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New Dev Blog: Player-owned Customs Office

First post First post
Author
Lolmer
Merciless Reckoning
#1401 - 2011-10-24 18:19:04 UTC
CCP Nullarbor wrote:
Hundo Kay wrote:
I have scanned the topics, and I still have not seen any response to the question of what happens to the PI goodies stored inside when the POCO goes Boom.

Do we get a drop like everything else at 50/50 for each item batch, or nothing?

This single question will determine the long term survivability of the POCO.

If the drop rate is 0% then when the newness of ganking these things wears off, they should become more stable.

If on the otherhand, there is a drop potential, I can see a lot more people having an incentive to not only knock these things around like Loot Pinatas, but also to maintain a small PvP force around them for the 24+ hours of reinforcement.

We already know people can still get their stuff out before it pops, but will there be an incentive to maintain a force at the POCO while popping it?

So please CCP, fill us in on the details of what happens when these things go "POP".


No drop, the items are just destroyed.


What kind of ******** idea is that? Why won't items drop after we destroy the "container"? That's not how EvE works! Even PLEX drops, and items in POS' drop, why would items in the POCO not drop?
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation
The Honda Accord
#1402 - 2011-10-24 19:04:46 UTC
Lolmer wrote:
CCP Nullarbor wrote:
Hundo Kay wrote:
I have scanned the topics, and I still have not seen any response to the question of what happens to the PI goodies stored inside when the POCO goes Boom.

Do we get a drop like everything else at 50/50 for each item batch, or nothing?

This single question will determine the long term survivability of the POCO.

If the drop rate is 0% then when the newness of ganking these things wears off, they should become more stable.

If on the otherhand, there is a drop potential, I can see a lot more people having an incentive to not only knock these things around like Loot Pinatas, but also to maintain a small PvP force around them for the 24+ hours of reinforcement.

We already know people can still get their stuff out before it pops, but will there be an incentive to maintain a force at the POCO while popping it?

So please CCP, fill us in on the details of what happens when these things go "POP".


No drop, the items are just destroyed.


What kind of ******** idea is that? Why won't items drop after we destroy the "container"? That's not how EvE works! Even PLEX drops, and items in POS' drop, why would items in the POCO not drop?



Yet another example of how poorly thought out this idea is. Do the folks on the team working on the new CO even play Eve?

Issler
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#1403 - 2011-10-24 19:26:41 UTC
Issler Dainze wrote:
Lolmer wrote:
CCP Nullarbor wrote:
Hundo Kay wrote:
I have scanned the topics, and I still have not seen any response to the question of what happens to the PI goodies stored inside when the POCO goes Boom.

Do we get a drop like everything else at 50/50 for each item batch, or nothing?

This single question will determine the long term survivability of the POCO.

If the drop rate is 0% then when the newness of ganking these things wears off, they should become more stable.

If on the otherhand, there is a drop potential, I can see a lot more people having an incentive to not only knock these things around like Loot Pinatas, but also to maintain a small PvP force around them for the 24+ hours of reinforcement.

We already know people can still get their stuff out before it pops, but will there be an incentive to maintain a force at the POCO while popping it?

So please CCP, fill us in on the details of what happens when these things go "POP".


No drop, the items are just destroyed.


What kind of ******** idea is that? Why won't items drop after we destroy the "container"? That's not how EvE works! Even PLEX drops, and items in POS' drop, why would items in the POCO not drop?



Yet another example of how poorly thought out this idea is. Do the folks on the team working on the new CO even play Eve?

Issler


Earlier you were talking about how people would be taking theses down just for the sake of grief play. If that's the case, not having them drop anything is smart move. It ensures that taking these down is not a profitable venture, increasing the chances they will be left up or only taken down by someone with the intent to replace them. To what degree it will be effective is anyone's guess, but the fact that they cut that off in the thought process suggests that yes, they do play this game, to the point that they know exactly what you were thinking.
Kassasis Dakkstromri
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1404 - 2011-10-24 20:28:35 UTC
No drop from a PCO, protects PI Operators.

It would be far to easy and profitable for a corporation to allow an accumulation of material from neutral pilots in their PCO, and then just blow it up themselves to get the drop.

Then put up a new one, and rinse and repeat.

While a loot drop would be in keeping with EVE, it can't be implemented for a single point of access like a PCO without it being severely abused imo.

So while it might be ideal, it is impractical.

