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[Odyssey] Navy Battleships

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Author
Jonas Sukarala
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#41 - 2013-05-13 17:06:35 UTC
CCP Rise wrote:
Somehow typo'd the Navy Thron - its not losing a drone - sorry about that.


is it just me or does the navy domi and mega look very similar domi is more ganky and mega is tankier doesn't quite seem to fit their roles here.... too much drones and guns mixed together makes them a bit of a blend not much uniqueness and variation.

'Tech3 ships need to be put down, like a rabid dog drooling everywhere in the house, they are out of line' CCP Ytterbium Nerf missile range into place where is the TD missile change?  ..projectiles should use capacitor. ABC's should be T2 HABC and nerf web strength its still too high

Ivana Twinkle
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#42 - 2013-05-13 17:07:07 UTC
Techfleet, Rejoyce!
Altimo
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#43 - 2013-05-13 17:07:39 UTC
Once again I feel like the tempest has been eclipsed by the other navy ships.

The fleet typhoon is my new best friend, Love the Navy Raven, that thing is sexy. Most of the other ships are fine too, would like to see the Navy Megathrone have 8 guns since no other gallente ship has 8 guns.

But the tempest.. what are you guys doing? I've seen what is said on it but it just does not make any sense. The typhoon and maelstrom outclass this ship, Typhoon beats it in speed and damage and tank, Maelstrom beats it in damage and tank. Tempest does not seem to match either ship very well.

Add another turret or increase the bonus on it, do something to make it more worth while.
Kerdrak
Querry Moon
#44 - 2013-05-13 17:08:35 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Heribeck Weathers wrote:


N-Raven - good god that thing will be a beast


Remember that it's losing the damage bonus: it now has 8 effective launchers, the same as the standard Raven.


But at the same time, cruise missiles get a DPS boost, making the Navy Raven the most flexible missioning ship. Wasting time killing small ships? not anymore...
CCP Rise
C C P
C C P Alliance
#45 - 2013-05-13 17:09:15 UTC
Quote:
please tell me TD's with missiles are on there and command links /T3 nerf and command ships


You're right, these things too. Theres so much to do!

@ccp_rise

TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#46 - 2013-05-13 17:10:03 UTC
That typhoon is a bit ridiculous. Again with the vastly different bonuses, making it basically just a turret ship with double damage bonus, but also with a missile bonus that won't come into play much. It's like the fleet scythe all over again.
Nihilim Darth
Ne-corp
#47 - 2013-05-13 17:10:32 UTC
CCP Rise wrote:
Somehow typo'd the Navy Thron - its not losing a drone - sorry about that.

Now we are talking Big smile
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#48 - 2013-05-13 17:12:32 UTC
Garviel Tarrant wrote:
Kagura Nikon wrote:
Want to point to you RIse that the current Fleet phoon with PROJECTILES outdamages the tempest with projectiles. That is sad.. and I did not even factor in the better slot layout of the typhoon.


BOTH the normal and fleet tempest must be more dangerous for a ship with DOUBLE damage bonus. Currently it cannot outdamage the typhoon, maelestrom, Hyperion, Megatron, armageddon in basiccally ANY relevant range !


The tempest current layout + bonus combination is HORRIBLE! IT you insist on keepign it then it would need to gain at LEAST 100/125 drone bay to match what the typhoon do with 1 single bonus!


Phoon is supposed to outgank it...



You mean the phoon is to have better damage , better mobility, better scan resolution, better swlot layout, better effective tank ( derived from slot layout).. BEtter.. EVERYTHING?

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"

CCP Rise
C C P
C C P Alliance
#49 - 2013-05-13 17:13:21 UTC
The idea with the Tempest is that it fits really well into a lot of armor based compositions, acting more or less like an armor Maelstrom. It still has higher alpha than the Typhoon, with a lot more hp and similar utility. It goes a lot faster than the other combat battleships and has much smaller sig, so it definitely isn't eclipsed completely.

I can understand why some of you might want something with a bit more pop and I promise to talk with Fozzie and the rest of the department to make sure we're happy with this form before Odyssey goes out.

@ccp_rise

IrJosy
Club 1621
#50 - 2013-05-13 17:14:34 UTC
CCP Rise wrote:
Somehow typo'd the Navy Thron - its not losing a drone - sorry about that.


Why are you nerfing the navy thron so hard?
Warde Guildencrantz
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#51 - 2013-05-13 17:16:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Warde Guildencrantz
haha no, you're leaving the 8th low slot on the typhoon fleet issue.

If I can't use my TFI in armor fleets, I can't join armor fleets.

