EVE General Discussion

By giving the remaining players a much more authentic sandbox and overall fun game.

i think that's the first sensible thing i've ever seen you post.

I sincerely think a good portion would adapt to no hisec, and those that don't should **** off anyways. Ccp did just fine with much less subs for a long time.

nah 'cos they get some satisfaction out of that. drag them down to lowsec if they want to fight and see what real PvP is like, ie. full of surprise third party *********.

You condescending bunch of pricks....why do always assume EVERYBODY can actually afford a second account?

Making up definitions is what the Scotsman Fallacy is all about. And, here, you are doing it again.

PvE is player vs, NPC. If they ship you are shooting is controlled by a NPC, then it is PvE. If it is controlled by another player, then it is NOT PvE.

Creating some new definition, then using that definition to prove your point, is the Scotsman Logical Fallacy.


[quote=Andy Landen]
Real pvpers are not so bad that they have to hide in a blob against a single pve ship. By definition, because they are real pvpers, they have some amount of skill and courage.

My high sec bear is in a small corporation that was war-decced by a MUCH larger alliance looking for easy kills. It was three players - myself and two friends - against an alliance with well over a hundred active members.

I took to a covert ops ship, spent a day looking around for these people, and eventually found their home base. It turned out that this alliance likes to take in new players to the game - and not prepare them at all for war. I would sit in the system cloaked (sometimes for hours, waiting) until I found a newbie at a gate or asteroid belt or planet. I'd uncloak, kill his frigate, pop the pod, and escape.

I swapped to a bomber and popped a few mining barges, too. Then a destroyer for some quick fun. I would change things up, keep them guessing, so they couldn't just hit the directional scanner and see "Oh, there's a Coercer on scan, time to dock!"

After I had gotten a half dozen kills, some in a covert ops (because I could and it's humiliating) and sent polite mails to my victims (your alliance is not preparing you for Eve, they started this war, look elsewhere, check out Eve-Uni), they started to hemorrhage recruits.

That hurt. It didn't hurt their kill board much - the value of newbies in cheap mining frigates isn't exactly a lot - but it did hurt their pride and it hurt their morale. Once a few new players left for greener pastures, more followed.

The war ended not long after.

It doesn't make for a great war story, I don't consider myself some kind of elite PvP pilot, and I certainly don't like to shoot at newbies that just joined the game and don't know any better, but I didn't start the war.

So, what can we learn about this?

As a single player I cannot take on a large number of combat pilots by myself. I'm not Garmon nor any other elite PvP type. I don't have wads of cash for expensive ships full of faction and officer loot. I don't even have a booster alt.

What I can do is look for the weak links. The stragglers. The haulers. People who are a little less smart than I am about Eve (difficult to find, but they exist). The people who simply aren't paying attention and don't even know what a warp scrambler is.

I took the aggressive actions of a much larger entity and did the best I could to respond to it. Minimize my risk, maximize theirs.

What I didn't do was whine about it.

This happened quite a while ago. These days, you have a tool that I never did: You can open your war dec up for assistance from a third party. You don't even have to undock to fight back.

If nothing else, you have 3 slots on your account. Play with a different character while your enemies waste money on someone that won't ever log in.

I don't like them either, but there's little that will be done about that, I'm afraid.

Unlike what many think, real pvp is NOT about getting a blob together to take down a single pve ship.

Still the Scotsman Logical Fallacy. Hint, the use of "Real" in your statement, just before redefining the word, is a sure give away that it is the Scotsman Logical Fallacy.

Again, you may want to at least attempt to disguise your use of logical fallacy in failed attempts to make a point. Like, maybe, NOT using "real" before a word, in an attempt to magically alter the definition of the word.

Here is an example. A player whose KB stats are just blobbing PVE ships, gets negative reputation as a good PvPer to me.