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Why complain about High Sec but not SOV mechanics? An honest look at null bears.

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Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#101 - 2013-03-12 00:49:25 UTC
Sariah Kion wrote:
Andski wrote:
Sariah Kion wrote:
So if you all agree that "SOV sucks" and its the real driving reason for the stagnation of PVP why are you laying at the feet of high sec dwellers?


because the sov system isn't the real driving system for the stagnation of PvP but only a drop in an ocean of problems

one part of it is CCP's "everybody wins" philosophy that added nullsec levels of income potential to highsec, like incursions


Incursions were rebalanced.


and that joke of a rebalance was largely reversed and it killed off all non-hisec incursion running

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Sariah Kion
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#102 - 2013-03-12 00:50:58 UTC
Kane Alvo wrote:
There must be some truth coming from the OP because the Goonies turned out in force to ignite their flamethrowers on this one.

Funny how that works, isn't it?



When you hit close to home with an uncomfortable truth this is a good tell that you are right on the mark.

[b]Librarian and Exotic Dancer Extraordinaire Champion of the Working Men and Women of Empire Space Anti-Null Sec Opium Den Movement President[/b] Not the woman high sec wants but the Woman high sec needs. [u]A modern girl for a modern world.[/u]
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#103 - 2013-03-12 00:51:32 UTC
Kane Alvo wrote:
There must be some truth coming from the OP because the Goonies turned out in force to ignite their flamethrowers on this one.

Funny how that works, isn't it?


"~all four members of goonswarm are posting in this thread, it must be because the OP is right~"

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Zhade Lezte
#104 - 2013-03-12 01:01:05 UTC
We got tired of refuting the positions of ignorant people/NPC corp alts in the sov null improvement threads and decided we had about discussed what was broken about that system to death, moving on to relatively new discussions like improving null industry.

Sorry, I guess we should keep beating the years-old dead horse that is the dominion sov system to satisfy the whims of NPC corp alts?
Sentamon
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#105 - 2013-03-12 01:02:02 UTC
Oh look, once again we have the usual null crowd trying to convince everyone that null income sucks yet they're scared to do anything to risk their isk faucets and grip on power.

Keep trying, I'm sure you'll convince someone.

~ Professional Forum Alt  ~
Zhade Lezte
#106 - 2013-03-12 01:02:15 UTC
I mean seriously, broken for years.

Do you have anything to add to the discussion?
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#107 - 2013-03-12 01:03:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Andski
Sentamon wrote:
Oh look, once again we have the usual null crowd trying to convince everyone that null income sucks yet they're scared to do anything to risk their isk faucets and grip on power.

Keep trying, I'm sure you'll convince someone.


oh hey welcome to the thread, anything else you want to make up

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Zhade Lezte
#108 - 2013-03-12 01:03:49 UTC
Zhade Lezte wrote:
We got tired of refuting the positions of ignorant people/NPC corp alts in the sov null improvement threads


Sentamon wrote:
Oh look, once again we have the usual null crowd trying to convince everyone that null income sucks yet they're scared to do anything to risk their isk faucets and grip on power.

Keep trying, I'm sure you'll convince someone.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#109 - 2013-03-12 01:06:30 UTC
Andski wrote:
Kane Alvo wrote:
There must be some truth coming from the OP because the Goonies turned out in force to ignite their flamethrowers on this one.

Funny how that works, isn't it?

"~all four members of goonswarm are posting in this thread, it must be because the OP is right~"

Funny how that works, isn't it?

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Sariah Kion
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#110 - 2013-03-12 01:06:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Sariah Kion
Zhade Lezte wrote:
I mean seriously, broken for years.

Do you have anything to add to the discussion?


So why has the blame shifted to high sec as the cause of so many woes in null sec pvp?

If we all agree that the SOV mechanic is terrible and needs to change seems we should all work together to get it done. At that point. We can have an honest discourse and move to change/nerf high sec to bring it in line with the "NEW" null sec.

Im not opposed to change in high sec. Im opposed to change in high sec that only satisfies ulterior motives and is driven by greed and power.

[b]Librarian and Exotic Dancer Extraordinaire Champion of the Working Men and Women of Empire Space Anti-Null Sec Opium Den Movement President[/b] Not the woman high sec wants but the Woman high sec needs. [u]A modern girl for a modern world.[/u]
Frying Doom
#111 - 2013-03-12 01:13:42 UTC
Sariah Kion wrote:
Now that I have stirred some of the snakes with the truth...

Answer this question:

If you are truly looking for a better null sec and to draw players out into null sec why are you not at the forefront pushing for fundamental changes to SOV mechanics that would help break up the stagnant nature of SOV space?

You cant expect logical thinkers to believe that you are for the betterment of pvp and EVE when you only attack the mechanics of high sec and completely avoid the glaring issues in your own backyard.

Ok again 110+ page thread in GD

Just go backwards in the pages till you find it.

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#112 - 2013-03-12 01:14:09 UTC
Sariah Kion wrote:
Zhade Lezte wrote:
I mean seriously, broken for years.

Do you have anything to add to the discussion?


So why has the blame shifted to high sec as the cause of so many woes in null sec pvp?

If we all agree that the SOV mechanic is terrible and needs to change seems we should all work together to get it done. At that point. We can have an honest discourse and move to change/nerf high sec to bring it in line with the "NEW" null sec.

