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EVE New Citizens Q&A

 
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My Experiences in EvE

Author
Login Wars
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#1 - 2013-03-26 23:14:19 UTC
This isn't so much a serious review but rather my experiences during my time in EVE.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_vh7bL41X8

I hope you find it somewhat useful

(Shameless advertising I know)

^^
Ovv Topik
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#2 - 2013-03-26 23:30:13 UTC
Well it was objective. I'll give you that.

But I think it comes down to EvE isn't for everyone. And your not one of the few who gets it.

You gave a few tells away with comments like "Kill 20 wolves" showing the benchmark you hold it against, and you just cant compare them.

They couldnt be more different in concept and design.

But there is nothing to defend! You didnt get it. It's not for you. Play something else! No really.

"Nicknack, I'm in a shoe in space, on my computer, in my house, with a cup of coffee, in't that something." - Fly Safe PopPaddi. o7

ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#3 - 2013-03-26 23:36:56 UTC
Look at PvE as a "means to an end," not an "end in of itself."

And Red vs. Blue, while good in some ways, isn't good for the reasons you describe (large group fights, being primaried and dying quickly). Try joining up with people in low-sec and learn how they make money and blow people up (sometimes at the same time). It's much more fast paced and "casual" once you learn how to get around some of the "obstacles" present there.

And don't worry about having low skillpoints. You can still be "effective" in some ways that are extremely useful for small groups of people.
Baggo Hammers
#4 - 2013-03-27 00:04:40 UTC
In a way, EVE is a reflection of your own imagination. As a sandbox should be. Of course you will find it boring if you can't think of anything to do.

Put a kid out back with a stick and watch the fun he has.

As mentioned though it is not for everyone.

If you don't know where you're going, any road will take you there.

Login Wars
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#5 - 2013-03-27 00:59:49 UTC
I'm glad you guys didn't chastise me for ripping a little on EVE, I was expecting some truly horrendous replies. I guess i've been hanging around the DOTA community for too long.

You are definitely right though when you say "EVE is a reflection of your own imagination"

I guess in that respect I would have been any good at good ol' Dungeons and Dragons... even though i'd like to give that a shot but my friends aren't in to that kind of thing. It's kind of irritating though, seeing a game and thinking "wow that looks ******* amazing" and then playing it and feeling something else.

I guess there was so much and I could have mentioned and I am by no means qualified to give this game a serious review as there would be an ungodly amount to review and I only experienced a small section of the game.
NightCrawler 85
Phoibe Enterprises
#6 - 2013-03-27 01:42:39 UTC  |  Edited by: NightCrawler 85
In an odd way i actually liked it, and can agree to many of the things mentioned. Well agree as in, its things i have heard before from other players who simply can not get into EVE. The difference is that you tried to give it a honest try so points for that Smile

You are very right that EVE is more like a..second life. Which (in my opinion) can be both good and bad. It allows you to fully dedicate your time and recourses into your character(s) and you can feel a sense of pride of your accomplishments knowing your "unique" which is something other games like WOW or TSW is missing. But, it can be like a full time job, which can be extremely frustrating and at times aggravating. Especially if your in any kind of leadership position this becomes a huge problem since then your "expected" to log on every day for X amount of hours, and on some days its not to actually do anything, but just to be seen.Thats when you have to question if your logging in because your having fun, or because you feel you are supposed to.

I do however feel you did a mistake with not giving a more..classic corp a try. RVB is great, dont take me wrong. But if your just trying to figure out if you like the game and you have a set..time limit on how long your going to stick around a classic player corp would give you a better social experience. And thats something new players needs to understand about EVE, the social aspect is huge! Its (in general) not a solo game. You need friends, you need enemies, you need allies and you need people that will stab you in the back as soon as it benefits them. The ships, the missions, the industry, the ISK....everything is basically just there to help enhance this experience and make it possible for the players to create them.

So my advice to you... Give it a second try, but find a corp that you might enjoy..piracy, industry, merc, 0.0, incursion or whatever. Give it a couple of months, and if you dont like your first corp, join a new one. One corp does not represent every corp in EVE and the differences between each can be small things like how many active members, to how many hours a day you have to spend logged in.

