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Dev Blog: In the Navy: Changes to Navy Ships in Odyssey

First post
Author
Celeste Taylor
Ruby Dynasty
#141 - 2013-04-11 13:05:18 UTC
Sarmatiko wrote:
Just leave Myrmidon (also Ferox and Prophecy) hull to pirate battlecruisers. Cool


Indeed! Although I would have also wanted to see a Navy Myrmidon the Navy Domi and Navy Vexor currently exist, and while I love my Vindicator I wouldn't mind having a pirate faction ship using one of the classic Gallente drone boat hulls.
Dav Varan
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#142 - 2013-04-11 14:54:39 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Dav Varan wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
Dav Varan wrote:
Finally after 8 years of waiting we get a 8 ml Drake to match the model.

Such a pity its a flying turd with 2 really useless bonuses.

Swap 1 of the useless bonuses I care not which to the 5% resists per level of the standard drake and It would be half decent and something to get existed about.


By this I take it you mean "a bloo bloo it's not good for doing anomalies"?

Because as a PvP ship it's a big bag of murder

PS: It's obviously designed to be either a HAM platform or a long range skirmish drake. Both of which it will be awesome at.


No by this I mean boo-hoo a 250m Navy Faction BC that will get owned by its standard variant.

Only if the pilot is an idiot.
HAM navy drake can easily kite a regular drake, and it can use any damage type equally. Navy drake will get 25 km range with Rage and 30 km with faction HAM, whereas the regular drake will get 20km with faction and 30 km with Javelin at significantly reduced DPS. Rage with 8 effective launchers (navy drake) > faction or javelin with 9 effective launchers.
It also has more tank than the regular drake.


Rage is going to do nothing against a target that is not Scramed and webbed down, meaning your Range benifit is worth preciselly nothing. Therory crafting a mythical 1v1 where a Standard drake has to downgrade to javs/fact in order to hit shows the very limited nature of the benifits of the ND whereas a SD supperior tank and dps will win out in 99% of encounters.
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#143 - 2013-04-11 16:40:28 UTC  |  Edited by: James Amril-Kesh
Dav Varan wrote:
Rage is going to do nothing against a target that is not Scramed and webbed down, meaning your Range benifit is worth preciselly nothing.

You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. Rage heavy missiles will always hit a Drake for full damage, even if that drake is moving at top speed with MWD off or on. You could fit an AB to the Drake which can mitigate about 10 DPS but that will ensure that it's even less able to control range.

Go plug it into EFT and use the DPS graph, or better yet find the missile damage formula and plug it in yourself. A Drake with 1 LSE II and 3x CDFE I has a signature radius of 361 m. At that sig radius it would have to be going at least 390 m/s before its speed actually had any effect on reducing missile damage. With MWD on it has a signature radius of 2090 m, at which point it would have to be going faster than 2255 m/s to mitigate any damage from incoming rage HAMs, which is a pretty unattainable speed for a combat fit Drake. This is assuming the attacker has TNP 5, GMP 5, and BC 5.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)

Nightfox BloodRaven
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#144 - 2013-04-11 17:19:07 UTC
At those prices 180-230mil a hull... i d rather fly a BS... ... no reason to fly any of these ships.. unless u have too much isk lol
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#145 - 2013-04-11 17:22:17 UTC
Nightfox BloodRaven wrote:
At those prices 180-230mil a hull... i d rather fly a BS... ... no reason to fly any of these ships.. unless u have too much isk lol

A lot of people are going to fly them. Trust me.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)

Alx Warlord
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#146 - 2013-04-11 17:47:20 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Krell Kroenen wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:


We went with the ships we considered to be the most "iconic" BCs for each race. There was lots of internal debate about Brutix vs Myrm but Brutix won out.


So who's side were you on in this debate eh? Team Myrm or Team Brutix?


I was leading team Myrm but I'm also super excited to fly the Navy Brutix. Also don't let the looks fool you, under its skin the future Eos is going to be the T2 Myrm you guys have always wanted.


Hey CCPFozzie, I'm with you in this one! The Myrm is much more Iconic! Can't you guys change the look of the EOS to look like a Myrm? It is sad to fly a ship dreaming that it look different. ( It is almost like sleeping with a girl imagining that she looks prettier... and you wake up and she looks like a goat!!! Ok, you can love her for her personality, but she keeps ugly as hell... )
Andreus Ixiris
Duty.
Stay Feral
#147 - 2013-04-11 21:58:32 UTC
I'm unsure as of yet whether this will make the Navy Issue Drake scam harder or easier.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.

Arronicus
State War Academy
Caldari State
#148 - 2013-04-11 23:25:24 UTC
From the blog

"Like the sweet, yummy sugar and cherry frosting on that desert you are about to eat,"

Rather apt, considering reading these changes was like chewing on a mouthful of sand. "We're going to nerf your ships, or their weapon systems, then we're going to undo the nerfs, in the form of faction battlecruisers. So you can still have the same ship as before, provided you aren't a new player, and can afford the higher price tag."

+1 for a simple spelling mistake
+1 for increasing the old player/new player gap in the form of making a new weaker subset of battlecruisers, and bumping the tech 1 variants down into that subset.
Madbuster73
State War Academy
Caldari State
#149 - 2013-04-11 23:44:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Madbuster73
CCP please explain this:

A faction Frigate costs 10.000 LP in the FW store.

A faction Cruiser costs 50.000 LP in the FW store.

