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Intergalactic Summit

 
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So I had to kill some guys, and now I feel weird about it.

Author
Brian Omanid
Doomheim
#61 - 2013-05-31 06:46:36 UTC
I don't understand. Killing is the sweetest thing there is.
Kim Ji-Young
Ji Young Kim Bap
#62 - 2013-05-31 08:06:28 UTC
Brian Omanid wrote:
I don't understand. Killing is the sweetest thing there is.


Yes, but it's icky.
Stitcher
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#63 - 2013-05-31 09:47:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Stitcher
Lilya Tvavarivich wrote:
Stitcher wrote:
All of this hinges on the existence of a deity you cannot demonstrate the existence of. For me to accept even one word of it as being worth listening to, you need to cross that first and most trivial hurdle.

If you can't, then you've built an arch without the keystone.


Humanity itself is an arch built with the keystone of God. Take away God, and you are left with dirt and dust. A universe without God is ugly, cruel and completely without worth. Such an arch would deserve to crumble.


1) I do not agree that this would be the case. It would simply mean that whatever beauty, fairness and worth the universe has is that with which we imbue it, which in turn obligates us to choose wisely. I don't respect this longing for divine paternal intervention. The Maker as believed in by most Caldari prefers that Humanity should chart our own course and stand by ourselves, not lean on daddy. Though I also don't believe in the Maker as a literal entity, I certainly find that philosophy more mature and uplifting.

2) The existence of your god does not hinge on the consequences of whether or not he exists. Maybe the universe is just dirt and dust exactly as you say. Asserting that you believe such a universe would deserve to crumble does absolutely nothing to demonstrate that your god exists, it just demonstrates your desire that he should. Desiring something to be true does not cause it to be true.

AKA Hambone

Author of The Deathworlders

Halete
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#64 - 2013-05-31 10:04:04 UTC
Your blatant disrespect towards your allies and overt lust for Minmatar flesh grows tiring, Verin.

I wonder how long it will take you to steel your conviction and strike at the Empire, rather than shout and tattle about it loudly and obnoxiously.

"To know the true path, but yet, to never follow it. That is possibly the gravest sin" - The Scriptures, Book of Missions 13:21

Stitcher
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#65 - 2013-05-31 10:19:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Stitcher
You're not going to bother actually having a conversation with me, then?

AKA Hambone

Author of The Deathworlders

Halete
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#66 - 2013-05-31 10:30:59 UTC
Stitcher wrote:
You're not going to bother actually having a conversation with me, then?


I have been watching what you have to say for over a year, Stitcher.

You have detailed your thoughts in excruciating length. But conversing seems to be all that you are willing to do.

"To know the true path, but yet, to never follow it. That is possibly the gravest sin" - The Scriptures, Book of Missions 13:21

Stitcher
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#67 - 2013-05-31 11:15:26 UTC
Jin-Mei legend has it that the Sang-Do lord Gun Yeng surrendered to his rival upon receiving a letter of only three carefully calligraphed words. Language is a weapon, pilot. Conversation is a battlefield. Make no mistake, I AM striking at the Empire. Don't let the fact that nobody is dying confuse you.

If you mean to taunt me into squandering my resources on a futile campaign of violence in Amarrian space, you're wasting your time. "Put your money where your mouth is" is a common gambit by those who have a frail grasp on the big picture. You're feeling insecure fighting me on my terms, and so demand that I give up the advantage.

Not happening. I'm one capsuleer, and the Empire is enormous. I could bankrupt myself on ammunition alone without losing a single ship, and barely make a dent. But I have a near-limitless supply of loquacity.

I'll save the physical violence for when, and where, I can make a difference. But the nice thing about garrulity is that costs nothing but my time, and you never know when, and against whom, I might score a telling blow.

AKA Hambone

Author of The Deathworlders

Halete
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#68 - 2013-05-31 12:07:05 UTC
Stitcher wrote:

You're feeling insecure fighting me on my terms, and so demand that I give up the advantage.


