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James 315 - An Apology and an Appeal
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Lord Ovuld Feish
Doomheim
#421 - 2013-02-16 22:54:17 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Lord Ovuld Feish wrote:
Corey Fumimasa wrote:
Lord Ovuld Feish wrote:
I will give the New Order this; Eve is quite imbalanced at the moment.

But they are going about rebalancing it the wrong way.

The nullsec players have dug themselves into this pit they're in, and they're blaming EVERYONE but themselves.

I want to go to null. I want to lay eyes and lasers upon that ever-elusive Mercoxit. And I know every time I go searching, I'm putting a round in the chamber and giving it a spin.

But that's NOT highsec's fault.


The null seccers don't actually ask for much, they want more access to indy slots is about the only thing I hear them ask for. They do hate change for the sake of change and players who have never really been out of highsec asking for game changes that will make it easier to get into null. But honestly null is not in a "hole" and they are not all blue to one another.

As for mining mercoxit; hell yeah, thats an awesome goal. Learn evasion, learn to mine in lowsec, contact the CVA or go exploring the outer ring and have at it. Go in with some other guys and buy an ORCA sneak it into null, and mine fill it up. That would be a blast.

Before I even consider moving anything to mine it, first I have to find it, which is proving a challenge.

I was under the impression that no matter where you are; null, WH, wherever, Merc has to be scanned down, yes?


Mercoxit is a belt ore eg: http://evemaps.dotlan.net/system/ZDYA-G

Not in any null system I've been in. But I'm keeping up the search as best I can. My supply of cov op frigs are low at the moment.
Josef Djugashvilis
#422 - 2013-02-16 23:06:02 UTC
Lord Ovuld Feish wrote:
I disagree. I think there should be areas of New Eden where you can play your way without prowling dicks looking for more tears for a substandard blog.


There are, they are called 'stations'

This is not a signature.
Large Collidable Object
morons.
#423 - 2013-02-16 23:14:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Large Collidable Object
CCP will always support highsec botters who pretend to be people with a lot of accounts mining in highsec because it makes their game appear populated.
You know... [morons.](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gjOx65yD5A)
Lord Ovuld Feish
Doomheim
#424 - 2013-02-16 23:57:14 UTC
Large Collidable Object wrote:
CCP will always support highsec botters who pretend to be people with a lot of accounts mining in highsec because it makes their game appear populated.

Pretty much. Eve is the only game I've seen that actively advertises alternate accounts.
Degren
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#425 - 2013-02-17 00:12:03 UTC
Soooooooo many people bitching about a long post because it involves the name James 315.

It was well written and cogent. **** Trammel.

Hello, hello again.
Align Planet1
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#426 - 2013-02-17 00:36:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Align Planet1
Stalking horse joins beloved RvB, posts James 315 proxy-manifesto a few days later. Result: 22 pages of platform rhetoric.

Well-played, Candidate 315.
TheGunslinger42
All Web Investigations
#427 - 2013-02-17 09:53:32 UTC  |  Edited by: TheGunslinger42
Lord Ovuld Feish wrote:
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
Lord Ovuld Feish wrote:

*ahem*

SANDBOX.

Meaning multiple styles of play, including solo ones.


Sandbox means that you can try and play solo, it doesn't mean we have to let you.

Indeed. And being forced to interact is something that needs to change.


In one breath you praise the sandbox and the ability to support multiple playstyles, and in the next you basically say the sandbox should be drastically shrank and different playstyles be made impossible

you must be trolling at this point

Anyway, you simply cannot have a playstyle in EVE in which you are completely separated from everyone else. That simply is impossible due to the nature of the economy and being on a single shard. You can't just say "ahem, sandbox" in response to that, that's dumb. It is impossible to be isolated from everyone else. If you desire that kind of isolation, you have to understand that it means throwing out core concepts and mechanics, otherwise you'd end up with an extremely broken game.

