EVE General Discussion

See, if instead of "no one logs in" the carebear response to a wardec was "everyone temporarily quits the game", THEN we would see some changes. Until then, all this is just noise.

Imagine if CCP starts seeing these stats:

Wardec on indy corp -> Entire indie corp quits the game for 1 month, 80% return rate.
Wardec on indy corp -> Entire indie corp quits the game for 3 months, 48% return rate.
Wardec on indy corp -> Entire indie corp quits the game for 2 months, 94% return rate.
Wardec on indy corp -> Entire indie corp quits the game for 1 month, 72% return rate,

How much do you want to bet that pretty soon the game mechanics will change that will make it difficult/impossible to wardec an indy corp?

What's more, as corps temporarily quit, the number of possible targets drops. As number of possible targets drops, PvPers get more and more bored. And some of them may quit, temporarily or permanently, out of sheer boredom due to lack of targets. So a drop in carebear activity will follow by a dip in PvPer activity as well.

Bottom line - don't like it? DO SOMETHING. You have the power. Just look at what the anti-Incarna folks pulled two summers ago, CCP is still so terrified that they can't even say "Incarna" without crossing themselves and spitting over the left shoulder. All carebears in this game have just as much if not more power.

if people were willing to give all their stuff to greedy ones there will be no wars over resources. However stupid people don't want to share their wealth

[quote=LHA Tarawa]
What's more, as corps temporarily quit, the number of possible targets drops. As number of possible targets drops, PvPers get more and more bored. And some of them may quit, temporarily or permanently, out of sheer boredom due to lack of targets. So a drop in carebear activity will follow by a dip in PvPer activity as well.

If carebears were willing to lose a 200 million ISK ship, every time they mine 1 billion ISK in ore or grind up a billion ISK in mission rewards, I think the PvPers would not be so angry with them.

The simple truth is, I am not willing to accept even that level of loss. I would rather lose 1 billion ISK in opportunity cost of not undocking rather than lose even a 50 million ISK ship. I can grind up a billion ISK a week, and if I lose a ship every 3 months, it is too much for me. Way, way too much.

I've lost 0 ships in the last 9 months.... yeah, that's just about the right amount of loss.



And, the other carebears I've played the game with (100s), are pretty much in agreement that absolutely 0 loss is pretty much the correct amount.


I get it why the PvPers are so frustrated by us. I really do.

Problem is, it is my experience, that this is NOT going to go away. ANY attempt to try to get us to accept a higher than "virtually 0" loss is simply going to result in us quitting the game...

And so some carebears would leave, but the economy wouldn't die. Neither would the activity of pvp players, who will now be clobbering each other for resources (this is already the case anywhere but high-sec, where resources are infinite). And I guarantee new players would still come to this game. The only difference would be that their initial perceptions would be shaped quite differently; they'd be much more accepting of conflict much earlier on. Humans are pretty hardy folk, and when the milk and honey doesn't flow, they adapt quickly. The only reason carebearism is even a thing is because high-sec makes this game too easy and they grow fat and complacent.

I tend to be more industrial/mining than pvp but I dont think loseing a ship is a big deal, especially if I can afford it. Infact I would happly fly expensive big ships in to low/null if kill-bords didnt exist. IMO thats whats preventing a lot of carebares from pvping, the loss stays on your record forever.

Maybe the "PvP"ers would actually target each other instead of doing Pvhelpless-target-whose-ship-isn't-fitted-for-fighting-other-players. No wait, that would require actual risk for them.

The majority of PvPers who whine about carebears are really carebears themselves; they just want to farm other players in no-risk situations as easily as possible. They don't want to be involved in real PvP any more than the miners and haulers do, and it's even worse in their case because they actually have the SP in the right place and the ships with the right fits, and they're still too scared to go fight someone who might fight back. EVE is supposed to be hard. For everyone. Not just "hard for all of my potential targets."

Its more than that and you know it, there are corps that put heavy imphisis on the efficency ratio.

I could kill kill 4 ships in a tengu but the 5th one kills me and because of isk efficency I am considered to be the one who lost. My view is that I won but the majority of players dot see it that way.

And no this hasnt actually happend to me, I cant even fly a tengu yet, Just useing an example.

Maybe the "PvP"ers would actually target each other instead of doing Pvhelpless-target-whose-ship-isn't-fitted-for-fighting-other-players. No wait, that would require actual risk for them.