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TERRORIST ATTACK AT GALLENTE-MINMATAR CULTURAL FESTIVAL LEAVES DOZENS DEAD, HUNDREDS WOUNDED

Author
Aidari Flamesight
Minmatar Republic
#21 - 2013-04-11 18:58:03 UTC
Liuni Kalthis wrote:


Its more likely that he will trip on a knife with a gag reel playing in the back ground. I just fail to see why one injured man is more important than 58 dead and their families.


First off our Chief is a woman, just for clarification.

Her life is just as valuable as the others. However, this is a major political figure. If a Minmatar gunman shot Mentas Blaque, Souro Foritan, or even President Roden himself, I am quite confident that the Gallente would want to handle the trial.

"Do not count days, do not count miles, count only the number of slaves you freed."

Denak Calamari
Incorruptibles
#22 - 2013-04-11 19:04:55 UTC
Sad news indeed, my sympathies go out to the families affected, and I hope the terrorist responsible for this mmoral action gets caught and put to trial quickly. While I'd lime to think this was just the act of a single madman or a fanatic Amarr citizen, I have a feeling there's more to it than we know.
Liuni Kalthis
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#23 - 2013-04-11 19:10:47 UTC
Aidari Flamesight wrote:
Liuni Kalthis wrote:


Its more likely that he will trip on a knife with a gag reel playing in the back ground. I just fail to see why one injured man is more important than 58 dead and their families.


First off our Chief is a woman, just for clarification.

Her life is just as valuable as the others. However, this is a major political figure. If a Minmatar gunman shot Mentas Blaque, Souro Foritan, or even President Roden himself, I am quite confident that the Gallente would want to handle the trial.




Perhaps but maybe wait more than 8 hours before demanding with ships?
Maybe a joint investigation since your people know your planets more, make sure it wasn't something by a fanatical cell; ect. We at least know to wait at least 24 hours before demanding anything.
Makoto Priano
Kirkinen-Arataka Transhuman Zenith Consulting Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#24 - 2013-04-11 19:27:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Makoto Priano
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Aidari Flamesight
Minmatar Republic
#25 - 2013-04-11 19:28:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Aidari Flamesight
Liuni Kalthis wrote:
Aidari Flamesight wrote:
Liuni Kalthis wrote:


Its more likely that he will trip on a knife with a gag reel playing in the back ground. I just fail to see why one injured man is more important than 58 dead and their families.


First off our Chief is a woman, just for clarification.

Her life is just as valuable as the others. However, this is a major political figure. If a Minmatar gunman shot Mentas Blaque, Souro Foritan, or even President Roden himself, I am quite confident that the Gallente would want to handle the trial.




Perhaps but maybe wait more than 8 hours before demanding with ships?
Maybe a joint investigation since your people know your planets more, make sure it wasn't something by a fanatical cell; ect. We at least know to wait at least 24 hours before demanding anything.


I do agree with you that my government is being a bit impatient, though Shakor is a man who's success has come from patience and planning very far ahead of time. This means there has to be more at work here that the Federation and/or Republic are aware of while the public is in the dark.

"Do not count days, do not count miles, count only the number of slaves you freed."

Kytre Aurgnet
Better Hide R Die EVE
#26 - 2013-04-11 21:13:57 UTC
Very very sad.

I fear this is the work of another cloned soldier; whether to strike at Chief or just to cause chaos I doubt we'll really get an answer. The only thing that worries me about this theory is that he gave himself up so easily; the clones I know would much, much rather fight to the bitter end, waking up somewhere else (but out of enemy hands) than surrender. Many of them fear capture, but few fear death.

I hope that justice is served and whoever this is is given a trial, and that both the Minmatar and Gallente receive peace.
Gosakumori Noh
Coven of One
#27 - 2013-04-12 00:34:54 UTC
A dead (wounded? dead?) Sebiestor alpha... witch. Tragic. Or perhaps others are finally catching on to the threat posed by those pernicious little rust elves. In any event, I'm sure in a few hours time, the fact that this is all a Sinister Amarrian Plot will be well documented.

Fate seems to have had her way with the Gallente, the Caldari, and now the Horde. Clearly, she's saving the best for last.

Here's to us: Go Team Gold!
Xao Chu-Li
Doomheim
#28 - 2013-04-12 01:23:41 UTC
May all those who have suffered loss this day find a measure of peace in the days ahead. What has been taken cannot be replaced but the void may be filled with many things: anger, hatred, vengeance, remembrance, gratitude...may wisdom guide our decisions.

May the future reveal the depth of this atrocity and justice be swift.
James Syagrius
Luminaire Sovereign Solutions
#29 - 2013-04-12 02:24:23 UTC  |  Edited by: James Syagrius
Aidari Flamesight wrote:
I don't understand why Roden refuses to meet our very reasonable demands. True, Gallenteans were injured in killed in this massacre, though I doubt any of them was a head of state.

