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What kind of DPS should I be getting out of a Drake?
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BORTRON BEEFBURGER
Boner Kingdom
#1 - 2013-04-19 22:52:15 UTC
?
Dato Koppla
Neuronix
#2 - 2013-04-19 23:08:28 UTC
Around 550dps with Heavies (fury + hobs) and 700 with HAMs (rage and hobs) with perfect skills, although those numbers don't really mean anything cause I just slapped on 3 BCUs and it is with perfect skills, it depends on what you intend to use the Drake for.

Also, protip: get a fitting program such as Eve Fitting Tool or Pyfa, it will allow you to plug your skills in and test fits based on your skills.
BORTRON BEEFBURGER
Boner Kingdom
#3 - 2013-04-19 23:11:23 UTC
Dato Koppla wrote:
Around 550dps with Heavies (fury + hobs) and 700 with HAMs (rage and hobs) with perfect skills, although those numbers don't really mean anything cause I just slapped on 3 BCUs and it is with perfect skills, it depends on what you intend to use the Drake for.

Also, protip: get a fitting program such as Eve Fitting Tool or Pyfa, it will allow you to plug your skills in and test fits based on your skills.


Wow im a day away from getting tech 2 heavy missiles and using arbalest heavy launcher with scourge missiles my dps is only 178 :(
Ya I have to get the program and find out for myself thanks for the help.
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#4 - 2013-04-19 23:25:49 UTC
BORTRON BEEFBURGER wrote:
Dato Koppla wrote:
Around 550dps with Heavies (fury + hobs) and 700 with HAMs (rage and hobs) with perfect skills, although those numbers don't really mean anything cause I just slapped on 3 BCUs and it is with perfect skills, it depends on what you intend to use the Drake for.

Also, protip: get a fitting program such as Eve Fitting Tool or Pyfa, it will allow you to plug your skills in and test fits based on your skills.


Wow im a day away from getting tech 2 heavy missiles and using arbalest heavy launcher with scourge missiles my dps is only 178 :(
Ya I have to get the program and find out for myself thanks for the help.

Sounds like your support and/or ship skills are a bit low. Train them all up to at least level 4 when you can. Those 2 and 5 percents here and there add up.

Also... Dato Koppla's numbers are a bit on the high side. With a realistic fit and high (but not perfect skills) you are looking at about 500 to 600 DPS with Heavy Assault Missiles + drones... and about 300 to 400 DPS with Heavy Missiles + drones.

How did you Veterans start?
BORTRON BEEFBURGER
Boner Kingdom
#5 - 2013-04-19 23:27:38 UTC
ShahFluffers wrote:
BORTRON BEEFBURGER wrote:
Dato Koppla wrote:
Around 550dps with Heavies (fury + hobs) and 700 with HAMs (rage and hobs) with perfect skills, although those numbers don't really mean anything cause I just slapped on 3 BCUs and it is with perfect skills, it depends on what you intend to use the Drake for.

Also, protip: get a fitting program such as Eve Fitting Tool or Pyfa, it will allow you to plug your skills in and test fits based on your skills.


Wow im a day away from getting tech 2 heavy missiles and using arbalest heavy launcher with scourge missiles my dps is only 178 :(
Ya I have to get the program and find out for myself thanks for the help.

Sounds like your support and/or ship skills are a bit low. Train them all up to at least level 4 when you can. Those 2 and 5 percents here and there add up.

Also... Dato Koppla's numbers are a bit on the high side. With a realistic fit and high (but not perfect skills) you are looking at about 500 to 600 DPS with Heavy Assault Missiles + drones... and about 300 to 400 DPS with Heavy Missiles + drones.



Ahh k thanks didnt think about the drones.
I need that fit program and see for myself.
Thanks for the help.
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#6 - 2013-04-20 00:15:47 UTC
BORTRON BEEFBURGER wrote:
Ahh k thanks didnt think about the drones.
I need that fit program and see for myself.
Thanks for the help.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=24359&find=unread

Take the time to import your own character's skills into it... it really helps.

And for reference... this is the fit I was using...