Good luck!

Edit; And in general people are nice and polite in this section of the forums, post something like this in General Discussion as an example and you would find a lot more people being rude or directly trash talking you.
J'Poll
MUSE LLP
RAZOR Alliance
#7 - 2013-03-27 06:01:03 UTC
Login Wars wrote:
I'm glad you guys didn't chastise me for ripping a little on EVE, I was expecting some truly horrendous replies. I guess i've been hanging around the DOTA community for too long.

You are definitely right though when you say "EVE is a reflection of your own imagination"

I guess in that respect I would have been any good at good ol' Dungeons and Dragons... even though i'd like to give that a shot but my friends aren't in to that kind of thing. It's kind of irritating though, seeing a game and thinking "wow that looks ******* amazing" and then playing it and feeling something else.

I guess there was so much and I could have mentioned and I am by no means qualified to give this game a serious review as there would be an ungodly amount to review and I only experienced a small section of the game.


I havent watched it or repliedTwisted

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club

Rhugor
Viziam
#8 - 2013-03-27 07:49:05 UTC
Pretty fair overall

As someone who has been through the same relationship with eve I know how you feel. There are times that I really enjoy it, and others that I wonder if I'm paying money that could be spent better elsewhere. EVE has unlimited potential, but the potential is somewhat limited by your imagination, and also by the learning curve. My biggest gripe and applause for the game is the training system, while its great that I can train without actually being in game and doing something, the massive amount of time required makes me feel that if I am not specialized I am missing out many opportunities to enjoy varying aspects of the game.

One solution touted on the forums is to purchase multiple accounts, so you can train multiple characters to perform different aspects of the game, but requires more time investment (training) and money. I will probably always sub and unsub with eve as time goes on, its one of those games that you really enjoy playing until you hit a rut. At that point, for me at least, the problems that you are able to glance over in the past become a lot more obvious. More so than in any other game.
Ovv Topik
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#9 - 2013-03-27 08:31:35 UTC
OP: It sounds like the old "what do I do now?" syndrome to me.

Traditional games hold your hand and give you a never ending line little x's on a map all the way through.

Most people get to the end of the tutorial and freeze: "Where's my little X?"

The few get there and think: "Wow! So I can actually do anything! Cool."

Let go of the breadcrumbs my friend...

"Nicknack, I'm in a shoe in space, on my computer, in my house, with a cup of coffee, in't that something." - Fly Safe PopPaddi. o7

J'Poll
MUSE LLP
RAZOR Alliance
#10 - 2013-03-27 08:32:43 UTC  |  Edited by: J'Poll
Here is my comments to your video, with timestamps applied:

0.25 = you can be a PvP after the tutorial. If you want to be a rogue just go live in low-sec.

From start = Saw you were using autopilot. This is normally slower then manual flying. And as your trip included low-sec, good chance you would have been killed. Low-sec Autopiloting is a great way to loose your ship.

0.50 = Mining can be boring if you don't like it. The good thing about EVE is that you can do what you like.

1.10 = Scanning is hard. But practice makes perfect. The more you do it, the easier it will get.

1.14 = Like mining...you don't have to do missions. Only do them if you want to do them.
You almost lost me when you compared EVE to WoW. Heads up, EVE is very very unlike any typical theme-park MMO and thus comparing them will be utterly useless.
You don't HAVE to loot if you don't want.

2.00 = Now you know why EVE is known as Spreadsheet online. Most things you do in EVE can be noted down in spreadsheets. This isn't limited to Industry.

2.20 = Finally someone who doesn't ask why WASD doesn't work and know that it involves fluid dynamics (Submarines Online).

2.38 = RvB is not large fleet battles. RvB is medium sized gangs. And ANY PvP you do will cost you ISK, so that isn't so surprising. Ships cost ISK, ships will get blown up, so you need ISK to fly ships in PvP. And if you get primairied by the enemy, you should die. If not, the enemy fleet sucks. Also part of PvP. If you expect PvP without losses, look at a different game. Station camping is part of the game but in RvB there are some rules about station camping.

