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[Odyssey] Tech 1 Battleships - Gallente

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DHB WildCat
Out of Fwocus
Fwodin's Call
#1921 - 2013-04-17 16:59:51 UTC  |  Edited by: DHB WildCat
Bouh Revetoile wrote:
DHB WildCat wrote:
Jesus read the damn post again. I said similar, not the exact same.
So ~25% is similar. Noted. And 200dps is nothing.

it isnt when you are talking Battleship DPS. Also vindi unless in fleets run 7 turrets and a smartbomb. But im sure you have more experience using a vindicator than I do. So please enlighten me with all your Vindicator knowledge
Omnathious Deninard
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#1922 - 2013-04-17 17:01:33 UTC
DHB WildCat wrote:
Bouh Revetoile wrote:
DHB WildCat wrote:
Jesus read the damn post again. I said similar, not the exact same.
So ~25% is similar. Noted. And 200dps is nothing.

it isnt when you are talking Battleship DPS. Also vindi unless in fleets run 7 turrets and a smartbomb. But im sure you have more experience using a vindicator than I do. So please enlighten me with all your Vindicator knowledge

And in a fleet the rep bonus of the hyperion means nothing.

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.
DHB WildCat
Out of Fwocus
Fwodin's Call
#1923 - 2013-04-17 17:02:52 UTC
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
DHB WildCat wrote:
Bouh Revetoile wrote:
DHB WildCat wrote:
Jesus read the damn post again. I said similar, not the exact same.
So ~25% is similar. Noted. And 200dps is nothing.

it isnt when you are talking Battleship DPS. Also vindi unless in fleets run 7 turrets and a smartbomb. But im sure you have more experience using a vindicator than I do. So please enlighten me with all your Vindicator knowledge

And in a fleet the rep bonus of the hyperion means nothing.


well then the extra low slot the vindi gets would make it a better passive tank............... oh wait.................
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#1924 - 2013-04-17 17:06:41 UTC
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
DHB WildCat wrote:
Bouh Revetoile wrote:
DHB WildCat wrote:
Jesus read the damn post again. I said similar, not the exact same.
So ~25% is similar. Noted. And 200dps is nothing.

it isnt when you are talking Battleship DPS. Also vindi unless in fleets run 7 turrets and a smartbomb. But im sure you have more experience using a vindicator than I do. So please enlighten me with all your Vindicator knowledge

And in a fleet the rep bonus of the hyperion means nothing.



By your logic maelstrom sucks ball then....

Sure indeed reapir bonus are weak bonus, but imagine a hyperion with resist bonus. Would be the most bonkers ship ever in this game.

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"
William R Blake
We Did A Thing
Probably Up to No Good
#1925 - 2013-04-17 17:11:48 UTC  |  Edited by: William R Blake
Kagura Nikon wrote:
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
DHB WildCat wrote:
Bouh Revetoile wrote:
DHB WildCat wrote:
Jesus read the damn post again. I said similar, not the exact same.
So ~25% is similar. Noted. And 200dps is nothing.

it isnt when you are talking Battleship DPS. Also vindi unless in fleets run 7 turrets and a smartbomb. But im sure you have more experience using a vindicator than I do. So please enlighten me with all your Vindicator knowledge

And in a fleet the rep bonus of the hyperion means nothing.



By your logic maelstrom sucks ball then....

Sure indeed reapir bonus are weak bonus, but imagine a hyperion with resist bonus. Would be the most bonkers ship ever in this game.



u mean like Abaddon and Rokh?

with good number of effective turrets not to mention HUGE buffer tank and lolscorch or 425railies + range bonus. Does that make sense?
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#1926 - 2013-04-17 17:19:07 UTC
William R Blake wrote:
Kagura Nikon wrote:



By your logic maelstrom sucks ball then....

Sure indeed reapir bonus are weak bonus, but imagine a hyperion with resist bonus. Would be the most bonkers ship ever in this game.



u mean like Abaddon and Rokh?



Since when the abaddon has 5 mids and 125m bandwidth? Jesus! For god sake I cannto believe people are so challanged to not udnerstand simple statements without someone baby sitting their brain!

