EVE General Discussion

The curious thing is, I don't see any real white knight brigades forming in EvE. All the "evil doers" seems to have great ability to work together and achieve their goals. People who despise them tend to hide by themselves in a dark corner, hoping the bad men won't notice them. Or just cry for the devs to change the game to suit their antisocial carebearing.

…of course, being obvious, they will also give less actual cred than the same amount of points from a PvP ship. If someone throws an outrageous and spectacular fit over being exploded in a game that relies on stuff being exploded on a regular basis, then that's something to laugh about too. Because, yes, grown-ups exhibiting that kind of unreasonable behaviour is great fun (cf. the non-cat half of youtube).

The curious thing is, I don't see any real white knight brigades forming in EvE. All the "evil doers" seems to have great ability to work together and achieve their goals. People who despise them tend to hide by themselves in a dark corner, hoping the bad men won't notice them. Or just cry for the devs to change the game to suit their antisocial carebearing.

- Gaming, a collective and fun activity, as competitive: as in competitive going out for drinks in a bar? Competitive going out to see a movie? Competitive garden party? Competitive wedding celebration? How autistic are you?

I think the reason for this is simple.

The "evil" types are teenagers that live in their momma's basements and can play 23 hours a day. To them, EVE is life, and winning by causing other's tears is the only joy they get in their otherwise, sad, pathetic LOSER lives.

On the other hand, the people that like to work collaboratively to build things, have real lives. They use EVE as an escape from the stress of the day. After dinner with the wife and kids, helping the kids with homework, maybe doing some chores around the house, they want to log in, harvest some resources for 2-3 hours, then log out so they can get some sleep before getting up at 5AM to head out to their real life job.

That's a F'd up personality trait if you ask me. . You don't see "PVP" type people doing that, playing PVE/"consensual pvp only" screaming about how unfair it is that they can't suicide gank/pk or whatever other people. If they like pvp, they go play non-consensual pvp game.

And yet you guns don't magically turn off in empire. All those things you mention are mitigation, not safety. Why do people who SAY they want safety play an unsafe game?

You start with a false premise that since EVE allows PVP virtually anywhere at anytime, that is all it is about.

Wrong.

EVE has different areas, with different rules and mechanics, that allow for various play styles.

Sure, a suicide ganker can come along and blow up my hulk in high sec. However, the game mechanics ensure that it doesn't happen that often.

And that causes all the "hard core greifers" to whine, whine, whine about high sec, CONCORD, local, NPC corps, sec status, on and on and on.

Why are they in high sec, where there are all these game mechanics they dislike, when all they have to do is go to low or null to avoid most/all of them?






If I were getting blown up on a regular basis, you'd have a point. I don't. I can go months and months at a time without losing a ship. While not perfectly safe, it is safe enough for me to keep playing.

And as long as it stays that safe, I'll keep playing.

what about grown men with familys who play 1-2 hours a weeknight and love to roam around blowing up miners? where would they sit on your scale of evil?

It's not that surprising : there were zero incentives until bounty hunting to actively hunt down "evil doers", such "white knights" are often gamers who enjoy make-believe, and who therefore enjoy the pursuit of ingame assets. Isk/hour hunting down t2 fit t1 hulls used by gankers yields little riches.

You could argue that some should be enjoying it for the sake of it, and truly there are such. However, since accounts are not linked, no alt is accountable for the actions of another alt played by the same player. So, the ganker alt will just dock up and wait for the white knight brigade to leave. The ganker player will log on his 5.0 sec mission running alt, and will amass isk while weathering the storm.

In terms of profit, it's laughable (maybe it's a little better with bounty hunting?). In terms of impact on the ganker/"evil doer" behavior, it's completely null, since New Eden is absolutely not harsh and kold when you use unrelated alts.

Video games are not competitive sports, in which single acting persons act upon the same set of limbs, in an even playfield with very simple rules. Alts, grid, different ships, different skills, gates etc... playfield is not even at all. It can be cheesed. Some gamers will never cheese, as it breaks immersion and the tacit agreement to "play nice". Others will ALWAYS cheese, since they don't care for make believe.

Also, competitive gaming is kind of an oxymoron, isn't it? What next, competitive dinner? competitive barbecue? competitive meet-and-greet? LOL. Social degenerate that you are (© ElPresador)

You should re-read my previous post. It states clearly that:
- Well-balanced gamers are the PLAY WITH type, and their goals are ingame goals, they enjoy make believe
- Schadenfreude seeking competitards are the PLAY AGAINST type, they seek metagame goals, making people rage over the internet. They believe anonymous multiplayer enjoyment is a zero-sum-game, in which they can only have positive fun if their opponent has negative (is annoyed).

You can have exciting pvp and also take care that your opponent has loads of fun, just as you. This is the PLAY WITH mentality, something which seems incredible to you.
Even better, you could have a complete lack of CONCORD in New Eden, and it would work great if gamers had this PLAY WITH mentality. The server could not even handle the number of players that would flock to engage in meaningful and collectively fun pvp.





Reading skills : big fat 0. I enjoy conflict and pvp, as long as it's in the realm of the game, the realm of make-believe, in which gamers want to play WITH each other, not AGAINST.

I only dislike people like you according to how you turn games that should be fun, into cesspools of online sociopathic tryhards, and force devs to hardcore restrictions on pvp so that the playerbase doesn't shrink to a couple thousand grimdark and edgy hormonally-raging teens and butthurt 40yr old hambeasts taking out their pent-up frustration in a goddamn virtual universe. Truthfully, I'm rather thankful that you're here, otherwise I'd spend too much time ingame and would neglect important stuff IRL!


And alas yes, what well-balanced people wish of an online persistent universe, is COMPLETE freedom of action, no restrictions whatsoever, in a community filled with the PLAY WITH type of gamers, who will range from total pve'er to hardcore pvp'er. But said pvp'er will take care that his opponents will always have fun. Something absolutely and completely alien to you, since you believe anonymous online multiplayer activities are zero-sum-games in terms of fun.