3.48 = From the looks of the video EVE just isn't the game for you. That is completely normal, it takes a special mindset to "get" EVE.

3.55 = EVE is real. It only becomes a 2nd life / 2nd job when you treat it that way. Plenty of people I know that only log on for moments yet have a great time while in game.

3.59 = EVE is newbie friendly, if you step up and ask questions. Trying to climb the learning cliff alone will be very very hard. Asking others to help you climb it will make it easier.



Now. I hope you stick around and at least try. Make friends, ask questions and hopefully you will find out that it isn't as bad as you say it is in your video.

Btw, even though I don't agree with a lot in your video it is still a great video as it is clearly gives away your opinions but not in a whining and raging way.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club

Chal0ner
Signal Cartel
EvE-Scout Enclave
#11 - 2013-03-27 09:31:28 UTC
J'Poll wrote:


1.14 = Like mining...you don't have to do missions. Only do them if you want to do them.
You almost lost me when you compared EVE to WoW. Heads up, EVE is very very unlike any typical theme-park MMO and thus comparing them will be utterly useless.
You don't HAVE to loot if you don't want.


Also, don't kill the trigger ship ... P
J'Poll
MUSE LLP
RAZOR Alliance
#12 - 2013-03-27 11:45:45 UTC
Chal0ner wrote:
J'Poll wrote:


1.14 = Like mining...you don't have to do missions. Only do them if you want to do them.
You almost lost me when you compared EVE to WoW. Heads up, EVE is very very unlike any typical theme-park MMO and thus comparing them will be utterly useless.
You don't HAVE to loot if you don't want.


Also, don't kill the trigger ship ... P


That too. Most missions use groups of rats, which means you can pick them 1 group at the time. And reinforcements are only spawned when you kill the trigger. Leaving them till last will mean it gets easier.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club

Charles Burger
Reckless Abandon
#13 - 2013-03-27 12:53:52 UTC
RvB (or small ship PVP in general) doesn't need as much ISK as people seem to think. Sure if you want to fly pimped up ships then it can get expensive, but you can fit a plated Punisher for under 1 mil, you're unlikely to get primaried, and even if you do you'll last long enough to get on some kills. After insurance you'll probably only be down by about 500k each time you die. And flying a close range frigate with a prop mod, you'll be quick to grab loot after a battle... even if you have a really bad day and lose 10 ships, you may loot one cruiser wreck and pick up 5 mil's worth of kit, meaning you're in the black.

Sure, you need a stash of ships to get going. Firstly see what you can get for free! There's replacement ship programs, noob fleet bonuses, etc. If you prefer not to take handouts then doing the SOE epic arc or just some missions for a while would earn you enough, you don't need 100's of mils, just 10 mil will do to fit up some Punishers and then you can be self-sustaining by looting. And there's always PLEX, if you can't face earning ISK any other way... 500 mil will last you a VERY long time, if you can avoid the temptation to blow it all at once!
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#14 - 2013-03-27 13:34:14 UTC
You're not alone OP, it took me 5 trials before Eve finally got its hooks into me. Eve is definitely more about the people, than it is about the game. Find the right bunch of folk and it becomes an infinitely better experience.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack

Login Wars
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#15 - 2013-03-27 14:10:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Login Wars
Thanks for the replies! reading through these comments is really helpful and in a way it's making me regret un-subbing to EVE. However, I do stand by what I said, though through each EVE cycle I go through I feel like I learn a little more and I do hope one day i'll be able to stick at it.

Quote:
OP: It sounds like the old "what do I do now?" syndrome to me.

Traditional games hold your hand and give you a never ending line little x's on a map all the way through.

Most people get to the end of the tutorial and freeze: "Where's my little X?"

The few get there and think: "Wow! So I can actually do anything! Cool."

Let go of the breadcrumbs my friend...