It's not like this man won't be punished upon arrival in our Republic, it's more likely that being put on trial in the Republic will actually guarantee that he will be dealt with.


What is so hard to understand, the crime occurred in the Federation. Midular while a tribal leader and member of the government is no longer a "Head of State". As I recall she was so respected and revered in the "Republic" that she was voted out.
Tatiana Yazria
Dragon Logistics
#30 - 2013-04-12 03:31:48 UTC
Certainly, nobody would mistake me for any sort of sympathizer, but my heart aches at this news.

The only purpose any investigation would serve is to ascertain the presence or absence of any accomplices, and to determine whether or not further attacks are planned. I have heard several demands for a joint investigation, and trial by jury. Why? The only purpose of these foolish actions is to make the extraction of relevant information more difficult and provide flimsy justification when the conclusion is the same as my own.

Make no mistake; there can be no forgiveness for what has happened here. Not ever. These were not combatants in an active war who were fired upon - they were unarmed civilians. And there is no question the intent was to kill as many as possible. Perhaps that is the worst of it - that the victims will be denied justice, to assuage the conscience of fools. Extract the information as painfully as possible, and put the perpetrator to death.
Hadrian Tivianne
Federal Defense Union
Gallente Federation
#31 - 2013-04-12 03:41:48 UTC
Tatiana Yazria wrote:

Make no mistake; there can be no forgiveness for what has happened here. Not ever. These were not combatants in an active war who were fired upon - they were unarmed civilians. And there is no question the intent was to kill as many as possible. Perhaps that is the worst of it - that the victims will be denied justice, to assuage the conscience of fools. Extract the information as painfully as possible, and put the perpetrator to death.

That's fine. I don't think anyone is truly claiming that the criminal should go without the harshest of punishments, more along the lines of who should be the one to do it. As it stands, that's the Federation.
Tatiana Yazria
Dragon Logistics
#32 - 2013-04-12 03:50:50 UTC
Hadrian Tivianne wrote:
That's fine. I don't think anyone is truly claiming that the criminal should go without the harshest of punishments, more along the lines of who should be the one to do it. As it stands, that's the Federation.


To be quite blunt? I am very doubtful the Federation has anyone with the stomach to inflict even a tiny fraction of the suffering that is deserved here.

There is an ancient method of capital punishment - truthfully can't recall where I read about it. They would attach a cage with a frightened animal to the face of the condemned, then apply flame so that the animal would literally claw through the skull of the one sentenced to death. A very painful and gruesome way to die, by any measure.

That? Should be the nicest thing the perpetrator gets to experience for the rest of their very short life.
Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
#33 - 2013-04-12 03:56:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Katran Luftschreck
A lot of trouble to go through for a failed assassination attempt of a diplomat, although I'm unsure as to why Shakor would want to have her...

"She was known for her (at least outwardly) peaceful politics towards the Amarr Empire"

... ah, well, nevermind then.

Still, it will be interesting to see if Roden turns him over to Blaque, because if there is one thing you know that bastard can do is yank the truth out of someone. If he gets extradited back to the Republic, though, well that's just one more valklear for their ranks, I guess.

http://youtu.be/t0q2F8NsYQ0

Hadrian Tivianne
Federal Defense Union
Gallente Federation
#34 - 2013-04-12 04:04:40 UTC
Tatiana Yazria wrote:
Hadrian Tivianne wrote:
That's fine. I don't think anyone is truly claiming that the criminal should go without the harshest of punishments, more along the lines of who should be the one to do it. As it stands, that's the Federation.


To be quite blunt? I am very doubtful the Federation has anyone with the stomach to inflict even a tiny fraction of the suffering that is deserved here.

There is an ancient method of capital punishment - truthfully can't recall where I read about it. They would attach a cage with a frightened animal to the face of the condemned, then apply flame so that the animal would literally claw through the skull of the one sentenced to death. A very painful and gruesome way to die, by any measure.

That? Should be the nicest thing the perpetrator gets to experience for the rest of their very short life.

You may be right. Admittedly that does not sound like a method that the Federation government would likely go with. The problem though, at least for those claiming stern support for the Republic, is that the criminal was detained on Gallente sovereign ground. I'm not a master of law, but I believe the point of extradition is you have to ask first. If the answer is no, you deal with it. It's not a declaration of a lack of judgement and punishment, and unless some legal precedent can be found, the Republic will just have to settle for Federation justice.

I'm well aware many people were hurt by this tragedy and many more mourn it. But how many more would have died on the border earlier today if the RSS hadn't backed down upon the orders of CONCORD? Is the level of punishment on one criminal, however terrible his act, really worth starting a war over?
Xao Chu-Li
Doomheim
#35 - 2013-04-12 09:57:02 UTC
Tatiana Yazria wrote:

To be quite blunt? I am very doubtful the Federation has anyone with the stomach to inflict even a tiny fraction of the suffering that is deserved here.


