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The future of the Rokh...

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Hessian Arcturus
Doomheim
#1 - 2013-04-11 19:30:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Hessian Arcturus
This reason for this thread is to discuss the idea of a Rokh Navy Issue. And yes, while this thread might have been put up before, I didn't look to check because I have my own ideas to throw around.

My favourite ship in the game is the Rokh, but I was dissapointed to see that (unlike the Raven and Scorpion) there was no Navy Issue counterpart. I would love to see the Caldari Navy colours on this ship.

A few idea's for the Rokh Navy Issue:

Missiles or Hybrids? While the official details of the Rokh state that "Having long suffered the lack of an adequate hybrid platform, the Caldari State's capsule pilots found themselves rejoicing as the Rokh's design specs were released". The Caldari however, focus heavily on missiles. The standard Rokh has 8 weapon hardpoints and a bonus to Large Hybrid Turrets and Shield Resistances. So I would be unsure how to improve on the turret factors other than makig the bonuses greater for them. The other option would be to make the Rokh Navy Issue utilise 8 missile hardpoints (would 8 Cruise Missles on a Rokh be too OP?). Cruise Missles still give the option for this vessel to be a sniping platform?

The Tank. As per the description "the Rokh is always better suited when flying in a group, as its tanking capabilities are much lower when compared to other Caldari battleships". Could the Rokh Navy Issue have a better tank than the three standard Caldari Battleships? Whether this is a bonus to shield recharge rate perharps or possibly a bonus to certain damage types?

The size. Compared to other Battleships, the Rokh is incrediably small, yet the ship itself commands massive respect. Maybe the Navy Issue could be scaled up to a more dominating size. Perhaps to the size of the Apocalypse?

These are just a few ideas of my own and was wondering what others think on the topic. Any other ideas that perhaps this theoretical vessel could have? Perhaps CCP Devs could also comment on here too on their views of a Rokh Navy Issue.

So, thoughts on the topic?

It's human nature to want to explore. To find your line and go beyond it. The only limit, is the one you set yourself.
Solstice Project
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#2 - 2013-04-11 19:39:03 UTC
Missiles ?
On a Rokh ?
Missiles on a Rokh, Navy Issue ????

Blasphemy !
Hessian Arcturus
Doomheim
#3 - 2013-04-11 19:47:02 UTC
Solstice Project wrote:
Missiles ?
On a Rokh ?
Missiles on a Rokh, Navy Issue ????

Blasphemy !


I agree, but how to make it better in regards to Hybrids? It already has 8 hardpoints so you can't add another. As I'm still knew to this game, I am unsure how the hybrid performance could be improved? Perhaps maybe greater bonuses to them?

I was just curious as to what people thought in regard to missles vs. hybrids?

But blasphemy! I humbly apologise my good sir.

It's human nature to want to explore. To find your line and go beyond it. The only limit, is the one you set yourself.
Jace Errata
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#4 - 2013-04-11 19:48:53 UTC
Another missile platform would overlap with the Raven...as it stands, the Caldari don't have a gunship-type Navy BS, and the Rokh would fill that role fine.
I think the Rokh's Navy bonus should be something that enhances its existing niche as a long-range gun platform - something interesting. My choice would be a maximum targeting range boost (taking it beyond 250k when fully skilled), with an attendant suite of hybrid optimal, falloff, and tracking bonuses.

An alternative would be to give it an extra mid or two and a bonus to stasis webs, a bit of a durability boost, and a hybrid bonus of some kind suited to a role as a slow, heavy-hitting ship-of-the-line. I'm reluctant to support this alternative though as it doesn't really work well with the Caldari philosophy of "hit 'em before they're even in their lock range", and it wouldn't be able to stand up to the Gallente and Minmatar CQC heavyweights, which should be the kings of that arena.

tweeten

One day they woke me up so I could live forever

It's such a shame the same will never happen to you
Hessian Arcturus
Doomheim
#5 - 2013-04-11 19:57:23 UTC
Jace Errata wrote:
Another missile platform would overlap with the Raven...as it stands, the Caldari don't have a gunship-type Navy BS, and the Rokh would fill that role fine.
I think the Rokh's Navy bonus should be something that enhances its existing niche as a long-range gun platform - something interesting. My choice would be a maximum targeting range boost (taking it beyond 250k when fully skilled), with an attendant suite of hybrid optimal, falloff, and tracking bonuses.