That pretty much hit the nail on the head, it is quite difficult to get out of this "Where's my little X" mentality. It's almost akin to how the western world is trained to believe capitalism is the only true doctrine and anything else, like communism, is utterly absurd.
J'Poll
MUSE LLP
RAZOR Alliance
#16 - 2013-03-27 15:55:50 UTC
Login Wars wrote:
Thanks for the replies! reading through these comments is really helpful and in a way it's making me regret un-subbing to EVE. However, I do stand by what I said, though through each EVE cycle I go through I feel like I learn a little more and I do hope one day i'll be able to stick at it.

Quote:
OP: It sounds like the old "what do I do now?" syndrome to me.

Traditional games hold your hand and give you a never ending line little x's on a map all the way through.

Most people get to the end of the tutorial and freeze: "Where's my little X?"

The few get there and think: "Wow! So I can actually do anything! Cool."

Let go of the breadcrumbs my friend...


That pretty much hit the nail on the head, it is quite difficult to get out of this "Where's my little X" mentality. It's almost akin to how the western world is trained to believe capitalism is the only true doctrine and anything else, like communism, is utterly absurd.



Well if you ever expect that EVE will show you where to go next etc.
Sorry, but it will likely never happen. That is also why the EVE playerbase is very different from WoW and other MMOs.
The issue is that you have to place your own X somewhere in the distant and then work your way too it and when you reach it you just place a new X somewhere else.

EVE is about setting your own long and short term goals and work towards them. And as it's a MMO usually it means interacting with other players (both good and bad). That interacting is what makes EVE great, the level of comerade-ship you can get from a good group of people you fly with.

Personally I dont see the outside of a station that much on most of my characters. Its mainly the chat and voice comms that keepsme in the game. Its having a group of "EVE friends" to hang out with and have nice conversations and discusions with.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club

Fractal Muse
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#17 - 2013-03-27 16:03:42 UTC
EVE is an interesting game in that it allows you to get out of it what you put in.

If you want to lead thousands of players in a real time strategy game that involves tens of thousands of hours of warfare, real losses, and tactical fleet encounters... you can.

If you want to log in for 20 minutes a week and fight some NPCs... you can.

If you want to become a trading tycoon that dominates a single fundamental resource... you can.

That being written, EVE isn't for everyone all the time. For many people it is something that is a slow build. You get intrigued, try it out, decide that it isn't for you... but in the back of your mind there is a thought... of.. what if... it is? So, a few months later or even years later you give it another whirl. Once again you decide, nope, this really isn't for me. But, still, that thought persists but grows ever larger. And, then, the next time you try it, you "get" it and get hooked.

At the moment, I play EVE Online for about an hour a week. I have a blast and I am happy. I am coming off of a period where I was playing for about an hour a day.

I get out of EVE what I put into it. I'm usually happiest when I am playing with a group of people on a regular basis (incursions were awesome) and when I am doing stuff that isn't strictly in-game (making videos, writing on forums, drafting policy) but I don't unsubscribe. I leave my account going and training even when I'm in a quiet period for EVE.

All that to write: I won't be surprised to hear that you started playing regularly in a year's time. ;)
Lost Greybeard
Drunken Yordles
#18 - 2013-03-27 17:04:37 UTC
Login Wars wrote:
I guess in that respect I would have been any good at good ol' Dungeons and Dragons... even though i'd like to give that a shot but my friends aren't in to that kind of thing. It's kind of irritating though, seeing a game and thinking "wow that looks ******* amazing" and then playing it and feeling something else.


The analogy to tabletop games is a lot stronger than to most other MMOs, especially most other RECENT MMOs.

Typical MMOs released in the last year follow essentially the old Everquest model, which I guess you'd now call the WoW model, of largely basing interactions on simple, scalar statistics, using standardized content in multiple places that provides the user with artificial challenges, and compartmentalizing PvP into what is essentially a mini-game or set of mini-games with its own rules.

Eve's paradigm is more to provide a setting, some resources to fight over, and a set of tools. Half the game is figuring out how those tools work and how best to use them, the other half is player-created challenge from other people that want the same resources or just don't like you for whatever reason. It's much more like old d20 D&D or an older, open-world PvP MMO like Dark Age of Camelot than, say, Guild Wars 2.