You are an incredibly superficial little man, Verin. Spare me your political fugitive and tiring sophistry.

You are verbose, surely. But to think of yourself as a warrior of the tongue is commiserable. All of your arguments against the Empire, all of your chest-beating, all of it amounts to an attractive little nothing.

Now I am sure that you will smile to yourself in your room seeing that I do taunt; and yes I taunt you, but I taunt you because you make a whelp of yourself.

The faithful will meet you on any front. That is where we differ. I do not demand that you fight on terms that are not your own, for there we shall meet you, too. It is you who refuses to fight on any other field of combat.

So, make with your dulcet speeches as you do, convincing yourself that any attempt to fight us would be ultimately irrelevant. Continue to offer nothing but hot air, where you will surely remain irrelevant. I know that I will not remove you from your fortress. You have realized long ago that any such ideological differences such as these are settled only in blood, but you will not rise to the heights demanded of you and must instead reason that this is no fault of yourself.

"To know the true path, but yet, to never follow it. That is possibly the gravest sin" - The Scriptures, Book of Missions 13:21

Veikitamo Gesakaarin
Doomheim
#69 - 2013-05-31 12:29:36 UTC
Stitcher wrote:

If you mean to taunt me into squandering my resources on a futile campaign of violence in Amarrian space, you're wasting your time. "Put your money where your mouth is" is a common gambit by those who have a frail grasp on the big picture. You're feeling insecure fighting me on my terms, and so demand that I give up the advantage.


I might counter that too much pseudo-intellectual platitudes with so little action taken is usually the recourse of those who prefer the safety and comfort of doing all the talking while others do all the fighting and dying. For those who are in fact willing and able to do the fighting and dying in pursuit of their own beliefs and convictions the opinions of those who prefer the use of empty rhetoric become easily dismissed as nothing more than trite pedantry.

From what I have read, you have never been lacking in waxing romantic about Caldari culture, I find it unfortunate that the concept of having the willingness to carry out the will of your convictions through force and violence has never been discussed even when the pages of Caldari history has always been authored by those willing to write in it with blood.

Kurilaivonen|Concern

Stitcher
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#70 - 2013-05-31 12:54:08 UTC
Violence is a means to an end, a tool. It's one of many in my arsenal - I have used force and death in the past, and no doubt will need to do so again. But it's just one of the options, and I prefer to use the right tool for the job.

The problem with immortals is that violence rarely works on us. What am I going to accomplish by blowing a capsuleer up other than making them resent me? It's not like killing proves me right. I'll fight to defend property, territory, people and resources, but there really is no point in shooting an Empyrean over philosophical differences because A) it doesn't prove me right, and B) they'd just wake up disliking me even more and no closer to either agreeing with or disproving me.

The same problem applies to the Empire. it's too big for any amount of carnage I can cause to have any real impact, and in any case just turns me into an enemy who is not to be heeded.

So taunting me to get my warpaint on and go break stuff to prove my point isn't going to work. I know full well that it would be futile.

AKA Hambone

Author of The Deathworlders

Halete
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#71 - 2013-05-31 12:59:00 UTC
So you understand the importance of defending property, territory, personnel and resources but not that of removing property, territory, personnel and resources from an opponent?

How quaint and strikingly un-Caldari.

"To know the true path, but yet, to never follow it. That is possibly the gravest sin" - The Scriptures, Book of Missions 13:21

Sverloft
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#72 - 2013-05-31 13:03:20 UTC
Kim Ji-Young wrote:
I didn't know what the big deal was but it was clearly a case of them or me because they had that scrambler thingy on my ship, so I did what I had to do and I shot them all. None of them were capsuleers so they're all dead now.


You said it yourself. Better them than you. Why care? You didn't know them. They were of absolutely no consequence or importance to you. Give a logical reason as to why you should give the slightest crap. Screw them.

