Warfare & Tactics

FW is reverting back to a cesspool of farming alts and players shouldn't have to wait 6 months for CCP to implement rudimentary changes. That is why we have the new(ish) patcher afterall isn't it.

Most FW players agree the system as it stands is broken and that changes need to be made. These are simple changes that should be done immediately that would rectify many of the current problems.

1) Beacons inside of complexes should have an anti-cloaking mechanism. A single individual should not have the ability to effect sovereignty by cloaking up and waiting out the enemy. They wait you out afk and as soon as you leave, they decloak and continue profiting. Surely the people manning the beacon would at least lock onto the enemy target and prevent them from doing this.

2) Timers absolutely have to start running backwards as soon as the enemy leaves said complex. Farmers should not be allowed to warp from plex to plex after they get chased out of one and continue this endless loop until they finish all of the said timers. Once they leave timers should start working backwards to end this type of farming.

3) Bunkers need to have considerably more HP. Affecting the sovereignty of an empire is a big deal and it should feel as such. Players should have to make a significant commitment to do this, with manpower and hardware. 10-15 cloaky bombers should not be able to come in and make short order of this task. They could not do this in null but they can just push over any of the 4 empires in the blink of an eye.

4) Bunkers need to shoot out warnings in their respective militia chats when they're being attacked, just like customs offices or other structures send out mail notifications. "Such and Such bunker is at 90% structure". These warnings need to be given periodicaly as the structure takes more damage to give a clear indication of the shape it's in and to prevent every vulnerable bunker from sending out warnings to distract players from the one thats taking the real damage.

Again changing sov is a big deal, this is not a task that should be allowed to be done in the secrecy of the night in some back end systems unbeknownst to entire empires. People should have have to make significant commitments in both manpower and resources and their should be considerable risk when sovereignty is at stake.

These are all very simple and effective changes that could be implemented overnight by the greenest of coders. Show your support and get behind these ideas.

Flame on Farmers
o/

It does everything to prevent the type of farming mentioned, and you've offered nothing other than bollocks as an argument.

Seeing 20 systems listed as red and vulnerable does nothing to tell you that a bunker is being attacked.

Keeping tabs on 15 bombers in the middle of the night in back end systems is entirely too much.

And if they increased the HP of bunkers 3 years ago it apparently was not enough.

next.

Great, those are exactly the type of fights we should see more of.

Unfortunately when the majority of bunkers getting busted are done with bombers it seldom happens.

Notifying the militia of exactly which bunker is being attacked would draw attention to the situation and would certainly bring more fights.

Then just stay there and decontest the plex. Hardly you can force someone to fight (cloak or not, they would warp anyway) but a single pilot willing to fight can negate any profit and influence to any nymber of farmers and force them to leave.
I know can be boring when someone search for a fight, but is not related to cloacking, and I don't see why sonmeone shouldnt be allowed to wait cloacked in a plex for an ambush or anything.

FW Plexes already add several artificial barrier, no need to have more, we're already borderline. And wouldn't change anything.




FW sov is based on people doing something for it. This include de-plex their systems too. Or it would become like null sec passive sov.
Eventually the defensive timer could be faster than now, but this should be balanced in some other way cause it would advantage the defender and make harder the system flip

I guess I thought the premise of FW was to encourage fighting. Cloaky plexing does not encourage this, and spending vast amounts of time on my main to block a cloaky plexer is silly and contrary to the spirit of the FW system.



This is exactly the point, it should not be so easy to flip systems. People would spend more time deplexing if the opportunity for more fights presented itself. Waiting out cloaky plexers is not the answer, and competing with the hordes of these types of plexing alt is fruitless.

1) How is cloaky plexing good ?

2) You agreed with timer roll backs

3) Why would more HP on bunkers be bad ?

4) Why does every other structure get notifications when its being attacked except in FW ?

The word "Bad" is not an argument and has no premise.

Im going to agree with Yog....

Just joined FW a few days ago as a precursor to our corp joining. This alt has about 3mil sp. I spent three hours yesterday just bouncing around complexes raking in LP. I was stabbed and no one could catch me. They warp in... I warp out... then come back later and still cash in. Pitiful style of play and completely exploitable. This is supposed to be a war, not a game of catch me if you can (but you can't so quit trying).