Not to knock GW2, or Rift, or any of the other WoW-paradigm MMOs, games are fundamentally wasting your time in a manner that entertains you so if you enjoy it, you enjoy it. Just... as others have mentioned, Eve is sort of a relic from a time when the player/environment interaction for online multiplayer hadn't been experimentally optimized for mass consumption yet, and is built on the assumption of a niche market that doesn't mind delving into fairly complex arithmetic rule-sets or spending most of their time dealing with other players instead of quest NPCs. There's a reason the missions haven't been updated since 2007 for the most part, the "target audience" of the game doesn't really care about missions aside from a backup isk supply, even the mission runners don't really care about missions.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#19 - 2013-03-27 17:13:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Gizznitt Malikite
This is what I gathered from you:

a.) You like most aspects of PvP: Constant danger, shooting other players, fitting your ship to test out new tactics, optimizing it, etc...

b.) You dislike tedious and repetitive tasks: Mining, Mission running, scanning, S&I...

c.) Your dilemma with EvE: Affording the PvP without getting bogged down in the isk making tasks.
Solutions:
  • Fund your game play with plex.... I'm serious, for ~15$ (or whatever currency you use), you can instantly get ~500m isk... That's what, 0.5-2 hours of real-life work? Most people don't make that much isk in 2 hours of game play... and if you don't enjoy that 2 hours of game play, then it's worth it to simply fund your play style with PLEX.

  • Read the Isk guide, and explore the other isk-making opportunities. PI can earn you 50m / planet / month, and requires not a lot of work. Optimizing S&I is all about your spreadsheet skills... so get someone elses spread sheet and focus on simple stuff... Try out incrusions, or Wormholes, which earn more isk/hour and have a larger sense of danger in running them. Pirate and ransom people... scam people... suicide gank people.... there are many ways to get isk, and I bet there are some that you will enjoy.

  • Once you find a way to make isk in a manner that doesn't involve pulling hair, headaches, pain killers, and slit wrists, I bet you'll stick around...
    Ilkahn
    Ideal Mechanisms
    #20 - 2013-03-27 19:53:43 UTC
    Login Wars wrote:
    I'm glad you guys didn't chastise me for ripping a little on EVE, I was expecting some truly horrendous replies. I guess i've been hanging around the DOTA community for too long.

    You are definitely right though when you say "EVE is a reflection of your own imagination"

    I guess in that respect I would have been any good at good ol' Dungeons and Dragons... even though i'd like to give that a shot but my friends aren't in to that kind of thing. It's kind of irritating though, seeing a game and thinking "wow that looks ******* amazing" and then playing it and feeling something else.

    I guess there was so much and I could have mentioned and I am by no means qualified to give this game a serious review as there would be an ungodly amount to review and I only experienced a small section of the game.


    In some regards, Eve Online is Dungeons and Dragons. Your character ages and improves his skill set over time sorta the same in both games with the exception that in eve you dont have a hard coded level, it's more like real life where you spend time to harden a particular catagory of knowledge.

    As the comparison may also go, EVE is much easier on the new player vs old timer when it comes to ship classes vs D&D. A 20th lvl whatever will always squash a 5th lvl whatever. Being that a new player taking it slow and getting professional advice and following it will very quickly even up the major odds hardening the frigates and cruisers first and developing proper support skills that carry into heavier classes.

    Eve isn't a game you can log into and play for a week and make a judgement call. You really need to stick with it 6 months to gain an understanding of the "entire" world. It truly is a wonderous world and game. CCP has done an excellent job at bringing a universe to life allowing players to handle all aspects of the game. We make the ships, mine the materials, fight for resources, launch projects of assistance, and punitive retaliation. Just as the world we live in is full of industry and politic, so is eve.

    i would ask that you continue to play eve another 6 months and then see how your opinion has changed.

    Fly safe, and enjoy whatever it is in life that you do enjoy though :)
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