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Universal ship for lv4 missioning

Author
Marc Callan
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#21 - 2013-04-17 14:05:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Marc Callan
The Machariel and Nightmare are the top-of-the-line mission runners for many people, if you've got the money and skills for them, but if the ISK is a little tight, I've found the Maelstrom to be a solid (really solid), dependable boat which can be reconfigured to take on practically all the rat factions. It's slow, but it can be fit with a micro-jump drive if you need to bug out in a hurry, or AB or MWD if you want to control range more traditionally; it can seriously hammer long-range kiting rats with artillery or chainsaw short-range rats with autocannons (with selectable ammunition to shoot into the resistance hole of whatever you're facing); and you can swap out hardeners to fit an insane burst tank.

"We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be." - Kurt Vonnegurt

Mike Whiite
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#22 - 2013-04-17 14:21:00 UTC
comming cruise missile buff, will make the CNR Hillarious.

Baggo Hammers
#23 - 2013-04-17 16:42:33 UTC
Marc Callan wrote:
The Machariel and Nightmare are the top-of-the-line mission runners for many people, if you've got the money and skills for them, but if the ISK is a little tight, I've found the Maelstrom to be a solid (really solid), dependable boat which can be reconfigured to take on practically all the rat factions. It's slow, but it can be fit with a micro-jump drive if you need to bug out in a hurry, or AB or MWD if you want to control range more traditionally; it can seriously hammer long-range kiting rats with artillery or chainsaw short-range rats with autocannons (with selectable ammunition to shoot into the resistance hole of whatever you're facing); and you can swap out hardeners to fit an insane burst tank.


This.

If you don't know where you're going, any road will take you there.

Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
#24 - 2013-04-17 17:04:56 UTC
The Machariel is a very nice mission running ship. Debatably the best all round mission runner, But it is also very expensive as well.

The best all around mission runner excluding faction ships would have to be the Raven. hybrid gun ships are great against guristas, but not so good for others, projectiles are good for most missions but it is easy for small ships to get under your guns. Lasers are good against sanshas and blood raiders but less effective against others. Drone boats are great, but harder to use effectively than they used to be.

Solo mission running the damage delay from missiles is not a big deal. The Raven is cheap and has damage selection by changing missile types. With T2 launchers and a couple rigor rigs it can hit everything from frigates to Battleships. Missiles do the same damage at max range as they do at point blank, so you can kite missions without your DPS dropping. You can apply damage very well and still have plenty of tank.

Every other popular mission ship has difficulties in certain missions. The nightmare is great, but really loses its shine in missions where the rats are strong against EM/Thermal damage. A lot of rats use tracking disruption which really hurts and turret based ship. The Raven is hurt my jamming and sensor dampening, but all ships are hit equally hard by that, at least the Raven has the option to fire FOF missiles and still do some damage.

Since you already fly a Domi I do not have to go into the negatives for that, but it does make a great mission ship. I use a sentry DOMI at times, i find fitting one or two small shield or armor transfers and putting them on your drones will keep aggro off them, and you can rep any damage that is done rather than pull them in. I have not had issues with my drones for he last couple months, they seem to be "FIXED" at least for me.
DeLindsay
Galaxies Fall
#25 - 2013-04-17 17:38:04 UTC
Quote:
Remove guns on that domi and you're down to 500 dps. Not that it wasn't already 500 applied dps anyway, since they're rails.

The answer is Mach, or CNR. Mach is probably closer to your skills trained, since you fly gallante. Between Mach and CNR, Mach is also the better boat. Vindi doesn't satisfy "universal ship" condition, as it can't change dmg type. Then there's the short locking range (50-60km, depending on skill), which means fitting sebos. There's also the rail suckage issue.