[Drake - "Standard PvP Fit"]

[Lows]
Damage Control II
Ballistic Control II
Ballistic Control II
Reactor Control Unit II

[Mids]
Large Shield Extender II
Large Shield Extender II
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Warp Scrambler II
Stasis Webifier II

[Highs]
Heavy Assault Missile II (Caldari Navy Scourge HAM)
Heavy Assault Missile II (Caldari Navy Scourge HAM)
Heavy Assault Missile II (Caldari Navy Scourge HAM)
Heavy Assault Missile II (Caldari Navy Scourge HAM)
Heavy Assault Missile II (Caldari Navy Scourge HAM)
Heavy Assault Missile II (Caldari Navy Scourge HAM)
(empty)

[Rigs]
Medium Anti-EM screen Reinforcer I
Medium Core Defense Shield Extender I
Medium Core Defense Shield Extender I

[Drones]
5x Hobgoblin II

Notes:
- you should get somewhere around 70k ehp

- CPU will be the main problem with fitting this ship. You can "downgrade" the warp disruptor/scrambler and web to Meta 4 and free up some CPU that way... and/or you can use Meta 4 shield extenders which also save some CPU, but at the cost of HP.

- if you want to use Heavy Missiles (the long range ones) swap out the Reactor Control for a Nanofiber Internal Structure (or a Co-Processor if you REALLY need it).

- the fit I have given you probably isn't the most "optimal" fit around (someone is sure to say my fit is bad) but I've personally found it to be a good "all rounder" for this ship.

How did you Veterans start?
Dato Koppla
Neuronix
#7 - 2013-04-20 00:18:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Dato Koppla
Yeah as Shah says, don't neglect your support skills, Warhead Upgrades, Rapid Launch and if I'm not mistaken, Missile Launcher Operation give dps bonuses. Don't forget to also train up Guided Missile Precision and Target Navigation Prediction as those are damage application skills that while won't increase your dps, it will increase your real-world applied dps.

Here's some links for the fitting tools:
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=24359 - Eve Fitting Tool
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133164 - Python Fitting Assistant

I personally prefer EFT but Pyfa has a Mac client so I use that on my laptop.

Edit//
Also forgot to mention that because the Drake gets a 10% damage bonus per level you should also train up your Battlecruisers skill (there is also a skill change upcoming so getting your Battlecruiser skill as high as possible is advisable).
BORTRON BEEFBURGER
Boner Kingdom
#8 - 2013-04-20 00:20:36 UTC
ShahFluffers wrote:
BORTRON BEEFBURGER wrote:
Ahh k thanks didnt think about the drones.
I need that fit program and see for myself.
Thanks for the help.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=24359&find=unread

Take the time to import your own character's skills into it... it really helps.

And for reference... this is the fit I was using...

[Drake - "Standard PvP Fit"]

[Lows]
Damage Control II
Ballistic Control II
Ballistic Control II
Reactor Control Unit II

[Mids]
Large Shield Extender II
Large Shield Extender II
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Warp Scrambler II
Stasis Webifier II

[Highs]
Heavy Assault Missile II (Caldari Navy Scourge HAM)
Heavy Assault Missile II (Caldari Navy Scourge HAM)
Heavy Assault Missile II (Caldari Navy Scourge HAM)
Heavy Assault Missile II (Caldari Navy Scourge HAM)
Heavy Assault Missile II (Caldari Navy Scourge HAM)
Heavy Assault Missile II (Caldari Navy Scourge HAM)
(empty)

[Rigs]
Medium Anti-EM screen Reinforcer I
Medium Core Defense Shield Extender I
Medium Core Defense Shield Extender I

[Drones]
5x Hobgoblin II

Notes:
- you should get somewhere around 70k ehp

- CPU will be the main problem with fitting this ship. You can "downgrade" the warp disruptor/scrambler and web to Meta 4 and free up some CPU that way... and/or you can use Meta 4 shield extenders which also save some CPU, but at the cost of HP.

- if you want to use Heavy Missiles (the long range ones) swap out the Reactor Control for a Nanofiber Internal Structure (or a Co-Processor if you REALLY need it).

- the fit I have given you probably isn't the most "optimal" fit around (someone is sure to say my fit is bad) but I've personally found it to be a good "all rounder" for this ship.


Awesome thanks this helped alot I will use this as a reference now.
BORTRON BEEFBURGER
Boner Kingdom
#9 - 2013-04-20 00:21:22 UTC
Dato Koppla wrote:
Yeah as Shah says, don't neglect your support skills, Warhead Upgrades, Rapid Launch and if I'm not mistaken, Missile Launcher Operation give dps bonuses. Don't forget to also train up Guided Missile Precision and Target Navigation Prediction as those are damage application skills that while won't increase your dps, it will increase your real-world applied dps.