An alternative would be to give it an extra mid or two and a bonus to stasis webs, a bit of a durability boost, and a hybrid bonus of some kind suited to a role as a slow, heavy-hitting ship-of-the-line. I'm reluctant to support this alternative though as it doesn't really work well with the Caldari philosophy of "hit 'em before they're even in their lock range", and it wouldn't be able to stand up to the Gallente and Minmatar CQC heavyweights, which should be the kings of that arena.


I suppose extra mid or low slots could perhaps help to increase the tank (more room for Shield Rechargers or Invunerability Fields).

The Rokh Navy Issue, with an increase on the already long range of its standard counterpart, could be an idea over missles yes.

It's human nature to want to explore. To find your line and go beyond it. The only limit, is the one you set yourself.
Micheal Dietrich
Kings Gambit Black
#6 - 2013-04-11 20:28:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Micheal Dietrich
Hessian Arcturus wrote:
This reason for this thread is to discuss the idea of a Rokh Navy Issue. And yes, while this thread might have been put up before, I didn't look to check because I have my own ideas to throw around.


First off, this should of been done in Ships and modules or Features and Ideas.

Hessian Arcturus wrote:
My favourite ship in the game is the Rokh, but I was dissapointed to see that (unlike the Raven and Scorpion) there was no Navy Issue counterpart. I would love to see the Caldari Navy colours on this ship.

A few idea's for the Rokh Navy Issue:

Missiles or Hybrids? While the official details of the Rokh state that "Having long suffered the lack of an adequate hybrid platform, the Caldari State's capsule pilots found themselves rejoicing as the Rokh's design specs were released". The Caldari however, focus heavily on missiles. The standard Rokh has 8 weapon hardpoints and a bonus to Large Hybrid Turrets and Shield Resistances. So I would be unsure how to improve on the turret factors other than makig the bonuses greater for them. The other option would be to make the Rokh Navy Issue utilise 8 missile hardpoints (would 8 Cruise Missles on a Rokh be too OP?). Cruise Missles still give the option for this vessel to be a sniping platform?


3 things here.

1. Caldari do not focus on Missiles. Caldari are split between hybrid (rails) and missiles.
2. As the Caldari have the above options to choose from, we are given 2 different lines to go into. The Rokh in this case goes with the Ferox, Moa, Cormorant, and Merlin; whereas the missile line is the Raven, Drake, Caracal, Corax, and Kestrel. Crossing over, as has been pointed out, would overlap the 2 lines.
3. Cruise missiles make for a bad sniping platform due to the flight time required as opposed to all of the gun platforms.

Hessian Arcturus wrote:
The Tank. As per the description "the Rokh is always better suited when flying in a group, as its tanking capabilities are much lower when compared to other Caldari battleships". Could the Rokh Navy Issue have a better tank than the three standard Caldari Battleships? Whether this is a bonus to shield recharge rate perharps or possibly a bonus to certain damage types?


As the Rokh should be used as a sniper boat, should being the key word here, it shouldn't need more of a tank than a close in bird like a torp Raven has. As stated, the Raven will become the brawler for the Caldari line.

*Editors note: While I speak of the rokh being a sniper boat, I would like to note that my rokh is in fact a blaster boat and she's good at what she does.

Hessian Arcturus wrote:
The size. Compared to other Battleships, the Rokh is incrediably small, yet the ship itself commands massive respect. Maybe the Navy Issue could be scaled up to a more dominating size. Perhaps to the size of the Apocalypse?


It's not the size that matters, but how you use it Cool

Out of Pod is getting In the Pod - Join in game channel **IG OOPE **
Solstice Project
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#7 - 2013-04-11 20:42:25 UTC
I've seen blaster-Rokhs, with their enemies going WHAT THE *dies* ... xD
Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
#8 - 2013-04-11 20:45:28 UTC

--> Features & Ideas Discussion

☼

There's a million angry citizens looking down their tubes..at me.
Hessian Arcturus
Doomheim
#9 - 2013-04-11 20:46:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Hessian Arcturus
Micheal Dietrich wrote:
Hessian Arcturus wrote:
This reason for this thread is to discuss the idea of a Rokh Navy Issue. And yes, while this thread might have been put up before, I didn't look to check because I have my own ideas to throw around.