CCP you are bad at EVE... Stop potential silliness ~ Solo Wulf

Circumstantial Evidence
#1405 - 2011-10-24 21:15:41 UTC
CCP Omen 2011.10.18 15:56 wrote:
Orakkus wrote:
...do the attackers get any reward (i.e. PI materials from the office) either when they reinforce it, or after they destroy it, or both?

Yes, we don't incentivize taking Customs Offices down, other than if you want the spot or want to refuse the current owner access. We want it to be a political feature more than a mechanical one.

Scrapyard Bob
EVE University
Ivy League
#1406 - 2011-10-24 21:29:58 UTC
Tyberius Franklin wrote:

Earlier you were talking about how people would be taking theses down just for the sake of grief play. If that's the case, not having them drop anything is smart move. It ensures that taking these down is not a profitable venture, increasing the chances they will be left up or only taken down by someone with the intent to replace them. To what degree it will be effective is anyone's guess, but the fact that they cut that off in the thought process suggests that yes, they do play this game, to the point that they know exactly what you were thinking.


The thing is - how often do people really leave PI goods sitting in the customs office?

W-space? Likely, because logistics out of the hole can be an issue some weeks.

Lo-sec? Not as likely, unless the planet was full and it wasn't safe enough to haul.

If POCOs are destroyable, people will not leave their stuff in the POCO for longer then necessary. Therefore, whether they drop stuff is not going to have much effect on destroying them to get at the stuff inside. The vast majority of the time, when you blow up a POCO there is going to be nothing there to "get".

POCOs should be destroyable, and they should have the same drop mechanics as other destroyable containers. But POCOs also need the possibility of setting up defenses equivalent to a medium POS at a minimum.

(I suspect the reason why CCP is not doing this is more to do with code-complexity rather then "should" or "should not".)
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#1407 - 2011-10-24 21:55:26 UTC
Scrapyard Bob wrote:
Tyberius Franklin wrote:

Earlier you were talking about how people would be taking theses down just for the sake of grief play. If that's the case, not having them drop anything is smart move. It ensures that taking these down is not a profitable venture, increasing the chances they will be left up or only taken down by someone with the intent to replace them. To what degree it will be effective is anyone's guess, but the fact that they cut that off in the thought process suggests that yes, they do play this game, to the point that they know exactly what you were thinking.


The thing is - how often do people really leave PI goods sitting in the customs office?

W-space? Likely, because logistics out of the hole can be an issue some weeks.

Lo-sec? Not as likely, unless the planet was full and it wasn't safe enough to haul.

If POCOs are destroyable, people will not leave their stuff in the POCO for longer then necessary. Therefore, whether they drop stuff is not going to have much effect on destroying them to get at the stuff inside. The vast majority of the time, when you blow up a POCO there is going to be nothing there to "get".

POCOs should be destroyable, and they should have the same drop mechanics as other destroyable containers. But POCOs also need the possibility of setting up defenses equivalent to a medium POS at a minimum.

(I suspect the reason why CCP is not doing this is more to do with code-complexity rather then "should" or "should not".)

You may well be right on the point of needing defenses for the POCO's, I'm not going to debate that as it wasn't the aspect I was replying to. The point of my post is to emphasize how, considering that most of the posts saying this won't work simply because of grief play in lowsec, it makes no sense to be surprised by or complain about CCP listening to then and taking steps to remove obvious incentives to destroy the POCO's. It makes even less sense to say that it's evidence of CCP not knowing their game. If anything it shows that they are making game mechanics bend to give this some possibility of working, which means they have foreseen at least one of the problems it can cause.
Meldan Anstian
The Night Crew
The Night Crew Alliance
#1408 - 2011-10-24 22:05:57 UTC
Scrapyard Bob wrote:


If POCOs are destroyable, people will not leave their stuff in the POCO for longer then necessary. Therefore, whether they drop stuff is not going to have much effect on destroying them to get at the stuff inside. The vast majority of the time, when you blow up a POCO there is going to be nothing there to "get".

POCOs should be destroyable, and they should have the same drop mechanics as other destroyable containers. But POCOs also need the possibility of setting up defenses equivalent to a medium POS at a minimum.



Ok, how do we make the economics work with destructible stations? Or indestructible stations for that matter.

I think any solution must meet the following criteria:

1. I think, and I have heard no disagreement, that there should not be a dramatic change to the economy. 10% boost to PI material prices is not a problem IMO, but 4x prices (or higher) is a no go with me. Current tax on a robotics is 300, max tax would be 6000, I don't see that as a huge problem, as that is less than ~10% the current going rate of robotics (75k or so).