This really needs to change for offensive plexing. Rats should lock you and point you in small plexes and up (20k range). All plexes should shoot neutrals entering (its a warzone right?). Maybe put a few sentry's in the larger plexes as well. Turn on analyzers or codebreakers to flip the complex so you have to sit at 5k or less. Give the bunkers non-public timers. These are supposed to be military grade complexes for goodness sake. You get insta-popped by NPC's in HS if you turn on the wrong friggin module but in FW they surrender to an unfit frigate that never fires a shot. Seriously?

FW should not be something that rewards purely solo play in the higher plexes while in enemy space. Up the stakes here. These are immortal empires aren't they?

CCP... Look at this again... Minor changes here... just minor. Most of EvE is just broken atm. You have sooo much invested in the success of DUST and FW is going to be where it will shine. Give it some love to keep it alive.

FW is based on controlling/captruiing key points. If you hold a point and your enemy run you win. Is not fun as you nuked him, I know, but still you win and he loose.

Cloacking is not relevant in this: one cloacked do not affect the timer. And if want to evade fight will warp out anyway as someone approach the plex.

And the system works fine as framework promoting fights; you can check the stats and see how frontline FW system are generally in the most dangerous (for ships/pod destroyed) in New Eden.



Flipping system doesnt have to be hard nor easy, have to be balanced. More you make hard to flip a system more you advantage the militia with more numbers and better distribution on all the timezones.
Easyer capture advantage smaller militia, that can blitz when is better for them.

System harder to flip doesn't mean "is harder for me to loose it" means also "I can say goodbye to any chance to capture it back if I lose it".

Ok, since you insist.

1) Cloaky plexing ain't good, where have I said that? However, cloaky plexing is only a symptom of a wider problem which is the current plexing mechanics. If you had rollbacks, multiple spawns and adjusted NPC strenght cloaks would be a non-issue.

2) I did as did a lot of other people. I'd link my posts in other threads, but can't really be bothered looking for 'em.

3) Why would it be good? For starters, BB as is, is very boring. Prolonging that boredom is, well, not fun. Fruthermore, in the big picture of FW, one system flipped ain't really that much of a game breaker anyway. It takes about 15-20 minutes for a decently sized (15-20 guys) fleet to take down a bunker and those will usually be reported in intel channels so if you really want to fight em, there is time to try and organise something (sort of). The days of fast forwarding ihub bashes are gone as you don't see dreads or supers dropped on top of em too often any more (SOTF & Happy Endings left FW and ev0ke are so risk adverse they will probably have scouts 10 jumps out anyway). Again, it's not iHub HP's that affect sov in a bad way, its the ability of farmers to farm the way it's possible to do it atm.

4) Dunno, but one of the reasons might be the fact that every other structure is usually player built/owned and it's loss directly impacts someones wallet. Ihubs belong to noone and everyone in a faction and they never die, just flip sides.

I see where you are coming from, but I disagree. Yeah, you might be able to fly around and play those sorts of games - but the reason you are winning isn't because of a broken mechanic (Its a sandbox, remember?). You are winning, because people like the OP don't want to have to be bothered to stick around and defend what's theirs. Well, that's too bad. That's his choice to make. As easily as he makes the decision NOT to stick around, he can also make the decision to call in a few of his friends and hunt you down and bring the hurt every time he sees your name in system.

What are a couple of actions can the OP take in this sandbox, to address this issue on his own? I have a few of ideas:

1. He could take a bunch of his friends or random FW militia into the system and camp it and defend it. Its a war, remember?
2. He could make note of the pilots name and have his friends and cohorts engage in a grief.. "erm" program designed to discourage said type of "dishonourable" warfare tactics in faction warfare - Miner Bumping and Bot hunting ring any bells?
3. He could make use of the bounty system and take some of his funds and throw them at the guy and see if that doesn't work out.
4. If he doesn't want to use his own funds, he can use his charm and whit to start a "Defense Fund," where he facilitates the philanthropic tendencies of others to create a bounty "fund" for known farmers.

Of course, that would take a bit of imagination and initiative and that's just hard. (That should be read as - those who are unimaginitive, entitled, and lazy will not want to do any of this.) That goes for the rest of the OP's points. I forget her/his name right now, the person making all of the reasoned arguments agains the OP. I suggest the OP and those supporting his stance read what she has to say deliberatively.

Fly Dangerously and with a Vengeance!

- Kobalos