Still pretty sure you haven't responded on the T1 caldari boat topic whether the scorp has 110 base scan res or whether that was a typo.

TunDraGon ~ Low sec piracy since 2003 ~ Youtube ~ Join Us

Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#52 - 2013-05-13 17:16:26 UTC
CCP Rise wrote:


TEMPEST FLEET ISSUE
The Tempest Fleet Issue is becoming Minmatar’s ‘combat’ battleship, and as a result will move more solidly into a role that it already takes on as a very strong projectile platform with an armor base – something that is difficult to find elsewhere. The Tempest, as always, wants to occupy a space between attack and combat, and therefor has unusually high speed and unusually low sig for its role.

Minmatar Battleship Skill Bonuses:
+5% bonus to Large Projectile Turret rate of fire
+5% bonus to Large Projectile Turret damage

Slot layout: 8H, 5M, 7L; 6 turrets, 4 launchers
Fittings: 17500 PWG(+450), 580 CPU(+3)
Defense (shields / armor / hull): 10200(+884) / 10800(+369) / 9000(-961)
Capacitor (amount / recharge rate): 5500(+187.5) / 1150s(-4.875s)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 130(-2) / .115(+.007) / 103300000 / 16.47s(+1s)
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 75 / 100
Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 74km(+11.5km) / 100 / 7
Sensor strength: 24 Ladar Sensor Strength(+.25)
Signature radius: 350(+10)



You mean its unusually fail becuse its inferior to the Typhoon in everything but 1800 armor HP? If its a cobmat Battleship give it 100/125 drone bay at LEAST!!!

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"

mama guru
Yazatas.
#53 - 2013-05-13 17:16:59 UTC
The tempest is still the worst battleship in the game, no suprise there. It underpreforms in literally every role it can take. Give it an extra turret and 7.5% ROF / 7.5% falloff bonus or something instead of the archaiac double damage bonus designed in 2004 to compensate for underpowered minmatar guns.

A bit dissapointed in gallente ones. Mega stays pretty much the same, which is good. Dominix is a throwback to the old one which is nice for the nostalgic. I'd prefer to see it as the ultimate drone battleship but I guess you can't have them all.

Navy geddon and apoc look pretty sweet sweet.

Overall the changes are good, CNR and SNI fill different neiches within the same playing field. One's got better tank, the other is faster and with slightly better damage application.



EVE online is the fishermans friend of MMO's. If it's too hard you are too weak.

Pattern Clarc
Citeregis
#54 - 2013-05-13 17:18:43 UTC
An extra mid and a whole lot more grid and fittings and you might succeed in stopping the tempest and fleet tempest from failing hard post odyessy.

Ex CSM member & Designer of the Tornado. Gallente - Pilot satisfaction

Liang Nuren
No Salvation
Top Belt for Fun
#55 - 2013-05-13 17:19:26 UTC
CCP Rise wrote:

ARMAGEDDON NAVY ISSUE
The Armageddon Navy Issue will not follow the new tech 1 Armageddon design. Instead, it will continue to do what it has been doing as an efficient laser brawler. The Navy Geddon is getting plenty of use the way it is now, and we didn’t see a need to make an ‘improved’ version of the new tech 1 Geddon. As a ‘combat’ ship, it will get some increased hitpoints along with other tweaks to its base stats, but its overall performance shouldn’t change much.

Amarr Battleship Skill Bonuses:
+5% Large Energy Turret rate of fire
+10% Large Energy Turret cap use

Slot layout: 8H, 4M, 8L; 7 turrets , 0 launchers
Fittings: 17500 PWG(+175), 560 CPU(+3)
Defense (shields / armor / hull): 8500(+296.5) / 11500(+1539) / 10000(+684)
Capacitor (amount / recharge rate): 6000(+687.5) / 1100s(+125s)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 105 / .13(+.002) / 105200000 / 18.96s
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 125 / 375(+200)
Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 70km(+5k) / 110 / 7
Sensor strength: 26 Radar Sensor Strength (+4.75)
Signature radius: 440 (+70)


A couple of comments on the underlined parts:
- You have no idea how close to pre-rage I was. Crisis averted.
- Again with the massive increase in sig radius and believing it won't change overall performance. How much extra DPS (percentage wise) do you think that the Geddon will be taking from other battleships? Shocked

-Liang

I'm an idiot, don't mind me.

Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#56 - 2013-05-13 17:21:43 UTC
CCP Rise wrote:
The idea with the Tempest is that it fits really well into a lot of armor based compositions, acting more or less like an armor Maelstrom. It still has higher alpha than the Typhoon, with a lot more hp and similar utility. It goes a lot faster than the other combat battleships and has much smaller sig, so it definitely isn't eclipsed completely.