2. There must be enough profit to pay for any investment in a PCO in a reasonable period of time. 6 months is not reasonable. What would be reasonable, can be discussed further.

3. There must be sufficient reason both to attack and defend a PCO. Otherwise the goal of increasing player interaction is not met.

4. PI, which is different from PCO ownership, should still work as intended - approximately the same reward, for the same amount of risk, for the same time,SP, and ISK investment. I don't think dramatically changing the role of PI is or should be a goal, nor should how PI is done dramatically change.

5. Make sense in low sec, null sec and WH space. I would disagree with a proposal that would have radically different mechanics in different sec status systems.

6. Any increase in command center launch capability (size of launch, cool down timer or ISK cost) must be balanced to still encourage the use of a PCO, but not too severely deter someone from using a planet where there is no PCO.

I still think my proposal is the best that I have read. Does it address all the above successfully? I don't think so. Nor does any other that I have seen.

As of right now, I'm in favor of abandoning the idea and not changing anything.

Rather than argue bits and pieces, I would love to see more ideas about a complete solution where the economics make sense.
D'Kelle
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#1409 - 2011-10-24 22:42:56 UTC
Sorry but err; I think you CCP guys are still a few cells short of a brain. When you have a Corp settled in a WH and they own the Customs offices who the heck do you think they are going to charge for their usage when the Corp members are making stuff for the Corp anyway. No self respecting WH invader is going to be interested in doing PI, he just wants to shoot ****.. and rightly so. don’t forget the Corp numbers in WH space and its hmmm, random accessibility, kind of makes defending them effectively very unlikely, not so in low or null sec where groups can be assembled and fly in on both sides to have some pew-pew fun.
Setting up say a minimum of 6 Customs offices which bring in no revenue to their users, only added costs (Oh wait they might save a few measly K Isk on each transaction) to and from the planet for the outlay of close on 500 mil for the 6 gantries and the items to turn those six into customs offices. Interesting, do you run CCP's finances the same way, no? Thought so, like hell you would, you would be bankrupt in 6months or less. Typically you are applying low or null sec parameters to WH space which has its own rules, benefits, and risks, which means it should have slightly different parameters, as you have for the Empire ones. Not the same as Empire of course (that would be just as daft), but some which allow for the anomalies of WH life. I have tried to show what In my opinion is an error in your set up, by attempting to view it from both side, me I look forward to some pew- pew it may bring, but I don’t want to lose my fun by this method of seemingly downward logarithmic spiralling of WH targets which become too costly for corps to maintain.
Cordo Draken
ABOS Industrial Enterprises
#1410 - 2011-10-24 23:30:27 UTC
I like the idea for further player involvement, but a couple comments... 1) no security defenses? And these are only for low/null sec? Yikes, this seems rather contradictory. 2) why not in High sec? Make it Just like POS for placement in limited security systems. That would definitely open up player interactions there too. Defense contracts, industrial corps hiring mercs to help eliminate their competition, ect. After-all a grand majority still reside in High-sec.

Whomever said, "You only get one shot to make a good impression," was utterly wrong. I've made plenty of great impressions with my Autocannons 

Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation
The Honda Accord
#1411 - 2011-10-24 23:59:24 UTC
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
Scrapyard Bob wrote:
Tyberius Franklin wrote:

Earlier you were talking about how people would be taking theses down just for the sake of grief play. If that's the case, not having them drop anything is smart move. It ensures that taking these down is not a profitable venture, increasing the chances they will be left up or only taken down by someone with the intent to replace them. To what degree it will be effective is anyone's guess, but the fact that they cut that off in the thought process suggests that yes, they do play this game, to the point that they know exactly what you were thinking.


The thing is - how often do people really leave PI goods sitting in the customs office?

W-space? Likely, because logistics out of the hole can be an issue some weeks.

Lo-sec? Not as likely, unless the planet was full and it wasn't safe enough to haul.

If POCOs are destroyable, people will not leave their stuff in the POCO for longer then necessary. Therefore, whether they drop stuff is not going to have much effect on destroying them to get at the stuff inside. The vast majority of the time, when you blow up a POCO there is going to be nothing there to "get".

POCOs should be destroyable, and they should have the same drop mechanics as other destroyable containers. But POCOs also need the possibility of setting up defenses equivalent to a medium POS at a minimum.

(I suspect the reason why CCP is not doing this is more to do with code-complexity rather then "should" or "should not".)