A faction Battleship costs 150.000 LP in the FW store.

so the most sensible thing would be to make a faction Battlecruiser 100.000 LP.

so why did you make it 125.000 LP?? it makes no sense to make a BC almost the same price as the BS.
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#150 - 2013-04-12 01:11:18 UTC
Arronicus wrote:
From the blog

"Like the sweet, yummy sugar and cherry frosting on that desert you are about to eat,"

Rather apt, considering reading these changes was like chewing on a mouthful of sand. "We're going to nerf your ships, or their weapon systems, then we're going to undo the nerfs, in the form of faction battlecruisers. So you can still have the same ship as before, provided you aren't a new player, and can afford the higher price tag."

+1 for a simple spelling mistake
+1 for increasing the old player/new player gap in the form of making a new weaker subset of battlecruisers, and bumping the tech 1 variants down into that subset.

Except that the nerfs were necessary.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)

Solhild
Doomheim
#151 - 2013-04-12 12:46:57 UTC
Madbuster73 wrote:
CCP please explain this:

A faction Frigate costs 10.000 LP in the FW store.

A faction Cruiser costs 50.000 LP in the FW store.

A faction Battleship costs 150.000 LP in the FW store.

so the most sensible thing would be to make a faction Battlecruiser 100.000 LP.

so why did you make it 125.000 LP?? it makes no sense to make a BC almost the same price as the BS.


Faction Battleship will increase to 200 000 LP and for the previous tier 3 version, 300 000 LP.
mynnna
State War Academy
Caldari State
#152 - 2013-04-14 20:00:27 UTC  |  Edited by: mynnna
Solhild wrote:
Madbuster73 wrote:
CCP please explain this:

A faction Frigate costs 10.000 LP in the FW store.

A faction Cruiser costs 50.000 LP in the FW store.

A faction Battleship costs 150.000 LP in the FW store.

so the most sensible thing would be to make a faction Battlecruiser 100.000 LP.

so why did you make it 125.000 LP?? it makes no sense to make a BC almost the same price as the BS.


Faction Battleship will increase to 200 000 LP and for the previous tier 3 version, 300 000 LP.


If they monkey with values at all it'll be to normalize them to what is currently the Tier 2 level, 250k. This is similar to what they said they'd be doing with cruisers.

Member of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal

Mournful Conciousness
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#153 - 2013-04-18 00:01:44 UTC
Message to the dev team.

Bravo.

I've just returned to Eve after an 8 month break. I have seen what you have done with the battlecruisers and just wanted to say I think it's a job well done. I've had great fun flying a dual-rep brutix around the test server and it's finally a ship that can handle itself. When I returned to the game a lot of my mates whined about the new AAR and reactive hardener modules being rubbish, but they have worked really well for me. The reactive armour hardener is particularly awesome on gallente BC and BS ships in a 1v1 or 1v2.

As a die-hard gallente pilot who has always been disappointed with the traditional lack of manoeuvrability and options, really, Thanks. Gallente ships are still overly susceptible to energy neutralisers I think, and I still think they are not sufficiently more powerful than other races when close up to warrant the downsides:
1. vulnerable to neuts
2. need to get close
3. once close, you are committed until death

However, it's a great start.

I think last year we had all become deeply sceptical of CCP as an organisation, but my return has been a happy one. I can see that the dev focus is now finally really about making the best game on the web even better.

I can finally say I trust what you're doing with the new navy ships.

ps. (wrong thread I know) please don't remove the 5th mid slot of the hyperion. That would be stupid.

/MC



Embers Children is recruiting carefully selected pilots who like wormholes, green killboards and the sweet taste of tears. You can convo me in game or join the chat "TOHA Lounge".

Niden
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#154 - 2013-04-19 13:13:01 UTC
Brutix EZ win! Nothing more iconic than that ship. I remember seeing one for the first time in 2006, gots-to-hav-dat-shiny moment to be sure. Still think it's the most beautiful ship in the game. CAN'T wait for a navy version! And with the changes it's more fleet-fit friendly, I'm lovin' it. Can we get in black please? Pretty please with sugar on top? :)
Dhuras
The Classy Gentlemans Corporation
Moist.
#155 - 2013-04-20 06:38:26 UTC
Drake with 8 launchers and that little powergrid is going to be ****. You'll hardly even be able to fit the launchers on let alone even a single LSE or microwarp, so unless CCP decided navy drake is for rapid lights only i don't know what the **** they are thinking.
Caldari gets ****** over as usual.
Maru Sha
The Department of Justice
#156 - 2013-04-21 16:06:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Maru Sha
CCP Ytterbium wrote:
Stabber Fleet Issue: The current gold standard in Navy Cruisers, this ship performs well and as such is receiving only small modifications. The main change is an addition to the ship’s mass, which reduces its agility and speed slightly.


Can we make a deal? For the increase of the mass you also add a few hull points to the SFI (instead of decreasing this value)?
Samual Gideon
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#157 - 2013-04-29 12:32:58 UTC
Personally I'm looking forward to getting my hands on a Navy Brutix, it's going to be a monster Twisted

The think I don't understand though is why the Eos, the T2 command BC will still be using the Brutix model after the Odyssey update. During fanfest it was announced that the Eos will be changed to a real droneship "a T2 Myrm" so why not give it the Myrmidon model for it? It's a beautiful ship model and it's a crime that it is only used once in the whole of Eve.