EVE General Discussion

If you watch, you can see jump freighters undock from Jita and jump straight out right on the undock.

Malcanis you never did answer my question on how you think a stealth bomber can cloak while in dock range. Come on man, everyone would love to know how to do that.

Docking range on a good few stations is very big.

Fact is that even the most simple moron (peeps like me) can use their JF's to jump all over the place with very little risk.

On the flip side if you nerf JF's in anyway with without making major changes in null then you can kiss goodbye to what is left of null (not that null is any good at the moment)

Any changes to JF's or cyno's in general would have to come as a package with major changes to null.

I'm all for major revamps and fixes. Like I have said many times before; if fixing one thing means you need to fix three other things at the same time, then do it. Unfortunately there is too many people who only care about what goes on in their little world, everyone else be damned. Even the health of the game, as long as they are fine.

Coming from someone who thinks removing local from nullsec would be a good idea and somehow make null more vibrant, I'd find it disconcerting if Malcanis didn't take everything you say with a greedy heaping pile of salt.

I think removing local would be a good idea - Marlona and I actually agree on this to a certain extent - but that's in the context of replacing it with a better real-time data tool.

But that's a discussion for another thread, which I will be happy to not engage in because there's only so many times one wants to read exactly the same people yelling exactly the same partial talking points past each other.

And all the "sky is falling" headless-chicken-running in the world isn't going to make convoys a deathtrap. You'll just have to spend a few people-hours scouting and defending, just like you keep telling folks to do in hisec.



The mechanics certainly are there. Freighters have more EHP than logistics ships, and we keep them alive just fine. The issue is with people who think that you should be able to move freighters through hostile gate camps unassisted, typically those who have become terribly dependent on freighters being able to (and indeed, preferring to) move unassisted from Jita to nullsec manufacturing hubs.

By retaliating.

Right now, there is no point in retaliating, because the whole of EVE works for you, since you can easily access the high sec market. You can replace your losses with ships and materials from high sec with the easy ISK you get from moon goo, which itself is whisked safely to high sec for sale via jump drives. In a scenario where ships, ISK, modules, etc. were scarce (not necessarily rare, mind you, just scarce), you couldn't just throw mountains of ships at the problem until it went away, which is what you do now. There would be an endgame for your opponent, rather than just a never ending slugfest where superior size equated to superior regenerative power.

If things were scarce, you would have to use them efficiently, or risk running out. That is a wholely different way of doing things than just maintaining throughput in the consumption hose. Major alliances wouldn't just be blobs of people that absorb what they need from every direction by osmosis. They would be complex organisms, with vital parts that had to be protected, with inputs and outputs that could be choked off or poisoned. In a world where Jita is 50 jumps away, that small pirate alliance or upstart corp trying to take sovereignty at the edge of your space that is only 25 jumps from Jita has an advantage. They can resupply faster, and you would have to project power into the heart of their domain to resupply yourself from high sec. And, every time you lost the fight to resupply, you'd lose strength.

In that context, blapping some random freighter convoy might be the start of something you couldn't finish.

That's nonsense, how do you scout logged off fleets of whelp canes/tornadoes?./ How do you scout awoxxers'spies? There would be significant loses, and you know what happens when an in-game activity becomes too costly?

People stop doing it.

One of the things that would happen is that Wormholes ( the rare highsec/low sec to null, but more commonly wormholes with a null sec static) would become GOLD.

What happens when something becomes? The large alliances find a way to take them (and pay for access to the direct route holes they can't take because they are random.

Null transport Commerce would simply become wormhole based, which would suck the life out of many a wormhole as large alliance undertake to horde them like tech moons. How would the wormhole alliances (which tend to be small) survive this other than simply becoming pets of the big boys?

You people really aren't thinking this one through despite Mal point out situation after situation, game mechanic after game mechanic that would prevent the ideas presented by this thread from happening in the current age. Wormholes, population, alts, Alpha ships, extreme metagaming etc etc.

The discussion is moot I think because CCP would never be that dumb, but it's still annoying to see people resist reason in a discussion. It's not about preserving advantages (I'm not a logistics guy or alliance big wig), it's about (for me) not supporting a stupid pie in the sky idea that could never work the way it's intended to.