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"
William R Blake
We Did A Thing
Probably Up to No Good
#1927 - 2013-04-17 17:28:35 UTC  |  Edited by: William R Blake
Full flights of heavies not gonna do much in long range battle. However, in super close range battle, you are right. That 5 mids and 5 heavies maybe a bit over the top.

BUT HEY, AT LEAST WE GALLENTE GET TO HIT ABADDON AND ROKH FACE SOMETIMES!
Omnathious Deninard
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#1928 - 2013-04-17 17:33:29 UTC
Kagura Nikon wrote:
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
DHB WildCat wrote:
Bouh Revetoile wrote:
DHB WildCat wrote:
Jesus read the damn post again. I said similar, not the exact same.
So ~25% is similar. Noted. And 200dps is nothing.

it isnt when you are talking Battleship DPS. Also vindi unless in fleets run 7 turrets and a smartbomb. But im sure you have more experience using a vindicator than I do. So please enlighten me with all your Vindicator knowledge

And in a fleet the rep bonus of the hyperion means nothing.



By your logic maelstrom sucks ball then....

Sure indeed reapir bonus are weak bonus, but imagine a hyperion with resist bonus. Would be the most bonkers ship ever in this game.

Not at all, but in a fleet fight it is better in most situations to fit an extra extender or plate vs an active rep

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#1929 - 2013-04-17 17:49:29 UTC
William R Blake wrote:
Full flights of heavies not gonna do much in long range battle. However, in super close range battle, you are right. That 5 mids and 5 heavies maybe a bit over the top.

BUT HEY, AT LEAST WE GALLENTE GET TO HIT ABADDON AND ROKH FACE SOMETIMES!



WHERE IN MY FREAKING SENTENCE I SAID ANYTHIGN ABOUT LONG RANGE BATTLE!!??? FOR GOD SAKE>> LEARN TO READ AND THINK!!! OMG !!!

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"
Lloyd Roses
Artificial Memories
#1930 - 2013-04-17 18:01:58 UTC
I suddenly feel an urge to get into a dualrep hyperion and blindly jump gates.
smoking gun81
Doomheim
#1931 - 2013-04-17 18:23:41 UTC
Maximus Andendare wrote:
You really ought to play this game before commenting on it.

First, carriers have 15 drones with the DCUs. The Domi would have 10 total. Carriers can use fighters. And I'm pretty sure the main reason to fly a carrier anyway is for triage. By your terrible logic, no ships could have bonuses any other has.


No by my logic no ships should encroach on any particular role like logi bonus on a BS or the ability to fit capital specific modules again you want 10 drones use a carrier or just go out and spend the majority of or all of your isk on a guardian vexor to get your 10 drone use on a sub capital ship.


Maximus Andendare wrote:

Second, ships that have dual bonuses to damage are still usable in small gangs. Ships that have a resist bonus and a damage bonus are usable by small gangs. And the argument for the removal of the local repair bonus is twofold: local armor tanking is cap intensive and performs poorly. There isn't an ASB module that armor tanked ships can fit that makes them cap-independent for tank.


capacitor independence for ships that don't use cap and capacitor usage for them that do is kind of messed up but the ASB's and AAR's are still in an infant stage in the game and can be changed if or when CCP decide to do so until then tanking comments and capacitor independence comments for them modules should go to another thread.
cap intensive well as I've stated previously in this thread you can run dual large reps on a single 800 cap charge it's the other things you do ( MWD, point, web and shoot ) that brakes it.
Should your actions in combat be totally without consequence to you or your ship ???


Maximus Andendare wrote:

Also, "stupidly large" fights aren't the push for getting rid of the local bonus or having it apply to remote reps. Again, you'd know this if you actually played the game. The main reason is that as soon as you introduce logi into a gang or fleet, which is ridiculously easy now with T1 logi, the local bonus is COMPLETELY wasted. So the argument becomes why fly a ship with one bonus when I can fly one with two?


i'm sorry did you overlook the niddy in this situation ( you like triage right ) 2.4 sec is all it would take ( taking into account links etc ) to rep it to FULL ( or 1.2 with two reps ) with what you are proposing this screams broken to me from a well versed triage pilot and from a BS pilot.