First off, this should of been done in Ships and modules or Features and Ideas.

Hessian Arcturus wrote:
My favourite ship in the game is the Rokh, but I was dissapointed to see that (unlike the Raven and Scorpion) there was no Navy Issue counterpart. I would love to see the Caldari Navy colours on this ship.

A few idea's for the Rokh Navy Issue:

Missiles or Hybrids? While the official details of the Rokh state that "Having long suffered the lack of an adequate hybrid platform, the Caldari State's capsule pilots found themselves rejoicing as the Rokh's design specs were released". The Caldari however, focus heavily on missiles. The standard Rokh has 8 weapon hardpoints and a bonus to Large Hybrid Turrets and Shield Resistances. So I would be unsure how to improve on the turret factors other than makig the bonuses greater for them. The other option would be to make the Rokh Navy Issue utilise 8 missile hardpoints (would 8 Cruise Missles on a Rokh be too OP?). Cruise Missles still give the option for this vessel to be a sniping platform?


3 things here.

1. Caldari do not focus on Missiles. Caldari are split between hybrid (rails) and missiles.
2. As the Caldari have the above options to choose from, we are given 2 different lines to go into. The Rokh in this case goes with the Ferox, Moa, Cormorant, and Merlin; whereas the missile line is the Raven, Drake, Caracal, Corax, and Kestrel. Crossing over, as has been pointed out, would overlap the 2 lines.
3. Cruise missiles make for a bad sniping platform due to the flight time required as opposed to all of the gun platforms.Big smile

Hessian Arcturus wrote:
The Tank. As per the description "the Rokh is always better suited when flying in a group, as its tanking capabilities are much lower when compared to other Caldari battleships". Could the Rokh Navy Issue have a better tank than the three standard Caldari Battleships? Whether this is a bonus to shield recharge rate perharps or possibly a bonus to certain damage types?


As the Rokh should be used as a sniper boat, should being the key word here, it shouldn't need more of a tank than a close in bird like a torp Raven has. As stated, the Raven will become the brawler for the Caldari line.

*Editors note: While I speak of the rokh being a sniper boat, I would like to note that my rokh is in fact a blaster boat and she's good at what she does.

Hessian Arcturus wrote:
The size. Compared to other Battleships, the Rokh is incrediably small, yet the ship itself commands massive respect. Maybe the Navy Issue could be scaled up to a more dominating size. Perhaps to the size of the Apocalypse?


It's not the size that matters, but how you use it Cool


Firstly to answer your last comment, I agree. But in regard to spaceships, a larger prescence wouldn't hurt.

Point 1 and 2 are fair points. But as for point 3, dont Cruise Missile have a very long distance? I'm new so I could be wrong but I thought that the Cruise Missiles could indeed hit from a large distance?
I agree that keeping it in the line of hybrids is best (I'm a hybrid Caldari pilot myself), I mearly suggested missiles as an option Big smile

Blaster Rokh does intriegue me though...

It's human nature to want to explore. To find your line and go beyond it. The only limit, is the one you set yourself.
Milan Nantucket
Doomheim
#10 - 2013-04-11 20:49:24 UTC
Missiles on a Rokh... might as well put hybrids on the Raven...
Hessian Arcturus
Doomheim
#11 - 2013-04-11 20:54:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Hessian Arcturus
Milan Nantucket wrote:
Missiles on a Rokh... might as well put hybrids on the Raven...


But the Raven has specific traits to fit missles. And the Rokh has specific traits to fit hybrids. The Navy issue could be different from the norm. Like how the Scorpion is different from Scorpion Navy Issue...

It's human nature to want to explore. To find your line and go beyond it. The only limit, is the one you set yourself.
Eli Green
The Arrow Project
#12 - 2013-04-11 20:56:57 UTC
Doc Fury wrote:

--> Features & Ideas Discussion



ISD Doc Fury, here have a cookie.

wumbo
Solstice Project
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#13 - 2013-04-11 20:57:23 UTC
Hessian Arcturus wrote:
Milan Nantucket wrote:
Missiles on a Rokh... might as well put hybrids on the Raven...