Here's some links for the fitting tools:
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=24359 - Eve Fitting Tool
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133164 - Python Fitting Assistant

I personally prefer EFT but Pyfa has a Mac client so I use that on my laptop.

Edit//
Also forgot to mention that because the Drake gets a 10% damage bonus per level you should also train up your Battlecruisers skill (there is also a skill change upcoming so getting your Battlecruiser skill as high as possible is advisable).



Thanks for the links.
Getting that when I get off work tonight.
Appreciate the help.
Dato Koppla
Neuronix
#10 - 2013-04-20 02:02:05 UTC
No worries, also, a tip: you can import the fit that Shah posted by copying and importing it into your fitting program of choice when you get it.
John Ratcliffe
Tradors'R'us
IChooseYou Alliance
#11 - 2013-04-20 07:39:15 UTC  |  Edited by: John Ratcliffe
ShahFluffers wrote:
Also... Dato Koppla's numbers are a bit on the high side. With a realistic fit and high (but not perfect skills) you are looking at about 500 to 600 DPS with Heavy Assault Missiles + drones... and about 300 to 400 DPS with Heavy Missiles + drones.


No - he's right. The fit below gives 880 DPS and it's not even optimised.

Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Adaptive Invulnerability Field
EM Ward Field II
Kinetic Deflection Field II
Republic Fleet Large Shield Extender
Republic Fleet Large Shield Extender
Gistum A-Type 10MN Afterburner
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II,Scourge Rage Heavy Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II,Scourge Rage Heavy Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II,Scourge Rage Heavy Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II,Scourge Rage Heavy Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II,Scourge Rage Heavy Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II,Scourge Rage Heavy Assault Missile
Drone Link Augmentor II
Medium Warhead Rigor Catalyst II
Medium Core Defense Field Purger II
Medium Core Defense Field Purger II
Drones_Active=Hobgoblin II,5

If you want to cry about the CN Invul, then swap the Rigor for a T1 Overclocking Rig and a T2 Adaptive will fit. I'd rather have the higher EHP and higher applied DPS myself - 500 Mil is really nothing these days. The RF LSEs have small sig penalties, so again, another place to save money if needed.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose
Dave Stark
#12 - 2013-04-20 07:45:16 UTC
ShahFluffers wrote:
Also... Dato Koppla's numbers are a bit on the high side. With a realistic fit and high (but not perfect skills) you are looking at about 500 to 600 DPS with Heavy Assault Missiles + drones... and about 300 to 400 DPS with Heavy Missiles + drones.


not really, i can get ~500 dps out of a t2 fit hml drake. that's inc drones, but without any sort of implants.
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#13 - 2013-04-20 11:19:12 UTC
John Ratcliffe wrote:
ShahFluffers wrote:
Also... Dato Koppla's numbers are a bit on the high side. With a realistic fit and high (but not perfect skills) you are looking at about 500 to 600 DPS with Heavy Assault Missiles + drones... and about 300 to 400 DPS with Heavy Missiles + drones.


No - he's right. The fit below gives 880 DPS and it's not even optimised.

Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Adaptive Invulnerability Field
EM Ward Field II
Kinetic Deflection Field II
Republic Fleet Large Shield Extender
Republic Fleet Large Shield Extender
Gistum A-Type 10MN Afterburner
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II,Scourge Rage Heavy Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II,Scourge Rage Heavy Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II,Scourge Rage Heavy Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II,Scourge Rage Heavy Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II,Scourge Rage Heavy Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II,Scourge Rage Heavy Assault Missile
Drone Link Augmentor II
Medium Warhead Rigor Catalyst II
Medium Core Defense Field Purger II
Medium Core Defense Field Purger II
Drones_Active=Hobgoblin II,5

If you want to cry about the CN Invul, then swap the Rigor for a T1 Overclocking Rig and a T2 Adaptive will fit. I'd rather have the higher EHP and higher applied DPS myself - 500 Mil is really nothing these days. The RF LSEs have small sig penalties, so again, another place to save money if needed.


So... Where do you mission?

I need to know for.. tax purposes..

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

John Ratcliffe
Tradors'R'us
IChooseYou Alliance
#14 - 2013-04-20 11:28:26 UTC  |  Edited by: John Ratcliffe
Garviel Tarrant wrote:
So... Where do you mission?