Maximus Andendare wrote:

Some experience, even a modest amount, in the field and you might actually have enough to speak credibly here.


just because I post on a different char does not mean I don't play see:
Here
Here
Here
Here
Here Part 1
Here Part 2

All around the medium size fights now lets see your credentials.........
Oh look triage work CoolCool
William R Blake
We Did A Thing
Probably Up to No Good
#1932 - 2013-04-17 19:24:39 UTC
ah well, at least this 2nd revision is better than the 1st one. no matter what happens i will always use those ships that i like.
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#1933 - 2013-04-17 19:45:15 UTC
DHB WildCat wrote:
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
DHB WildCat wrote:
Kahega Amielden wrote:
Quote:
This ship is going to put the Vindi out of order. I know for me personally that if these hit the server, Im going to fire sell every vindi i have before the price drops significantly and buy up hyps.

Please relook at this ship..... Its a monster with the perposed changes. Your new changes is what the Vindicator should be, not a t1 BS.


And the new Thorax obsoletes the Vigilant if you ignore the 90% webs.


So - unless Im wrong ..... 8 turrets bonused one time 37.5% is similar to 6 turrets bonused at 10% per level.

So what school did you fail basic math from?
Last time I checked 6*1.5 = 9
and 8*1.375 = 11




Jesus read the damn post again. I said similar, not the exact same. So we lose 200 dps, for an extra utility high, more drones, A way better tank. Its still broken! Also do you know any active tank vindi that runs 8 turrets? I know I dont. ECM drones will own you without a smartbomb.... every 8 turret ship unless in a fleet, is usually flown with 7 turrets and a smartbomb.

In fact this new hyp would make one hell of a pirate faction ship! 1 vs 1 The new hyp will kick a vindis ass.


Dude the Vindi does more damage, has a freaking tracking bonus and 90% webs Lol

.
ExAstra
Echoes of Silence
#1934 - 2013-04-17 19:57:24 UTC  |  Edited by: ExAstra
I don't see how the new Hyperion is encroaching on the Vindicator at all. The Vindicator gets the equivalent of two extra turrets over the Hyperion (Funny, it actually HAS two extra turrets over the Hyperion). The Vindicator's applied DPS and ability to catch ships is going to be quite a bit higher with that god-mode Federation Navy Webifier it has (I mean why would you use anything else). And while the Vindicator's active tank WILL indeed be worse, the Vindicator will have an equal passive tank for an appropriate level of higher DPS. So when it comes to Tank by Gank, the Vindicator is better. And in that case the Vindicator isn't "wasting" a bonus either. And the Vindicator gets higher EHP, more speed, etc...

Attempting to call two full turrets of DPS and a super-web "irrelevant" on a blaster ship is bogus. Trying to say the new Hyperion in some way outclasses the Vindicator is just ridiculous. The new Hyperion has become a better ship, not a broken one. Its usage is going to go up, though it will probably remain relegated to its role of solo/small gang.

I mean long story short:

Hyperion gets a flight of mediums and a better active tank than the Vindicator. It has slightly better targeting abilities.
Vindicator gets super web, way higher DPS, equal passive tank, way better tracking, significantly higher EHP, MUCH better speed and agility, higher sensor strength, and a smaller signature radius.

Save the drones!
Drew Kaps
Pecuniam Enterprises
#1935 - 2013-04-17 21:11:17 UTC
So this Domi nerf.. is it also going to cripple the Navy Domi?
Omnathious Deninard
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#1936 - 2013-04-17 21:19:21 UTC
Drew Kaps wrote:
So this Domi nerf.. is it also going to cripple the Navy Domi?

What nerf? It could still use some love but there was hardly a nerf.

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.
Drew Kaps
Pecuniam Enterprises
#1937 - 2013-04-17 21:23:35 UTC
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
Drew Kaps wrote:
So this Domi nerf.. is it also going to cripple the Navy Domi?

What nerf? It could still use some love but there was hardly a nerf.