This reply and seeing some of your other comments about Drones/Gallente ships you obviously don't know how to play Eve. LvL 5 Gallente BS + even 3 DDA's (Sentry dmg Rig is crap) gives you 800 DPS with Sentries, 825 DPS with Heavy Drones. Add 2 Navy Omnis and even Guardes have 57km Optimal (+12km Falloff) with more tracking than enhanced Rails. However, I agree Rails suck. The current kings of Minmatar space are the Navy Domi/Vindi as both can apply over 1800 DPS to Angels (Heavies/Sentries + Blasters + Imps) while still maintaining ~1K DPS 3-slot Shield Boosted Tank (even without Crystals). The incoming TE nerf will hurt this as the Vindi will have to switch to Null ammo and drop down to ~1550 DPS just to maintain the same range as now (most Angels orbit below 30km), the incoming Domi change will drop it down to ~1400 DPS but you will gain SERIOUS hit ratio for Drones.

The 3rd highest gank fit is the Mach with 16-1700 DPS while having the same tank as the above ships (3-slot Shield) but tracking still isn't very good compared to Blasters. The Mach is much faster with lower scan res than Vindi, uses ammo at a slightly faster rate as Vindi/Domi and all 3 need cap boosters (if you are worried with a ~3min tank). the Domi is slow as balls, but the Rattlesnake is even worse. Rattlesnake can have the highest LOL-Tank while still dealing 8-900 DPS and the incoming 30% buff to Cruise will help but not even 100 DPS with only 4 launchers. Mauraders aren't that good except for the ability to loot/salvage on the go (many mission runners dual box a salvager in a Noctis along side the mission ship, or 1 pocket behind).

The changing of dmg type is moot when you're pushing 1500+ DPS, even if an extra 15-20% of that DPS is being resisted. I rarely swap out Sentries or missles in my Rattlesnake, and my Vindi/Domi kills Angels WAAAAY faster even using Guardes/blasters. The base scan res of most BS's suck so expect a long wait to target inties or your Sentries for RR unless you waste a valuable mid for a SeBo. Personally LvL 4's if you are near or max skills should be fitted for MAX GANK with only enough tank to survive each pocket while you destroy enough ships to lower incoming dmg. This is the most efficient way. forget "cap stable" or "and it has a 1500 DPS Omni tank"

The Operative: "There are a lot of innocent people being killed in the air right now".

Capt. Malcolm Reynolds: "You have no idea how true that is".

Morrigan LeSante
Perkone
Caldari State
#26 - 2013-04-17 19:34:35 UTC
Mike Whiite wrote:
comming cruise missile buff, will make the CNR Hillarious.



This
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#27 - 2013-04-17 21:51:13 UTC
Navy domi:

pretty much immune to TD, damping and ECM.

What's your mach going to do while it's got 25km range on its guns, 15k targeting range or jammed?
Klymer
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#28 - 2013-04-17 21:52:15 UTC
CNR or SNI and Vargur get my votes.

I have a sinking feeling the Machariel is going to be Rifter'ized when the faction ship rebalance happens.
Nimrod vanHall
Van Mij Belastingvrij
#29 - 2013-04-18 10:45:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Nimrod vanHall
Markus Navarro wrote:
I really like the rattlesnake. Can do any faction, Easy to tailor for different NPC/incoming damage and Sentries are just awesome by design. Also,pretty cheap compared to Mach and the likes.

Also, you can eventually Solo all the Epic Arcs with it, only ship able to do so. I doubt you would do such, but it's still nice to have the option.


I soloed the Gallente epic arc with a Normal Domi with a MJD and t2 sentry drones, fitting was T2 except for the rigs they were T1. In the last mission i used T1 sentries cuzz the boss kept killing my sentries. this was the high sec variation btw.

I cant comment on the other arcs (for now)

the hardest part was avoiding wartargets on the way since i did it with a toon that is in TEST.
Uzbeg Khan
Henehen Conflict Logistics
#30 - 2013-04-18 13:16:35 UTC
Use a Templar.