I need to know for.. tax purposes..


Poinen. It'll be fit exactly like that - no PVP mods at all. I won't be using a Fleet Booster or have friends in stealth bombers. You'll be fine ;)

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#15 - 2013-04-21 00:22:39 UTC  |  Edited by: ShahFluffers
John Ratcliffe wrote:
ShahFluffers wrote:
Also... Dato Koppla's numbers are a bit on the high side. With a realistic fit and high (but not perfect skills) you are looking at about 500 to 600 DPS with Heavy Assault Missiles + drones... and about 300 to 400 DPS with Heavy Missiles + drones.


No - he's right. The fit below gives 880 DPS and it's not even optimised.

... (pimp fit) ...

If you want to cry about the CN Invul, then swap the Rigor for a T1 Overclocking Rig and a T2 Adaptive will fit. I'd rather have the higher EHP and higher applied DPS myself - 500 Mil is really nothing these days. The RF LSEs have small sig penalties, so again, another place to save money if needed.

Not to start an argument... but I think you overlooked it when I said "realistic fit." Pimping a ship is fine and good... but when helping newbies and/or inexperienced people it's better to give them numbers based on fits that don't require hundreds of millions of ISK.

Plus, a PvP fit can be easily modified to perform missions (if that is what the OP wants to do). Just toss the warp disruptor and add a target painter or shield recharger or another shield hardener... toss the Adaptive Invul Fields for specific resistance mods... trade in the Damage Control and maybe Power Diagnostic for another Ballistic Control or two...and toss the extender rigs for purgers.

How did you Veterans start?
Tom K'rathma
Dark Venture Corporation
Kitchen Sinkhole
#16 - 2013-04-27 19:53:57 UTC
I've just got BC V, Heavy missile spec v and I'm getting 488 DPS Hobs & furies, so with perfect skills maybe 500DPS?
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#17 - 2013-04-27 22:52:59 UTC
People are mixing up the word "should" and "could"

you "could" get 660 dps with HML using 4x CN BCUs and tech 2 furies and +6 implants. It is, however, debatable whether or not you "should".

Since the OP was about what he "should" be getting, here's something more sensible:

[Drake, perfect]
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Beta Reactor Control: Shield Power Relay I

Large Shield Extender II
Large Shield Extender II
Kinetic Deflection Field II
Explosive Deflection Field II
Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron
10MN Afterburner II

Heavy Missile Launcher II, Guristas Scourge Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Guristas Scourge Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Guristas Scourge Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Guristas Scourge Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Guristas Scourge Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Guristas Scourge Heavy Missile
[empty high slot]

Medium Core Defense Field Purger I
Medium Core Defense Field Purger I
Medium Core Defense Field Purger I


Hobgoblin II x5

454 DPS (468 with some +2 implants, pretty cheap)

tanks 314 angel DPS, enough for almost any level 3 mission and can do level 4s pretty comfortably too if you want to try (I have)

Has much better applied DPS due to the painter and costs under 80m.

With a bit less skills you're looking at just under 400 DPS with about 280 tank.

Art of Explosions
John Ratcliffe
Tradors'R'us
IChooseYou Alliance
#18 - 2013-04-27 23:17:22 UTC
ShahFluffers wrote:

Not to start an argument... but I think you overlooked it when I said "realistic fit." Pimping a ship is fine and good... but when helping newbies and/or inexperienced people it's better to give them numbers based on fits that don't require hundreds of millions of ISK.


I didn't overlook anything, I think that's a good fit and I don't think it's expensive. I did highlight where savings could be made.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#19 - 2013-04-27 23:19:56 UTC
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
Realistic PvE fit

This isn't far off my PvE build, pushes out somewhere in the region of 515 DPS with Scourge Fury and Hobgoblin IIs with a 350-380 DPS tank with no faction shiny stuff and a 3% missile implant.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
John Ratcliffe
Tradors'R'us
IChooseYou Alliance
#20 - 2013-04-27 23:25:05 UTC
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
People are mixing up the word "should" and "could"

you "could" get 660 dps with HML using 4x CN BCUs and tech 2 furies and +6 implants. It is, however, debatable whether or not you "should".

Since the OP was about what he "should" be getting, here's something more sensible:


No, I don't think people are getting mixed up at all. Why would you want to use a 400 DPS fit when you could be doing twice that? Makes no sense to me...

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose
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