You may well be right on the point of needing defenses for the POCO's, I'm not going to debate that as it wasn't the aspect I was replying to. The point of my post is to emphasize how, considering that most of the posts saying this won't work simply because of grief play in lowsec, it makes no sense to be surprised by or complain about CCP listening to then and taking steps to remove obvious incentives to destroy the POCO's. It makes even less sense to say that it's evidence of CCP not knowing their game. If anything it shows that they are making game mechanics bend to give this some possibility of working, which means they have foreseen at least one of the problems it can cause.


I complained because this is now inconsistent with virtually everything else in Eve and is a lame bandaid on a very bad idea. Making them drop stuff makes them even better in nulsec. Even if they don't drop stuff blowing them up just the heck of it will be the new low sec hobby of griefers when they get bored camping the gates.

Also the more I think about this in WH the less sense it makes. There is no community of folks living cooperatively in WHs. There is usually one dominante group and everyone else is there to steal the WH or kill you.

Issler
Dominus Alterai
Star Freaks
#1412 - 2011-10-25 01:13:33 UTC
Lolmer wrote:
What kind of ******** idea is that? Why won't items drop after we destroy the "container"? That's not how EvE works! Even PLEX drops, and items in POS' drop, why would items in the POCO not drop?


They've said multiple times that they do not want people to benefit from shooting these. The only reason anyone would shoot these is to A.) Anchor their own or B.) try to get a fight out of whatever corp owns it.

Also to deny other corps/alliances PI assets, especially in 0.0 where it counts.

Reducing your holes to a quivering mess since 2009.

Dominus Alterai
Star Freaks
#1413 - 2011-10-25 01:15:57 UTC
D'Kelle wrote:
Sorry but err; I think you CCP guys are still a few cells short of a brain. When you have a Corp settled in a WH and they own the Customs offices who the heck do you think they are going to charge for their usage when the Corp members are making stuff for the Corp anyway. No self respecting WH invader is going to be interested in doing PI, he just wants to shoot ****.. and rightly so. don’t forget the Corp numbers in WH space and its hmmm, random accessibility, kind of makes defending them effectively very unlikely, not so in low or null sec where groups can be assembled and fly in on both sides to have some pew-pew fun.
Setting up say a minimum of 6 Customs offices which bring in no revenue to their users, only added costs (Oh wait they might save a few measly K Isk on each transaction) to and from the planet for the outlay of close on 500 mil for the 6 gantries and the items to turn those six into customs offices. Interesting, do you run CCP's finances the same way, no? Thought so, like hell you would, you would be bankrupt in 6months or less. Typically you are applying low or null sec parameters to WH space which has its own rules, benefits, and risks, which means it should have slightly different parameters, as you have for the Empire ones. Not the same as Empire of course (that would be just as daft), but some which allow for the anomalies of WH life. I have tried to show what In my opinion is an error in your set up, by attempting to view it from both side, me I look forward to some pew- pew it may bring, but I don’t want to lose my fun by this method of seemingly downward logarithmic spiralling of WH targets which become too costly for corps to maintain.

you can set tax rates to 0% if you own the customs office, so you don't need to pay anyone.

Reducing your holes to a quivering mess since 2009.

Dominus Alterai
Star Freaks
#1414 - 2011-10-25 01:18:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Dominus Alterai
Issler Dainze wrote:


I complained because this is now inconsistent with virtually everything else in Eve and is a lame bandaid on a very bad idea. Making them drop stuff makes them even better in nulsec. Even if they don't drop stuff blowing them up just the heck of it will be the new low sec hobby of griefers when they get bored camping the gates.

Also the more I think about this in WH the less sense it makes. There is no community of folks living cooperatively in WHs. There is usually one dominante group and everyone else is there to steal the WH or kill you.

Issler


It actually makes a lot of sense. You get increased capacity of the customs office for those off days where there's no high-sec exit, you can set tax rate to 0% so corp/alliance mates don't get charged, and you'll never get gangs of more than 20 people, unless they've come looking to take down your POS's too, in which case you have bigger things to worry about than a POCO.

Also, as CCP has already said, they don't want to make these grief ridden, so no drop makes sense. If there was a drop of PI stuff, you'd be seeing hundreds of these things blow up every week. I don't know about you, by my corp can't sustain putting 5 of these things up every month just so we can do PI.

Reducing your holes to a quivering mess since 2009.

Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#1415 - 2011-10-25 01:47:55 UTC
Issler Dainze wrote:

I complained because this is now inconsistent with virtually everything else in Eve and is a lame bandaid on a very bad idea. Making them drop stuff makes them even better in nulsec. Even if they don't drop stuff blowing them up just the heck of it will be the new low sec hobby of griefers when they get bored camping the gates.

Also the more I think about this in WH the less sense it makes. There is no community of folks living cooperatively in WHs. There is usually one dominante group and everyone else is there to steal the WH or kill you.

Issler


IIRC Corp hangar contents of an Orca don't drop, so there is a precedent for special cases. Also the reasoning behind this has already been mentioned.

As far as WH's, after the initial investment you are set. Having them pop up as soon as a command center was laid down made less sense than this new system, and once it's up, the isolated nature of WH's means you are set. Yes, there is initial cost and logistics, but no maintenance of follow up and eventually it will pay for itself by removing import/export tariffs paid. (although the ROI may need looked at).
Scrapyard Bob
EVE University
Ivy League
#1416 - 2011-10-25 04:00:14 UTC
As for the economics of destructible POCOs - it wouldn't be as big of an issue if there were multiple sizes to choose from.

Then you could have:

10M - POCO w/ half the PG/CPU of a small POS tower, 1000 m3, 100k ISK of fuel per day
20M - small tower sized POCO, 2000 m3, 400k ISK of fuel per day
40M - medium tower sized POCO, 3000 m3 packaged, 1M ISK of fuel/day
80M - large tower sized POCO, 4000 m3 packaged, 2M ISK of fuel/day

With the multiple sizes, you would then have the choice of "what do I want to risk" and "how much POS defense do I want to anchor". The current "single size" POCO proposal won't work - it will be too expensive for some situations, too easy to kill for others.

Give them small shield bubbles and make them so that if you have standings to use the POCO, you can enter the shields. Just like regular POS bubbles, you wouldn't be able to target anything inside the bubble. Those who use the POCO (such as haulers) would love the safety. Make it so that any standings change doesn't take place until downtime, to avoid someone ejecting people from the POCO bubble.

The base P1 and P2 tariffs would have to be increased about 5x to pay for a POCO erected at a P1 harvest planet. And P4 tariff is currently about 2x too high.
Meldan Anstian
The Night Crew
The Night Crew Alliance
#1417 - 2011-10-25 05:51:25 UTC
Scrapyard Bob wrote:

Then you could have:

10M - POCO w/ half the PG/CPU of a small POS tower, 1000 m3, 100k ISK of fuel per day
20M - small tower sized POCO, 2000 m3, 400k ISK of fuel per day
40M - medium tower sized POCO, 3000 m3 packaged, 1M ISK of fuel/day
80M - large tower sized POCO, 4000 m3 packaged, 2M ISK of fuel/day



I do really like the idea of different sized PCO's. That certainly helps the economics for different planets with different resource levels and/or different sec status.

Some questions:

The 1,2,3,4k sizes... those are the sizes of the PCO packaged, the size of the cargo hold you need for hauling to the planet for anchoring? The PG/CPU is just for guns to be placed 5k outside the bubble?

I never tried to blow up something from inside the shield bubble in a POS. I assume that if I am in the bubble, I can attack freely? If that is true, why would I ever allow anyone else but corp/alliance mates access to the PCO? That would really hurt the economy as only those who own a PCO would be able to have a profitable PI operation on a planet. Taxes would then be a non-issue, as you wouldn't tax yourself.

If you do PI, would you be able to tell if the PCO gives you access without actually warping to the PCO? I assume that if I don't have access, your defense guns would shoot at me. Can you configure it so that you give someone access, but also configure the guns to shoot them?

The concern that I have with a corp locking out everyone not in their corp/alliance, particularly in low sec, but to a lesser extent in null, is that corps would own many more PCO's than they can or would effectively use for PI. If a planet currently has 10 random players doing PI on it, then this change takes effect, a corp puts up a PCO and locks out access to everyone else. Would that corp have 10 players doing PI on that planet? Probably not, probably far fewer. I just see a big impact on the economy and supply goes way down. I see the small individual, often noob, doing PI being locked out of doing PI for the most part and never venturing into low sec. I don't think that is a good thing for the game.

I disagree with the idea of a safe spot for haulers at the PCO. As one who does PI, that point is really my only point of vulnerability. I can't cloak and access the CO, and I can't cloak before moving away from the CO. Cloaky hauler properly fitted getting tackled at the gate? Damn unlikely, even for a decent sized gang. It really makes PI entirely safe, assuming that I have access to the PCO.