Im not opposed to change in high sec. Im opposed to change in high sec that only satisfies ulterior motives and is driven by greed and power.


because if nullseccers are funding their PvP through hisec alts instead of actually putting assets on the line in 0.0, there are less targets

less targets means less PvP

get it now or are you going to explain why it is necessary for hisec to essentially have welfare gameplay

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Frying Doom
#113 - 2013-03-12 01:14:28 UTC
Andski wrote:
Kane Alvo wrote:
There must be some truth coming from the OP because the Goonies turned out in force to ignite their flamethrowers on this one.

Funny how that works, isn't it?


"~all four members of goonswarm are posting in this thread, it must be because the OP is right~"

I think I am classed as a Goon alt now Lol

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#114 - 2013-03-12 01:16:52 UTC
Sariah Kion wrote:
School of Applied Knowledge

Stopped reading.
Sentamon
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#115 - 2013-03-12 01:18:45 UTC
Andski wrote:

because if nullseccers are funding their PvP through hisec alts instead of actually putting assets on the line in 0.0, there are less targets


You're deluded ... go back to recruiting. Maybe 10% still wasn't on your side.

~ Professional Forum Alt  ~
Sariah Kion
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#116 - 2013-03-12 01:18:52 UTC
Andski wrote:
Sariah Kion wrote:
Zhade Lezte wrote:
I mean seriously, broken for years.

Do you have anything to add to the discussion?


So why has the blame shifted to high sec as the cause of so many woes in null sec pvp?

If we all agree that the SOV mechanic is terrible and needs to change seems we should all work together to get it done. At that point. We can have an honest discourse and move to change/nerf high sec to bring it in line with the "NEW" null sec.

Im not opposed to change in high sec. Im opposed to change in high sec that only satisfies ulterior motives and is driven by greed and power.


because if nullseccers are funding their PvP through hisec alts instead of actually putting assets on the line in 0.0, there are less targets

less targets means less PvP

get it now or are you going to explain why it is necessary for hisec to essentially have welfare gameplay


"Welfare gameplay"

Think about that for a minute while looking at the mirror and taking a long look at the way SOV works.

The irony and hypocrisy is almost palpable.

[b]Librarian and Exotic Dancer Extraordinaire Champion of the Working Men and Women of Empire Space Anti-Null Sec Opium Den Movement President[/b] Not the woman high sec wants but the Woman high sec needs. [u]A modern girl for a modern world.[/u]
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#117 - 2013-03-12 01:21:12 UTC
Sariah Kion wrote:
"Welfare gameplay"

Think about that for a minute while looking at the mirror and taking a long look at the way SOV works.

The irony and hypocrisy is almost palpable.


think about what you just said there

that sovereignty, which costs money to keep and requires shitloads of effort to maintain, is welfare, unlike hisec, where everything is provided to you for free

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Sarah Schneider
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#118 - 2013-03-12 01:24:33 UTC
Sariah Kion wrote:
These null sec alliances whom have blued up 70% of SOV space love their empires filled with isk spigots attached to moons giving them enormous passively earned wealth.

When two of the largest nullsec bloc aren't even blue and constantly fighting each other. I'm curious as to where and how did you come up with this number.

Sariah Kion wrote:
They are not looking for "change" to better EVE, bring about more pvp or bring balance to the game as a whole, they are simply looking for more isk and power.

Stagnation was and is the prime cause for an alliance and coalition to failcascade. It is one of the biggest fear of any alliance. Why would we want that to happen? Nullsec players are different than hisec in this case and in a larger scheme. We don't treat isk as a way to get more isk, we want isk so we can provide ourselves with means to blow other people up.

"I'd rather have other players get shot by other players than not interacting with others" -CCP Soundwave
Sariah Kion
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#119 - 2013-03-12 01:26:12 UTC
Andski wrote:
Sariah Kion wrote:
"Welfare gameplay"

Think about that for a minute while looking at the mirror and taking a long look at the way SOV works.

The irony and hypocrisy is almost palpable.


think about what you just said there

that sovereignty, which costs money to keep and requires shitloads of effort to maintain, is welfare, unlike hisec, where everything is provided to you for free


I dont expect you to see the obvious irony and hypocrisy. If you did we would probably agree that changes need to come to SOV first and then trickle down through the other areas of the game.

1. Fix SOV. Break up the stagnant nature of pvp.
2. Gather data after changes.
3. Nerf or alter other areas to bring them inline with the new SOV Null based on hard data made after altering the linchpin issue (SOV).

It seems like the most prudent course of events to most logical thinkers. Not sure why some of you always skip to step 3. Wait...yes I do.

[b]Librarian and Exotic Dancer Extraordinaire Champion of the Working Men and Women of Empire Space Anti-Null Sec Opium Den Movement President[/b] Not the woman high sec wants but the Woman high sec needs. [u]A modern girl for a modern world.[/u]
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#120 - 2013-03-12 01:26:57 UTC
Sariah Kion wrote:
I dont expect you to see the obvious irony and hypocrisy. If you did we would probably agree that changes need to come to SOV first and then trickle down through the other areas of the game.

1. Fix SOV. Break up the stagnant nature of pvp.
2. Gather data after changes.
3. Nerf or alter other areas to bring them inline with the new SOV Null based on hard data made after altering the linchpin issue (SOV).

It seems like the most prudent course of events to most logical thinkers. Not sure why some of you always skip to step 3. Wait...yes I do.


i'm just laughing at you for pretending that hisec is anything but welfare land

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar