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Are alts required?
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Google Voices
Doomheim
#41 - 2013-02-15 17:46:37 UTC
Karada Delrae wrote:
I always assumed the point of eve was to work with other people, but I notice a lot talk about their alts. Like for hauling, or cyno alts trade alts etc.

Is this actually required to get total enjoyment out of the game? Is it not possible to just have one character and focus on it?

Do the majority of players have alts?



Everyone has Alts, even CCP. And they don't push the "Power of two" just for laughs, they have become dependent on selling alts to survive.

Unfortunately alts are a cancer in this game, and CCP can't see past the money. All you have to do is create a new character and join one of the npc corps.....200+ people, and not a sound to be heard....

It used to be that the NPC corps were full of live people, now 95% of the people are alts, and actual new players have to wonder if they smell bad when no one will answer his question......Shocked





"Fozzie could not comment on when this issue would be resolved and stated that “one day Veritas will come up to me and say ‘hey I fixed off-grid boosting’”, but he had no idea on a potential timeframe for this sort of miracle."
Ankles McGlashan
Doomheim
#42 - 2013-02-15 18:05:47 UTC
Google Voices wrote:
Karada Delrae wrote:
I always assumed the point of eve was to work with other people, but I notice a lot talk about their alts. Like for hauling, or cyno alts trade alts etc.

Is this actually required to get total enjoyment out of the game? Is it not possible to just have one character and focus on it?

Do the majority of players have alts?



Everyone has Alts, even CCP. And they don't push the "Power of two" just for laughs, they have become dependent on selling alts to survive.

Unfortunately alts are a cancer in this game, and CCP can't see past the money. All you have to do is create a new character and join one of the npc corps.....200+ people, and not a sound to be heard....

It used to be that the NPC corps were full of live people, now 95% of the people are alts, and actual new players have to wonder if they smell bad when no one will answer his question......Shocked


that's not always true, some of the starter NPC corps are very lively, CAS for example.

also since many of those will be toons on the same account and just trading alts or whatnot, it's not a money thing. we get three character slots with our accounts. if some people want to train two characters for PI then CCP doesn't see extra money. if someone is PLEXing a second account then that is due to someone paying good money for ISK, not for a second account. maybe the person farming ISK wouldn't buy a second account if PLEX didn't exist.

maybe some people have 2 subs they're getting charged for. I'd bet they have the 12 month plan if that were the case, which means the second account is 50% more money than one monthly account IIRC

I sort of agree that alts make certain aspects of the game feel broken though but I think just fixing those aspects of the game (like they did the bounty system) to be more 'alt proof' is probably better than logging in to a choice of which toon gets all the SP one day.
No Alibi
Sometimes Here
#43 - 2013-02-15 18:10:12 UTC
Arcaus Rotrau Romali wrote:
I know only one character can train skills per account, I assume that also means only one character per account can be logged in at a time so to be most useful you need a second account right?

Very useful if you like to mine. You could get to a point that you could PLEX the second acct. in a short time. Gives you lots of options to play with.

I fly by the seat of my pants, No wonder my ass is always on fire!
Nerf Burger
Doomheim
#44 - 2013-02-16 18:55:43 UTC
You will be at a major disadvantage not using them because everyone else does. EVE is so easy to operate that its basically giving the advantage of an additional player.
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#45 - 2013-02-16 19:11:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Mr Kidd
Karada Delrae wrote:
I always assumed the point of eve was to work with other people, but I notice a lot talk about their alts. Like for hauling, or cyno alts trade alts etc.

Is this actually required to get total enjoyment out of the game? Is it not possible to just have one character and focus on it?

Do the majority of players have alts?



Required, no. Makes game play in Eve easier, yes. Having an alt or 5 makes some things in Eve possible that otherwise would not be as a single character player.

Don't ban me, bro!
YuuKnow
The Scope
#46 - 2013-02-16 21:57:22 UTC
Karada Delrae wrote:
I always assumed the point of eve was to work with other people, but I notice a lot talk about their alts. Like for hauling, or cyno alts trade alts etc.

Is this actually required to get total enjoyment out of the game? Is it not possible to just have one character and focus on it?

Do the majority of players have alts?


I went the first 2 years of playing with only one account. Then I bought a 2nd account and it was a world of difference.

I've wondered however, if Eve didn't allow simultaneous clients. There would be less subscriptions obviously so CCP wouldn't bring in as much money, so they probably would never take the option away. You have to wonder how many true 'players" play eve and how much are just inflating the numbers with multiple accounts.

yk
Misunderstood Genius
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#47 - 2013-02-16 23:07:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Misunderstood Genius
There will be different opinions about alts in this game. Fact is: you are able to use alts/multiple accounts. So do it if you can afford it. Every discussion about NOT using/allowing alts is waste of time. Alts will change the game, make things more efficient, they give me new possibilities and tactics and most important for me: they will save me ISK and time. I can afford multiple accounts but I can't afford to live in a virtual space game for the rest of my life. Because I have responsibilities and a job to do in RL and I want fun in a game in my limited sparetime and not beeing stressed out by 16/7 nerds usually crying at those multi-boxers or meta-gamers because the are not easy to kill. I have my scout, my asset logistics, my trader, my carrier, my cyno. I am independend in the game. I do what I want to do. I take every chance for an advantage. Call it cheating. I don't care. I'll call it: surviving of the best prepared and fittest. OUT!
Orlacc
#48 - 2013-02-17 00:54:08 UTC
I fire up an alt when I have another half-ass plan to make billions.....

"Measure Twice, Cut Once."
EvEa Deva
Doomheim
#49 - 2013-02-17 01:21:14 UTC
Your alt = the only person you can trust, unless your crazy and shoot yourself.
Col Arran
Doomheim
#50 - 2013-02-17 01:25:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Col Arran
I once was asking the same question you are now and once I started a second account I can say with complete certainty if you want to have the best EVE experience get at least one alt. Col is my first and what I suppose you could call my "main" character, though I play all 4 accounts I have evenly.

Really there is nothing you "should" do with an alt but I can give you some recommendations. If you want to do PvP then a scanner alt would not be amiss, get someone in a cloaky covops with perfect scanning skills and your fleet will love you for it. PI alts are something everyone who lives in W-Space and null should have. Since I run 4 accounts I can have 12 characters and each one of those characters is skilled at least level IV on all PI skills. PI takes awhile to get set up but once you do it can supplement you with enough ISK to PLEX all the accounts you choose to run with almost no interaction on your part required. Best thing about PI is the more characters you throw at it the higher your ISK income becomes exponentially.

Another thing is in fact trading, I don't like it but I know one person in my corp who can make enough ISK to PLEX his account in a single day by grabbing a freighter load of items from one end of the galaxy and moving it to the other end and manipulating buy and sell orders. Personally I find it the most tedious thing ever but hey if that's your thing then go for it.

What I have my 4 "main" characters on each account training for is a fleet of RR battleships. This way I can run a 10/10 complex in null by myself and not have to wonder if there are people on in corp who have ships to run it with me. I also have all 4 trained into tech 1 logi so when we go on PvP roams I pretty much form my own logi chain and my own logi squad.

I actually have all 4 accounts training into carriers for my PvP-endgame, cross-fitting triage and all that. Since its easier for me to do it all myself than communicate with some guy on the triage cycles and whatnot. But that's me, I like alts because I don't want to have to rely on too many people for things and I'm of the mind it'll easier if I just do it myself.

However with that being said having 4 accounts makes me able to help out my corp-mates as well. If I, for instance, need to transport some things, well I have 4 accounts I might as well bring along corp mates things as well. Someone needs a spare logi for a PvP gang? Sure I've got an account to spare I'll send him over.