I can understand why some of you might want something with a bit more pop and I promise to talk with Fozzie and the rest of the department to make sure we're happy with this form before Odyssey goes out.



Ok ok, Just try to remember that navy ships are used by peopel trying to get an edge therefore they must have somethign goign for them. WHen you undock on a fleet tempest you wil have a plan ( Fleet doctrines in 0.0 are not included in taht, 0.0 combat became so stupid and mindless that I do not even dare to brign it up in this discussion).


More alpha then typhoon is not a reason to use it. If you want alpha you will go maelstrom, if you want mobility you go typhoon. Being A little bit bad at EVERYTHING is not a role. No one will select a combat ship based on that!


It must be GOOD at something. That is IMPORTANT! 2 damage bonus ship, it shows its supposed to be a gangy ship. Bring its turrets to 7 and lower drone bay a bit.. Or keep turrets and increase drone bay. Give a reason for anyoen select a tempst over some other ship in some realistic scenario.

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"

Vicar2008
MCMLXXVI
#57 - 2013-05-13 17:24:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Vicar2008
Love the changes to the navy assembly lines, wait's with baited breath with wtf your going to do with the now largely defunct T2 Marauders!!!!
IrJosy
Club 1621
#58 - 2013-05-13 17:25:16 UTC
mama guru wrote:
The tempest is still the worst battleship in the game, no suprise there. It underpreforms in literally every role it can take. Give it an extra turret and 7.5% ROF / 7.5% falloff bonus or something instead of the archaiac double damage bonus designed in 2004 to compensate for underpowered minmatar guns.

A bit dissapointed in gallente ones. Mega stays pretty much the same, which is good. Dominix is a throwback to the old one which is nice for the nostalgic. I'd prefer to see it as the ultimate drone battleship but I guess you can't have them all.

Navy geddon and apoc look pretty sweet sweet.

Overall the changes are good, CNR and SNI fill different neiches within the same playing field. One's got better tank, the other is faster and with slightly better damage application.




Yes the tempest is bad please don't use it. Keep da prices LOW while we murder you with them.
Altimo
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#59 - 2013-05-13 17:25:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Altimo
CCP Rise wrote:
The idea with the Tempest is that it fits really well into a lot of armor based compositions, acting more or less like an armor Maelstrom. It still has higher alpha than the Typhoon, with a lot more hp and similar utility. It goes a lot faster than the other combat battleships and has much smaller sig, so it definitely isn't eclipsed completely.

I can understand why some of you might want something with a bit more pop and I promise to talk with Fozzie and the rest of the department to make sure we're happy with this form before Odyssey goes out.


Thank you for the reply, However even though you say it isn't "eclipsed completely" you do acknowledge that it is outmatched to some extent, With regards to speed and alpha, the typhoon is faster and the maelstrom can still beat the fleet tempest in alpha due to its 8 guns. Which is much cheaper than a fleet tempest, the fleet typhoon is also cheaper. I guess what I'm saying is that the strengths the current Tempest have, do not shine as well as the other ships do with with their strengths. This goes for both the fleet and the regular tempest.
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
#60 - 2013-05-13 17:26:16 UTC
Quote:
GALLENTE

MEGATHRON NAVY ISSUE
The Navy Thron will be Gallente’s ‘attack’ battleship, and therefore will adjust in many of the same ways that the tech 1 Megathron did, including the switch from damage bonus to rate of fire.

Gallente Battleship Skill Bonuses:
+5% Large Hybrid Turret rate of fire (replaces large hybrid turret damage)
+10% Large Hybrid Turret falloff

Slot layout: 8H, 4M, 8L; 7 turrets, 1 launchers(-1)
Fittings: 16275 PWG, 630 CPU(+25)
Defense (shields / armor / hull): 9000(-316) / 9500(-461) / 10500(-750)
Capacitor (amount / recharge rate): 6000 (+375) / 1150s(-4.875s)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 130(+10) / .105 (-.005) / 98400000(-6800000) / 15.01s(-1.84s)
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 125 / 175
Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 72.5km / 95 / 7
Sensor strength: 25 Magnetometric Sensor Strength (-1.25)
Signature radius: 385(-15)


i bolded the part that needs to be fixed... tracking bonus for the tech I version is ok... but gal need a fleet ship and a mega navy issue can be that fleet ship... and the only way to make it so it to give it a fall off bonus... that will bring large neutrons with null into fleet bs range...

otherwise you are just making a pretty station game ship...

There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:

Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.