If you could mine or run missions without the possibility for other players to interact with you, but you could still use the isk you make to buy player manufactured goods on the player driven market, or if you could put your minerals and manufactured goods onto the market... don't you see how that would utterly destroy the economy? You can't have a one way street when it comes to affecting the universe. You affect it, so it has to be able to affect you.

But if you want to have an area where you can mine and mission run but NOT be able to access the market or anything else, then good for you. Hop on the test server and go wild.
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#428 - 2013-02-17 09:58:18 UTC
Lord Ovuld Feish wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
Lord Ovuld Feish wrote:

Before I even consider moving anything to mine it, first I have to find it, which is proving a challenge.

I was under the impression that no matter where you are; null, WH, wherever, Merc has to be scanned down, yes?


Mercoxit is a belt ore eg: http://evemaps.dotlan.net/system/ZDYA-G

Not in any null system I've been in. But I'm keeping up the search as best I can. My supply of cov op frigs are low at the moment
Before Dominion mercoxit and ABC ore could only be found in a small handful of belts. Most of null (that bothered with industry) actually imported high end minerals from drone regions via highsec.

http://evemaps.dotlan.net/map/Catch#class <- I5 = arkonor, <- I6, I7 = ABC + mercoxit belts
Corey Fumimasa
CFM Salvage
#429 - 2013-02-17 11:28:26 UTC
Large Collidable Object wrote:
CCP will always support highsec botters who pretend to be people with a lot of accounts mining in highsec because it makes their game appear populated.

This has not been my experience: The ISD's actively discourage the practice when it comes up on help chat, bot reporting petitions are handled very quickly, and CCP hired CCP Sreegs. I think their commitment to eradication actual botters is well documented.
Eniarc
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#430 - 2013-02-19 11:53:50 UTC
Vaeliel wrote:
Part 6

He chooses to present these things the way he does because frankly, if he wrote like I am now (srs bizniss) nobody would read it and he'd be dismissed as a fanatic. It's another dimension of the plan: expose as many people as possible to the truth regardless of how he has to dress it up. The content of the message is far more important than the wrapping in this. He believes he can't afford to take a chance that it won't be read and seen.

His use of the New Order and emergent gameplay to achieve an audience for his message was not at first clear to me. Now that I get it, I'm honestly not convinced all of the members of the New Order realize what they're a part of. To a lot of them, it's having fun and playing the game in a way that wasn't expected. They're in it, as they say, for the lulz. To James 315, they are literally exposing people to the message he's been trying to send to the Eve community for (again) a year now. The lulz get attention, so that's how he dresses the message.

I'm not saying he's not enjoying what he's doing. I'm saying that's secondary to his overall goal.

The next phase of his plan is now to achieve a seat on the CSM so that he can bring his message directly to CCP. He has a following, he has effectively polarized the playerbase, and now it's time to up the ante even further. I don't know if this is the culmination of his plans or just the next step, I don't think I understand his goals and his methods enough to say.

I want to talk about James' CSM platform a little, and then I'll end this mammoth thing.

If you've read it, it's radical and downright absurd. However, look at it again with the knowledge that this is a phase in an overall plan that he has been carrying out with laser focus. As you read it, put it in the context of what I've just shown you: James does not just "say" things. He uses words and actions as vehicles for messages. Because of this, I have to assume that his CSM platform, as stated, is actually formulated to have an effect rather than to be taken literally. The words are the wrapper for the message, not the message itself. I get the gist of it; he doesn't believe he'll accomplish what he's saying but he knows that the direction CCP is going needs to be changed and quickly. Presenting radical ideas may be the most efficient way to change that.

So James, I'm sorry. In a post some weeks ago I explained my position that the Code was a framework for trolling miners. I now see the full picture of what you're trying to accomplish. I hope everyone else does before Trammel comes to Eve.

Thank you.