Some people live by the saying "Don't give an inch.". I tend to go by the saying "Don't give a s**t.".
Kim Ji-Young
Ji Young Kim Bap
#73 - 2013-05-31 13:14:35 UTC
Sverloft wrote:
Kim Ji-Young wrote:
I didn't know what the big deal was but it was clearly a case of them or me because they had that scrambler thingy on my ship, so I did what I had to do and I shot them all. None of them were capsuleers so they're all dead now.


You said it yourself. Better them than you. Why care? You didn't know them. They were of absolutely no consequence or importance to you. Give a logical reason as to why you should give the slightest crap. Screw them.

Some people live by the saying "Don't give an inch.". I tend to go by the saying "Don't give a s**t.".


Just because logically I know that I shouldn't care, doesn't mean that it doesn't upset me anyway.

Maybe it's more about a general squeamishness and weird feeling of dread than any particular concern for their well-being. Maybe it subconsciously reminds me of my own mortality (don't start with the "we are immortals" bullcrap, anyone, how many drugs are you people on who believe in that nonsense). Maybe I need a drink.
Sverloft
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#74 - 2013-05-31 13:24:41 UTC
Consider this: They didn't know you either. Yet, they tried to kill you without a moment's hesitation. Any shred of sympathy you may feel for them is undeserved.

I suppose I should be mindful that some people do feel differently. The first time I had to put some attackers out of their misery all I felt was rage. Nowadays it's more just annoyance.

A drink is a sound idea, by the way. Make it 10.
Stitcher
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#75 - 2013-05-31 13:24:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Stitcher
Halete wrote:
So you understand the importance of defending property, territory, personnel and resources but not that of removing property, territory, personnel and resources from an opponent?

How quaint and strikingly un-Caldari.


Of course I recognise the value of those things.

But my objective is to counter them on a difference of philosophy, not to plunder, conquer, subjugate and annex. I'm setting out to polish a gemstone here, and you're taunting me for not running it through a woodchipper.

AKA Hambone

Author of The Deathworlders

Kim Ji-Young
Ji Young Kim Bap
#76 - 2013-05-31 13:31:13 UTC
Sverloft wrote:
Consider this: They didn't know you either. Yet, they tried to kill you without a moment's hesitation. Any shred of sympathy you may feel for them is undeserved.

I suppose I should be mindful that some people do feel differently. The first time I had to put some attackers out of their misery all I felt was rage. Nowadays it's more just annoyance.

A drink is a sound idea, by the way. Make it 10.


"Sympathy" is the wrong word. "Empathy" isn't even the right word. It's more like "don'tlikedeadthingsthy" but that's not a word so I dunno.

Stitcher
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#77 - 2013-05-31 13:34:54 UTC
Necrophobia.

AKA Hambone

Author of The Deathworlders

Halete
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#78 - 2013-05-31 13:36:38 UTC
Stitcher wrote:

But my objective is to counter them on a difference of philosophy, not to plunder, conquer, subjugate and annex. I'm setting out to polish a gemstone here, and you're taunting me for not running it through a woodchipper.


No, I'm taunting you for polishing your gemstone with a filthy rag, whilst your foes run it through a woodchipper. You reason that with enough rubbing you'll be able to polish it, ignoring that it becomes exponentially harder to clean it's surface as it's broken down into more and more pieces.

"To know the true path, but yet, to never follow it. That is possibly the gravest sin" - The Scriptures, Book of Missions 13:21

Desiderya
Blue Canary
Watch This
#79 - 2013-05-31 13:40:07 UTC
Stitcher wrote:

The problem with immortals is that violence rarely works on us. What am I going to accomplish by blowing a capsuleer up other than making them resent me? It's not like killing proves me right.


You can actually make them shut up and look bad while proving that you're more than just empty words.
On the other hand, how often do discussions change the opinions of those taking part in them?

Ruthlessness is the kindness of the wise.

Sverloft
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#80 - 2013-05-31 13:40:34 UTC
Kim Ji-Young wrote:
"Sympathy" is the wrong word. "Empathy" isn't even the right word. It's more like "don'tlikedeadthingsthy" but that's not a word so I dunno.


Word it how you will, death is an essential part of the universe, and worth getting used to.