Ships & Modules

I guess I'm a bit of an old schooler (re: bitter vet) but I'd like to say the steady phasing out of split weapons for minmatar is kind of disheartening. Yes they were usually putzy and inferior to single weapon type ships, and that IS a problem that needed to be fixed. I however am a bigger fan of improving the performance of split weapons instead of it's extinction.

My reason is that it's becoming homogenizing, imo anyways. Also it might have the reverse effect of simplifying the sp requirements of minmatar. I think a lot of people realize/agree that minmatar has for a long time, if not forever, been the hardest race to train for - they have ships that feel very restricted to armor, some to shield, some both. They are all very quick, which means good navigation to capitalize on. They usually have ample drone bays to accompany what used to be split weapons which meant drones, projectiles, and missile skills. They basically had to do everything. This does create a barrier for entry... but at the same time, you could be quite functional with some ships if you dedicated yourself to one end of the spectrum (hurricane with just guns, neuts and armor and you can do well in a rupture, tempest, rifter, etc) or you could be fine with guns and shield (stabber, cyclone, mael... ofc cyclone used to be a bit weak, but it's a victim of weapon layout - which could've been handled with some improved weapon bonuses). This may not make my case about being easier to train just yet, but I'm getting there.

Now what we have are some ships that are being redesigned as dedicated missile boats and largely removing any split weapons. It feels like to me that that just means focusing on one weapon type means you simply won't be flying the missile ships like the cyclone, and soon the claymore or typhoon (I might be forgetting others as well). However they haven't shied away from having highly flexible/variable tanking options. This is good though, I'd love to see it stay this way. You do occasionally see shield buffer or ASB amarr (eek) or gallente (meh) but they certainly don't compare to the variety minmatar has. This creates some variety in our little spaceship land. Neat.

So what I would hope to see instead of making dedicated missile boats/turrets it would be much more fun to see the weak 5%/7.5% split bonuses changed to something like 7.5%/10% or 10%/10% or what have you until it's dps is competitive with other ships of it's role and class. It creates some fun variation and flexibility. Some of you think it's disgusting - I'd like you to consider this: HAM/AC - you will have some very interesting damage application curves, within 20km you will be in deep falloff of your AC's but still have hams so you will have reliable damage, but not a lot. Within 10km you will hit quite comfortably with both and be able to tackle. Beyond 20km (ok I guess you could use javs to which are fine, but w/e) barrage will still allow you to poke at frigs as you try and run away. If your AC's aren't tracking a webbed drone for whatever reason your HAMs will do at least some damage and you can keep AC pressure on your target. Sure your ship will not be as particularly good at anyone thing, but it will however be far more versatile and give you a wider engagement envelope for fights. Furthermore what I was saying before, you will have more substantial weapon bonuses to a fewer guns which means if your skills are lacking in one weapon system you could forgo the latter and use those highs for utility like neuts/nos/smartbombs. This would make those ships less effective to some pilots, but at least still an option.

I think that's most of my case for now, I'm more than happy and willing to discuss the topic so please share you opinions guys!

I liked my Phoon with four plates and over 1k DPS from three different sources. I took pride when I could finally fly it-- but in the end, when was the last time I actually flew the thing?!?

Minmatar is still there in it's variety. Armor and shield. Missiles and projectiles. Utility high slots. A ship's role will be more obvious is all.

I would like to see the preservation of split weapons too, it might make me want to fly minmatar again, in the mean time Gallente all day

Nag actually looks a bit too good after this change. I know they're going to be doing a second pass... but DAYUM!

The old tristan used to be a decent split frig blasters and rockets.

As a mostly Minmatar and gallente pilot for roleplay reasons i hate using caldari weapons on my ships get rid of them please Minmatar should just be dirty oily projectiles.

Wait, what?

Split weapon ships only have one option. The most versatility is the Phoon which can choose between 5 torps 3 autos, 4/4, or 3/5. In what way is this going to catch anyone off guard?

Because missiles ARE a caldari weapon system. This is the the way it works...

Caldari weapon systems are comprised of 2 different elements, missiles and hybrid rails, focused more on missiles.
The gallente have drones and blaster hybrids, pretty evenly balanced use of the 2
Ammar have lasers, drones and rockets, with much more focus on lasers than the other 2
Aaaand then you have the minnies, whose weapons are based on projectiles, running away and being pansies

there's no way to make split bonuses NOT suck because if they increased anything you would just get a AC phoon with 3 large neuts doing competitive damage with other full turret battleships.

A gank phoon is just that, loads of guns and decent damage.

It is difficult to get the damage quite right, that's certainly true. Overtune the damage bonuses and it becomes overpowered, or we get what we have now: crap. One thing thats worth noting though, if you fit 1x gyro and 1x bcu you don't get any stacking penalties. However torps do so much more damage than projectiles that 2xbcu's gives you more damage on the phoon heh.

But your post is the reason I wanted to have this discussion. I think there are people out there that enjoy the idea of split weapons and would like to use them in properly balanced boats. CCP COULD do it, but it would be a chore to get it quite right. I don't like the excuse of "We're too lazy to check some numbers" to not maintaining the dynamic fitting strategy of EVE. AFAIK the only reason the nag is getting changed is because they are TOO LAZY TO FIX THE MODEL FOR 3 TURRETS. That's kinda really disappointing.

From a purely lore and role play perspective, missiles ARE the Caldari weapon system for reasons including, but not limited to the following;

"Of the meticulous craftsmanship the Caldari are renowned for, the Drake was born. It was found beneath such a ship to rely on anything other than the time-honored combat tradition of missile fire..."

The meticulous craftsmanship and time-honored traditions of the Caldari point towards missiles. I hear in a time long ago that missiles did full damage to all targets (no explosion radius or velocity stat) and that Ravens vaporized everything.

Then again, you have things like the outdated Evelopedia with entries on the "Piranha Light Missile," now called the Nova Light Missile, with the following description; "The Piranha is a tiny nuclear missile based on a classic Minmatar design that has been in use since the early days of the Minmatar Resistance."

Game mechanics don't necessarily agree with game lore however, and many none Caldari ships are bonused for missiles. It's completely reasonable to call missiles the Caldari weapon system, though.