But the Raven has specific traits to fit missles. And the Rokh has specific traits to fit hybrids. The Navy issue could be different from the norm. Like how the Scorpion is different from Scorpion Navy Issue...
You make baby jesus cry.
Micheal Dietrich
Kings Gambit Black
#14 - 2013-04-11 20:58:59 UTC
Hessian Arcturus wrote:


Firstly to answer your last comment, I agree. But in regard to spaceships, a larger prescence wouldn't hurt.

Point 1 and 2 are fair points. But as for point 3, dont Cruise Missile have a very long distance? I'm new so I could be wrong but I thought that the Cruise Missiles could indeed hit from a large distance?
I agree that keeping it in the line of hybrids is best (I'm a hybrid Caldari pilot myself), I mearly suggested missiles as an option Big smile

Blaster Rokh does intriegue me though...



Cruise missiles have a decent range, but nothing compared to rail and rail bonuses. The problem that I brought up is not the distance but hitting the target. The difference is that all guns hit instantaneously, but missiles have to travel. Basically at 100km you will have launched 4 volleys before your first volley even hits the target. In the same amount of time the rokh's rails will have fired and hit all 4 times (more like 6 due to cycle time). This means that if you are in a small man there is a good chance that your target will be dead before your 2nd of 4 volleys even hits the target. What this means is basically you will be wasting a lot of ammo.

Out of Pod is getting In the Pod - Join in game channel **IG OOPE **
Milan Nantucket
Doomheim
#15 - 2013-04-11 20:59:06 UTC
Well if you want something different... maybe snowballs and fireworks only Shocked

Err I know.... Mining Lasers
Hessian Arcturus
Doomheim
#16 - 2013-04-11 20:59:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Hessian Arcturus
Solstice Project wrote:
Hessian Arcturus wrote:
Milan Nantucket wrote:
Missiles on a Rokh... might as well put hybrids on the Raven...


But the Raven has specific traits to fit missles. And the Rokh has specific traits to fit hybrids. The Navy issue could be different from the norm. Like how the Scorpion is different from Scorpion Navy Issue...
You make baby jesus cry.


I have that kind of face Big smile

But okay, instead of cruise missles, they could have an extended range bonus for rails? Or maybe even faster traking perhaps?

Michael wrote:
Cruise missiles have a decent range, but nothing compared to rail and rail bonuses. The problem that I brought up is not the distance but hitting the target. The difference is that all guns hit instantaneously, but missiles have to travel. Basically at 100km you will have launched 4 volleys before your first volley even hits the target. In the same amount of time the rokh's rails will have fired and hit all 4 times (more like 6 due to cycle time). This means that if you are in a small man there is a good chance that your target will be dead before your 2nd of 4 volleys even hits the target. What this means is basically you will be wasting a lot of ammo.


Cheers for that explanation, I understand now what you mean Big smile useful for me to know for future reference too.

It's human nature to want to explore. To find your line and go beyond it. The only limit, is the one you set yourself.
Solstice Project
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#17 - 2013-04-11 21:01:17 UTC
Micheal Dietrich wrote:
This means that if you are in a small man...
Not sure if that word was used intentional, but it READS HILARIOUS! XD
Alekksander Geinesa
Divine Mortals
#18 - 2013-04-11 21:01:57 UTC
Solstice Project wrote:
Missiles ?
On a Rokh ?
Missiles on a Rokh, Navy Issue ????

Blasphemy !



Shot guns don't shoot missiles!
Solstice Project
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#19 - 2013-04-11 21:02:42 UTC
Hessian Arcturus wrote:
But okay, instead of cruise missles, they could have an extended range bonus for rails? Or maybe even faster traking perhaps?
Personally, i'd be all in for an agility bonus,
because having a red guy flying a rokh in highsec is BADASS !

I did that already, but the fitting is too crippled. :(
Ziphis
Dingus Coalition
#20 - 2013-04-11 21:03:00 UTC
Milan Nantucket wrote:
Well if you want something different... maybe snowballs and fireworks only Shocked

Err I know.... Mining Lasers



Nothing wrong with a mining Rokh. or an mining Golden Banana for that point.

He was the sort of person who stood on mountaintops during thunderstorms in wet copper armour shouting 'All the Gods are bastards.'  - T. Pratchett
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