Things I hate: - Signatures - Irony - Lists

Jimmy Binchiette
Republic Security Connections
#31 - 2013-04-18 22:04:45 UTC
I use a blaster Proteus for low sec lvl 4's and I can run them much faster than my highsec tengu pilot can
Funky Lazers
Funk Freakers
#32 - 2013-04-19 21:57:00 UTC
sabre906 wrote:
Andracin wrote:
Kestutis Fujika wrote:
At the moment i flying dominix , but new drone agro system i purely annoying with dropping an picking sentrys every minute. Only solution i found is fly 2 of them , but i dont wana multi box at the moment. So i decided drop drone ships they just dont worth trouble to fly solo and looking for other weapons systems and ships.


Or throw some remote reps on the sentries....


Remove guns on that domi and you're down to 500 dps. Not that it wasn't already 500 applied dps anyway, since they're rails.

The answer is Mach, or CNR. Mach is probably closer to your skills trained, since you fly gallante. Between Mach and CNR, Mach is also the better boat. Vindi doesn't satisfy "universal ship" condition, as it can't change dmg type. Then there's the short locking range (50-60km, depending on skill), which means fitting sebos. There's also the rail suckage issue.


QFT
Except CNR is very far from being compared to Mach.

The closet ship in terms of performance is Vindi, but only if you shoot at Serpentins/Guristas, because of low resistances.


Bear in mind even after Cruise buff next patch Mach will still be the best mission boat.
Missiles perform bad on missions not because of damage, but because of Painters, Defenders, rats' ABs, Non-insta damage and inability to 1-shot small rats.

Whatever.

Baggo Hammers
#33 - 2013-04-19 22:43:53 UTC
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
Navy domi:

pretty much immune to TD, damping and ECM.

What's your mach going to do while it's got 25km range on its guns, 15k targeting range or jammed?



I dare say even with the TE nerf it will be a bit better than that in a MWD Mach. I too like the Navy Domi but c'mon, no contest.

If you don't know where you're going, any road will take you there.

Dato Koppla
Spaghetti Militia
#34 - 2013-04-20 05:38:38 UTC
As mentioned above CNR is going to be competing for best all around missioner with the proposed buff to Cruise Missiles, it could already pump out 820 dps to 120km with missiles alone and if it gets a 7th mid like the current Raven it will have room for another TP which will make up for the slight nerf in explosion radius. With the buffs it will be hitting 900+ dps to BC/BS at insane range, and almost 800 dps with faction ammo for smaller stuff. On top of that, for high skilled pilots you can run 3 sentry drones while still having a flight of lights pushing the dps to well over 1k and allowing you to instapop frigates on the approach which is one of guns main selling points.

It also has immunity to TD, best resistance to jamming (bar droneboats), and best resistance to damping (once again droneboats fare better against damping) and a spare lowslot for anti-ewar modules without giving up anything.
Paikis
Vapour Holdings
#35 - 2013-04-20 10:24:58 UTC
The top few 'best' mission running ships are so hilariously close to each other in terms of effectiveness, that you can safely pick whichever one you like. You might save a couple of seconds on each mission depending on your choice, but its not going to make a huge difference.

I have a Nightmare, a Machariel, a CNR and a Tengu. I use them for different missions, but honestly, as long as you're not doing something stupid like shooting Angels with the Nightmare, or Guristas with the Machariel, they're all pretty much interchangeable.

And before it comes up again, no, I have no trouble at all with Tracking Disruption. And yes, I have done both the Blockade and Vengeance with my Nightmare in the last week, and several times each since the NPC changes. Stop being bad.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#36 - 2013-04-20 18:37:30 UTC
If the proposed Cruise Missile changes go through, the CNR will easily be the best mission boat.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

Garresh
Mackies Raiders
Wild Geese.
#37 - 2013-04-20 19:10:02 UTC
Honestly, anything. If you have the right skills and adjust resists as needed any battleship, t3, or stuff can level 4 easily.

This Space Intentionally Left Blank

Domer Pyle
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#38 - 2013-04-22 18:23:01 UTC
mach, ofc. even with the TE nerf.

"Imagine if the bars to your prison were all you had ever known. Then one day, someone appears and unlocks the door. If they have the power to do this, then are they really the liberator? You never remembered who it was that closed you in." - Ior Labron

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