Forgive me, sir, you are correct. So this -25% damage reduction buff, will it also be applied to the Navy Domi?
Omnathious Deninard
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#1938 - 2013-04-17 21:28:46 UTC
Drew Kaps wrote:
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
Drew Kaps wrote:
So this Domi nerf.. is it also going to cripple the Navy Domi?

What nerf? It could still use some love but there was hardly a nerf.


Forgive me, sir, you are correct. So this -25% damage reduction buff, will it also be applied to the Navy Domi?

The damage application was increased and you now have 2 free mid slots. You can still do over 1k DPS at close range. You can also now fit neutron blasters and a tank.
Losing the 25% damage bonus was well composited.
No idea about the navy Dominix.

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.
Rysis Vyvorant
Shadow Legion X
Seriously Suspicious
#1939 - 2013-04-17 21:29:00 UTC
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
Drew Kaps wrote:
So this Domi nerf.. is it also going to cripple the Navy Domi?

What nerf? It could still use some love but there was hardly a nerf.


Considering drones never had an issue hitting in the first place what exactly do you call the change? Below 40km a Geddon is a better ship and for sniping turret boats are just better because they can move.

This is a nerf until either:

drone range bonus is included
drone damge bonus increased
number of drones launched is increased
Maximus Andendare
Stimulus
Rote Kapelle
#1940 - 2013-04-17 21:33:21 UTC
smoking gun81 wrote:
No by my logic no ships should encroach on any particular role like logi bonus on a BS or the ability to fit capital specific modules again you want 10 drones use a carrier or just go out and spend the majority of or all of your isk on a guardian vexor to get your 10 drone use on a sub capital ship.

Using this crazy logic would mean that no ships can share optimal range bonuses, or neuting bonuses, or drone bonuses, or hell, any bonus as long as another ship has it, since it'd be "encroaching." Such a fail.


smoking gun81 wrote:
capacitor independence for ships that don't use cap and capacitor usage for them that do is kind of messed up but the ASB's and AAR's are still in an infant stage in the game and can be changed if or when CCP decide to do so until then tanking comments and capacitor independence comments for them modules should go to another thread.
cap intensive well as I've stated previously in this thread you can run dual large reps on a single 800 cap charge it's the other things you do ( MWD, point, web and shoot ) that brakes it.
Should your actions in combat be totally without consequence to you or your ship ???
I don't even know what the hell you're talking about here. Since I am flying my ship in a gang or fleet without a compelling reason to lose one of the bonuses (supreme alpha strike), no, I'd rather one of the bonuses be completely wasted as soon as I choose to have another pilot take the role of repairing everyone's damage.


smoking gun81 wrote:
i'm sorry did you overlook the niddy in this situation ( you like triage right ) 2.4 sec is all it would take ( taking into account links etc ) to rep it to FULL ( or 1.2 with two reps ) with what you are proposing this screams broken to me from a well versed triage pilot and from a BS pilot.
I don't even know WTF you're talking about here. I'm assuming you're talking about giving a logi range bonus to the Domi, but I don't know what the F you're talking about Niddys and triage for. Adding a range bonus for reppers, for example, would be as un-gamebreaking as giving the neut range benefit to Armageddons. Again, by your failed deductive skills, giving that neut range bonus to the geddon would completely break the game for the Bhaalgorn, when this simply isn't the case. The Bhaals still have tremendously more neuting power vs a Geddon will, just as a proper T2 logi ship will have both range and repair amount over the Domi with a proposed logi range bonus. But why you're talking about triage and a Niddy (being repped?) in 2.4 seconds or...f**k it, I can't make sense of nonsense.

smoking gun81 wrote:
just because I post on a different char does not mean I don't play see:
Here
Here
Here
Here
Here Part 1
Here Part 2

All around the medium size fights now lets see your credentials.........
Oh look triage work CoolCool
Ah cool links! Woo! Instead of watching all those YouTube videos and wishing you were as good as those pilots, you should actually play the game, learn about what you're talking about, then you can post here without sounding like an idiot.

Enter grid and you're already dead, destined to be reborn and fight another day.

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