If I just put up a PCO, 2 minutes ago, do I get ejected from my own PCO because of standings that don't take effect until downtime? Or do standings configuration within the first 15 minutes or whatever of anchoring, does that take effect immediately regardless of when downtime is? If I am doing PI, do I get an email that a PCO on the planet that I am doing PI on just changed it's access and I'm no longer allowed after downtime? So a smart PCO owner would change the settings 10 minutes before downtime and effectively stop someone from having an profitable PI planet. That happened too many times to me and I would stop doing PI.

Does the size of the office give any limitations? Other than more defenses, what does a larger PCO do for me? Is there a limit to the taxes I can collect with a 10m PCO, and the limit goes up with larger PCOs? Who would ever attack a large PCO? I'm thinking a large PCO would have the defenses of a large POS. Not worth it given the income potential from a (any) planet I don't think.

Why would I bother to defend a 10m PCO? It's 10m, which is worth about a fitted t1 cruiser. The income? Bah, destroy mine and I'll put mine back up in a day or 2 after I destroy yours. The fear that I have with this is that a PCO is not worth defending, but gets destroyed so often you don't get a return on your investment. End result is everyone gives up on PCO's in low sec and there are no PCO's anywhere other than in high sec or in SOV/WH. I tend to think, that much of the PI materials that comes from low sec goes to small, high sec or industrial corps via the market. The majority of PI in null and WH, stays in null and WH space. Just see big ripples through the economy that are unintended.

Personally, I would have no interest in investing in something that could be destroyed that only nets me what, 10 or 20 mil ISK a week? I can invest 10 mil in station trading and double my money in a week, and thats without margin trading or the SP investment of PI. Fighting over, having to spend money to fuel the PCO, and all that crap, for 20 mil a week? That's for my corp, not me! I personally get nothing out of it, unless I am a 1 man corp. In which case, I can't defend any of my PCO's anyway.

What do you think would be a "target" payback time for a PCO of any size?

I don't like the idea of guns on a PCO, especially if you can lock anyone not in your corp out from the PCO. You and your corp essentially have a safe spot at the PCO. That goes against the idea of increasing player interaction. I don't think that anyone should be safe going to a PCO.

Like I said, I do like your idea of different sized PCOs. While some more questions need be answered, the other parts I think have problems.

I have not done the math for the economics. Too tired and too late. ;)
Xylorn Hasher
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#1418 - 2011-10-25 07:02:29 UTC
Problem with POCO will be their high building costs. I think their price will be near 200m after patch deployment and 150m later.
Thats 600 - 1 Bil costs just to keep making Robotics for example (on 5 planets ).
Who will risk so much ISK in lowsec?

In other hand if pirates will set them in their area of operation they will gain free early warning system of incoming fleets ( more Pvp ) and some kind of area control.

But... those POCOs have 10 mil shield!!
Someone will must be very determined to take it down, not to mention how boring it will be.

All my posts are made shortly after Marihuana consumption.

pussnheels
Viziam
#1419 - 2011-10-25 08:47:33 UTC
First thank you for your time reading this feed back CCP

My main concern like so many of my fellow PI ers is that we will be locked out from all the usefull planets in low sec by larger entities just because they can and they will
, acces should be allowed for all, i think most will not be that concern about 100%tax or atleast enlarge the command centre hold and payload significant, if you not going to change the standing acces , at the moment it can barely hold a day worth of p1 production at best and most of us don't have the time to come and empty it twice a day

The debate about if POCO should be destructable or not is interesting and some good valid points beeen made for both sides , i just keep a open mind

I think the majority of us like to know what you will be changing from your original concept

I do not agree with what you are saying , but i will defend to the death your right to say it...... Voltaire

Jowen Datloran
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#1420 - 2011-10-25 08:49:17 UTC
Creat Posudol wrote:
With destructible POCOs the incentive for large entities to attack drops significantly. Yes, they can grieve people, but it's tedious and provides NO payout WHATSOEVER. They don't drop anything upon destruction. It would be solely to grieve, and there is no reason anyone would do that on a large scale except to influence the market and control prices. Providing a payout to grieving these structures is a very VERY bad thing in my opinion!

I am amazed that somebody can write things like this such a short time after Goons have been causing havoc on high sec ice fields.

Mr. Science & Trade Institute, EVE Online Lorebook