Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Because EVE is not WoW.

How WoW would look is exactly as relevant as how Tetris would look: not at all. They're different games designed for different gameplay.[/quote]


Yes. They are both online computer games that depend on customers to pay a monthly subscription fee because they enjoy playing. Making those customers happy should be the primary concern of the company selling the game.
Obviously, there are no similarities at all. You win.

True, Eve does need a well tanked mining ship, I'm not a miner but i thought the hulk could tank quite sexy?

…and why is that a problem?

Actually, like it or not, WoW is the most successful MMORPG in history, so it's mechanics are very relevant to EVE and most other MMORPGs.

Not really, no.

They're perhaps relevant if you want to make a game that works like WoW (which is a horribly bad idea, since that only means you lose to WoW). If you're making a different game such as, say, EVE, they're not particularly relevant any more.

…and they decided exactly that. That's why they designed a game where everyone PvPs all the time.
No. A sandbox means that you are not given a specific set of things to do, but rather that you are given tools and are then let free to do with them whatever you want.

Or, more accurately, it lets everyone do what they want, which includes screwing your plans up regardless of your wishes. So a sandbox pretty much inherently means that you have to contend with other players' activities and the way they interfere with yours.

EVE also has this interesting feature called the market, which drives everything in the game. It is what gives everything purpose and meaning. Everything you do feeds into or from that market. The market itself is 100% PvP (yes, even the parts where you sell to NPCs). You can't avoid the market, and as a result, you can't avoid the PvP.
…and competition is PvP. Other games might have narrowly defined PvP to just be combat, but EVE is not those games — here, PvP suffuses every last activity. It is impossible to avoid. And even if you just look at the combat parts, everything you do still feeds into that PvP due to the interconnectedness of all activities. What you do affects how fights are fought elsewhere, and due to the sandbox nature of the game, it follows that people who take part in those fights will want to stop you from generating those effects.
No, but it gives them the right to PvP you, by virtue of it being a sandbox. If you don't want to be PvP:ed, you need to stay out of the sandbox — it's the only way. And again, more importantly, due to the interconnected nature of the market, you cannot separate yourself from the PvP. You are always affecting it, and people need to be able to affect you back.

Yes, EVE is a sandbox — a multiplayer sandbox. By that very nature, it is all PvP. Even the parts you might believe are PvE.
Yes: CCP.

Not quite. Suicide ganking is just a different way to pay for aggression — the other being to wardec someone.

When you really boil things down, that is all highsec is: a place where aggression comes at a cost. People tend to want to make it out to be more than that, but that is really all there is to it. If you want to shoot someone, you have to either pay with your ship or your ISK. In most instances, this means that people stay away from shooting at each other because it's just not worth it, and that miserliness is what generates the fragile “security” of highsec.

…but on the other hand, since that is all that is keeping the peace, it should come as no surprise to anyone that people will occasionally open fire anyway — because it's fun, and the fun is worth it; because it yields loot, and the loot is worth it; because it yields bounty payments, and those are worth it; because they're sponsored, and the sponsors make it worth it; or (in particular with suicide ganks) because it hurts the enemy and his clandestine support structure, and hurting him (and it) is definitely worth it.
The problem is that, as history has shown, WoW is not a good example to try to emulate, because all that happens is that you make a poor copy of WoW, which means people chose WoW instead, and then you run out of customers really quickly.

The games that are around today and that have had any kind of longevity all have one thing in common: they do things differently. EVE has survived for as long as it has because it doesn't work the same as any other game — not in spite of it.

Agreed, if concord has to kill you, insurance and loot rights should not pay out.
No exploit should.

To include buying UBERTOONS from the character BAZZAR,
making them into a corp,
blowing a wad of plex on a fleet of Deathpods (dramiels or the pirate flav of teh month)
uber modules, cyberware, boosters, clones, and WAR DECLARATION FEES
yeah, a corp of PAY2WIN uber-toons, all with more than 3 years worth of skill points...
yeah, who do they go after?

Corps that are NOOB friendly and who's membership is 99% noob under one month in skill points.
Clearly, being WAR DEC'd needs to be restricted to corps that have more than a MATCHING minimum skill point total or *AGREED TO BY BOTH SIDES*!

GET REAL if you are in a ship designed for combat and you fly out into a astriod belt and kill someone for the thrill...you're just a sick person to start with.


and if you are breaking the law and warrant concord actions then you should not get insurance pay out or loot rights becuase you have done nothing to deserve it like go to low and null and PvP for real.

One word.

Terrorist.