Its really hard to explain why 4 accounts is so amazing but honestly just go for it. If you sign up a trial account and get the free PLEX you can PLEX the trial and get a 51 day full account for 20$. If you don't like running multiple accounts well then it was 20$ you can make that in like 2 hours IRL at any job so its no major loss. But I almost guarantee you that you will not be able to go back to 1 account once you've had multiple.

EDIT: I see you're still in an NPC corp so I can assume you live in high security space. First make your own corp if you don't want to join someone else's. Then train a salvager alt and put it in your corp, run a few sites with your "maim" account bookmark the wrecks in corp bookmarks. Then send your salvgaer through to clean everything up while you still run other sites on your main account. This will make you much much more ISK since typically the salvage is worth about what the mission with bounty payouts is.

If you want to get really into it train that salvager into industry and manufacure rigs from all that salvage you're pulling in. Rigs make a lot of money especially Capacitor Control Circuits, Core Defense Field Extenders, Trimark Armor Pumps etc. If you make your own rigs from your salvage not only will you able able to rig any new ship you buy but turning salvage into rigs about doubles its value.


Shameless plug: If you're a newer player send an app into my corp and I can better explain the value of alts and give you some space in null to live in.
Liam Li
Kings.Guard.
#51 - 2013-02-17 02:30:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Liam Li
Inxentas Ultramar wrote:
Having a well developed main has the same effect IMO. I reckon dependence on one another is part if the game design and pretty much the developer's intent. I'd rather embrace those mechanics instead of using an alt. While valid points are being made and ships like JF/Carrier needs Cyno support, I'll simply not use those ships if I can't get that type of support from other players. Should that mean that I lose a ship when **** hits the fan, so be it. I can live with those risks.


Yet CCP has the "Power of 2/Start a sidekick" promotion.

Misunderstood Genius wrote:
There will be different opinions about alts in this game. Fact is: you are able to use alts/multiple accounts. So do it if you can afford it. Every discussion about NOT using/allowing alts is waste of time. Alts will change the game, make things more efficient, they give me new possibilities and tactics and most important for me: they will save me ISK and time. I can afford multiple accounts but I can't afford to live in a virtual space game for the rest of my life. Because I have responsibilities and a job to do in RL and I want fun in a game in my limited sparetime and not beeing stressed out by 16/7 nerds usually crying at those multi-boxers or meta-gamers because the are not easy to kill. I have my scout, my asset logistics, my trader, my carrier, my cyno. I am independend in the game. I do what I want to do. I take every chance for an advantage. Call it cheating. I don't care. I'll call it: surviving of the best prepared and fittest. OUT!


It's not cheating at all. You won't have to feel bad when you have to ask somebody for their time to light a cyno or scout for you because instead, you can already do all of that yourself, there is no way anybody can back-stab you and it creates a piece of mind.

"Did I do That"....Nice Corpse
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#52 - 2013-02-17 02:45:59 UTC
Liam Li wrote:
It's not cheating at all. You won't have to feel bad when you have to ask somebody for their time to light a cyno or scout for you because instead, you can already do all of that yourself, there is no way anybody can back-stab you and it creates a piece of mind.


It also means you can light cynos and be helpful to your friends.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
Vaju Enki
Secular Wisdom
#53 - 2013-02-17 02:46:21 UTC
No, alts are not required.

The Tears Must Flow
iskflakes
#54 - 2013-02-17 03:23:43 UTC
If you just want to faceroll in highsec then you don't need any, but to play the game seriously you need at least 3 accounts. Personally I have 21 characters on 9 accounts and all of them are important.

The game is setup in such a way that you NEED multiple accounts to do things in this game. E.g. if you want a supercap you need to put it on its own account. If you want more than 300 market orders you need a new character. If you want more than 10 production slots you need a new character. If you want to move a capital you need two or three cynos alts. Want to scout? Need an account for that. Want boosts? Need an account for that. Want a bait alt? Need an account for that. So if you want to PVP seriously you need at least 4-5 accounts.

-
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#55 - 2013-02-17 03:33:38 UTC
Quit Whining wrote:
Try moving capitals solo or owning a Super without any alts...


what kind of peasant moves his own cynos

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Mallak Azaria
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#56 - 2013-02-17 03:54:32 UTC
I love how as soon as a botter gets banned who happened to be well-respected, all these threads pop up calling for bans to multiboxing & alts.

This post was lovingly crafted by a member of the Goonwaffe Posting Cabal, proud member of the popular gay hookup site somethingawful.com, Spelling Bee, Grammar Gestapo & #1 Official Gevlon Goblin Fanclub member.
Karrl Tian
Doomheim
#57 - 2013-02-17 07:27:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Karrl Tian
Mallak Azaria wrote:
I love how as soon as a botter gets banned who happened to be well-respected, all these threads pop up calling for bans to multiboxing & alts.


I love how every exploit and "ruined forever" thread starts and ends with "I can just make an alt to do X."

---EVE online, the MMO for schizophrenics.
Liam Li
Kings.Guard.
#58 - 2013-02-17 15:54:39 UTC
iskflakes wrote:
If you just want to faceroll in highsec then you don't need any, but to play the game seriously you need at least 3 accounts. Personally I have 21 characters on 9 accounts and all of them are important.

The game is setup in such a way that you NEED multiple accounts to do things in this game. E.g. if you want a supercap you need to put it on its own account. If you want more than 300 market orders you need a new character. If you want more than 10 production slots you need a new character. If you want to move a capital you need two or three cynos alts. Want to scout? Need an account for that. Want boosts? Need an account for that. Want a bait alt? Need an account for that. So if you want to PVP seriously you need at least 4-5 accounts.


OP is taking this game at a casual playing level. Of course he could counter those argument by "asking his friends to put up market orders for him and not even bothering with capital ships"

RubyPorto wrote:


It also means you can light cynos and be helpful to your friends.


Oh yeah forgot to mention that good point.

"Did I do That"....Nice Corpse
Mayhaw Morgan
State War Academy
Caldari State
#59 - 2013-02-17 15:55:24 UTC
In a roleplaying game, we decide what kind of person we want to be. I think the three character slots per account are so that if we change our mind, we can save our progress and start working on being someone else immediately. We can switch from being one person to another and back, if, we can't decide. We can even alternate between those two choices and a third one, if we're a particularly indecisive person. (On the flip side, some of us already knew exactly who we wanted to be before we even started playing.)

But that's just my speculation. Nobody but those at CCP know the real answer, and after more than a decade, I would bet that even some of them have forgotten.

Are alts required? Of course not. Losing is always an option, in any game, and by any means. Lack of equipment, lack of players, lack of skill, bad luck, etc. are all reasons we might lose a game. I'm sure somewhere, at some time, some fool probably even lost a game on purpose. Maybe he did it because he wanted to make someone else happy or to find out what kind of person that other player really was.

Is using alts cheating? Theoretically, no. You could construct many scenarios where the use of your alts was fair. In actuality, of course it is cheating. They don't allow chess players to buy extra pieces and put them on the board when what they have currently is inadequate to "win" the game. They don't let poker players buy-in multiple hands of the same game, letalone combine those hands to win the pot. Sports games have no tolerance for extra players on the field. Is EVE Online different?

Why wouldn't you cheat to win if you could get away with it? I don't have alts, but, I don't have a problem with cheating, not even in real life. If you really need to win . . . you gotta do what you gotta do. Some of you object to the term "cheating", but that's probably because you just don't like to look at yourself as someone who wins by any means. Cheating has connotations that we are uncomfortable with, but that's who some of us have chosen to be and what we've chosen to do. If you don't like that choice, you could always log off, re-enter that character selection screen, and try again.
Annihilious
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#60 - 2013-02-17 19:47:22 UTC
I started my second account my second week in EVE. I know have six accounts and 9 toons. I do it because it makes me happy...