game... this is a game.

Movies like blair-witch use to make me feel sick, then I got over it by visualizing myself holding the camera.

BE THE SHIP!!!
Fin Annages
Twilight Military Industrial Complex
#40 - 2013-06-06 08:25:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Fin Annages
Agree with OPs issue. I don't have it, but know people that do.

Simple default screen to black for transitions with option to enable "cool jump effects" would be ideal. That way, if graphic options mess up, black screen would show preventing players with issues to still play and others to know something is wrong.

Some people have issues IRL that we should have no problem working with in a game. We're all here to pewpew internet spaceships, right? The more the merrier... i.e. more targets. Simple coding work around, IMO.

Edit: As for the system scanner, wouldn't a simple blue/green line in place of the tetris blocks thinger work as well? Should help out those that suffer, once again default with enhanced being an option.
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