Unfortunately, the Federation is quite capable of inflicting suffering of a gruesome nature; consider Anvent Eturrer.


Stitcher
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#36 - 2013-04-12 11:28:00 UTC
What does that kind of suffering serve, anyway? If you're going to execute a man, do it quick and clean and move on. Seems to me like setting him on fire in public is just a bloodthirsty, brutal spectacle that diminishes everyone involved. There's nothing noble about inflicting suffering purely for the sake of vengeance.

AKA Hambone

Author of The Deathworlders

Aelisha
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#37 - 2013-04-12 11:50:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Aelisha
Stitcher wrote:
What does that kind of suffering serve, anyway? If you're going to execute a man, do it quick and clean and move on. Seems to me like setting him on fire in public is just a bloodthirsty, brutal spectacle that diminishes everyone involved. There's nothing noble about inflicting suffering purely for the sake of vengeance.


To their shame, most governments abandon nobility in the effort to retain as global a state of acceptance as they can. When information extracted under torture is largely believed to be inadmissible due to the fact that most people will say anything to get out of the situation they are placed in, all that remains is spectacle.

The fallacy of 'a fate worse than death' is often raised in this situation to justify a punishment that 'mere' termination of one's existence is not deemed potent enough to absolve. People feel vulnerable when their icons are attacked, they feel humiliated when they are laid out on the gurney or slab. They want the perpetrator of that crime to be humiliated and made vulnerable for all to see - and I have no doubt that the Republic government would provide this placebo if they got the chance.

Then again, as this attack is inexcusable, and the possibility of torture for information or the above reasons is likely and equally inexcusable on the part of those calling for it, we could likely fill new volumes of philosophy and ethics just circling around 'the lesser evil' and if eye for an eye logic is functional, if not civilised.

A bigger question is - with the Federation's recent history in gruesome murder as a form of punishment to satiate the baying masses, what makes the Republic think that they are going to miss out on this criminal being taken apart piece by piece? As much as I deride conspiracy theories, chicanery such as this 'due process' nonsense hardly does anything to dismiss it. Invite RSS to conduct their own interrogations under Federation conditions and hell, if they decide to go with the carcinogenic immolation for old times sake, let a Sebiestor administer the dose. You've both already shaken one another's blood covered hands. What's another lick of the red stuff between friends?

CEO of the Achura-Waschi Exchange

Intaki Reborn

Independent Capsuleer

Xao Chu-Li
Doomheim
#38 - 2013-04-12 12:10:56 UTC
Stitcher wrote:
What does that kind of suffering serve, anyway? If you're going to execute a man, do it quick and clean and move on. Seems to me like setting him on fire in public is just a bloodthirsty, brutal spectacle that diminishes everyone involved. There's nothing noble about inflicting suffering purely for the sake of vengeance.


I agree.

Aelisha wrote:
A bigger question is - with the Federation's recent history in gruesome murder as a form of punishment to satiate the baying masses, what makes the Republic think that they are going to miss out on this criminal being taken apart piece by piece? As much as I deride conspiracy theories, chicanery such as this 'due process' nonsense hardly does anything to dismiss it. Invite RSS to conduct their own interrogations under Federation conditions and hell, if they decide to go with the carcinogenic immolation for old times sake, let a Sebiestor administer the dose. You've both already shaken one another's blood covered hands. What's another lick of the red stuff between friends?


With respect, a singular incident does not a habitual practice make. It is true the Federation has committed brutal and gruesome acts in its past, as have most nations. To your final statement, we are all blood-stained sailors of the stars; judging a nation ill because it too has blood-stained hands is unwarranted.
Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
#39 - 2013-04-13 05:42:34 UTC
Tatiana Yazria wrote:
There is an ancient method of capital punishment - truthfully can't recall where I read about it. They would attach a cage with a frightened animal to the face of the condemned, then apply flame so that the animal would literally claw through the skull of the one sentenced to death. A very painful and gruesome way to die, by any measure.


I'm curious as to how you managed to get such accurate intel on Blaque's favorite "Area 101" interrogation method.


Diana Kim wrote:
Besides, this was work not of a professional, but amateur, who just splashed out his anger on the mob. Killing same number of military trained personnel or industry workers would be much more useful than just butchering random useless civilians.


The term you're looking for is "patsy." They take the fall while the real professional escapes in the confusion. Start shooting fifty people at random and no one notices the other guy in the rafters lining up a headshot on the real target.

Other methods are to use drugs and/or hypnosis to indoctrinate a normal person into a kamikaze assassin. The fact that they surrendered afterward point in this direction, as they basically gave up as soon as Midular went down. Mission accomplished, program ends, and the agent is now standing there with a stupid look on their face wondering why they're holding an empty assault rifle.

When you've been on the receiving end of the Bloody Hands for enough generations you learn a lot about the methods used by terrorists & political assassins.

http://youtu.be/t0q2F8NsYQ0

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