Very good... space it out. You can attempt to delude people with a hint of apparent intel by carefully typing away.. a small book's worth.. but, the adept of mind, unlike yourself and james, will ponder, only briefly. Little mind, slick tongue. Your future is secure... as you already know..! $50 ;)
Lapine Davion
Outer Ring Applied Logistics
#431 - 2013-02-19 11:57:24 UTC
Eniarc wrote:


Very good... space it out. You can attempt to delude people with a hint of apparent intel by carefully typing away.. a small book's worth.. but, the adept of mind, unlike yourself and james, will ponder, only briefly. Little mind, slick tongue. Your future is secure... as you already know..! $50 ;)


I feel like I wish this made sense, and for some reason I am also glad that it is just gibberish.

[b]Don't worry about posting with your main!  Post with your brain! "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."[/b]
Sarador Adonaj
Doomheim
#432 - 2013-02-19 12:09:47 UTC
Funny how all of what James does seems to go away from "Carebear'ing without risk" towards "PvP'ing without risk".
TheGunslinger42
All Web Investigations
#433 - 2013-02-19 12:26:25 UTC
Sarador Adonaj wrote:
Funny how all of what James does seems to go away from "Carebear'ing without risk" towards "PvP'ing without risk".


The only thing that's funny human stupidity. For example, thinking the New Orders activities in highsec are "without risk" when it's guaranteed that concord will blow you up if you fire upon someone first, and the other person is free to fight back, and will have kill rights, and can war dec you, and ... etc
Herr Wilkus
Aggressive Salvage Services LLC
#434 - 2013-02-24 02:11:52 UTC
Sarador Adonaj wrote:
Funny how all of what James does seems to go away from "Carebear'ing without risk" towards "PvP'ing without risk".


I wish people would make up their mind. Is Suicide Ganking miners PVP or not PVP? That is the question.
Ustrello
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#435 - 2013-02-24 02:19:41 UTC
Herr Wilkus wrote:
Sarador Adonaj wrote:
Funny how all of what James does seems to go away from "Carebear'ing without risk" towards "PvP'ing without risk".


I wish people would make up their mind. Is Suicide Ganking miners PVP or not PVP? That is the question.


They are killing a player so yeah pvp
Corey Fumimasa
CFM Salvage
#436 - 2013-02-24 04:06:32 UTC
Ustrello wrote:
Herr Wilkus wrote:
Sarador Adonaj wrote:
Funny how all of what James does seems to go away from "Carebear'ing without risk" towards "PvP'ing without risk".


I wish people would make up their mind. Is Suicide Ganking miners PVP or not PVP? That is the question.


They are killing a player so yeah pvp

Ahhh, but is the miner bot bear really a player?
Ris Dnalor
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#437 - 2013-02-24 07:33:27 UTC
Vaeliel wrote:
...
So James, I'm sorry. In a post some weeks ago I explained my position that the Code was a framework for trolling miners. I now see the full picture of what you're trying to accomplish. I hope everyone else does before Trammel comes to Eve.

Thank you.



I was there when Trammel came to UO. I see some parallels as well, and hope that we never see Trammel here.

However,

There is a fundamental difference between the changes in UO and the changes happening in EvE.

in UO, Trammell was a 2nd world mirroring Felluca and was a carebear paradise. Being a mirror, meant everything that could be had in fel ( aside from non-consentual pvp ) could also be had in Trammel.

High sec, low sec, and null sec in eve are different. They provide different opportunities. CCP is looking to add more value to entering low sec with tag-harvesting tied into security status reduction, among many others.

Hi sec is not yet completely safe, and if one day it became completely safe, well, that would be extremely sad, however, those people will not be able to experience everything that eve has to offer, while remaining in the confines of hi-sec --- whereas in UO they could experience everthing that Felluca had to offer.

That being said, I think it's important to have a raging pvp-er on the CSM, to make CCP think twice about any further changes in the direction of Trammel, and whenever teh CSM elections occur, I always look for the folks that embrace non-consentual pvp, and they get my votes.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=118961

EvE = Everybody Vs. Everybody

  • Qolde
Shao Huang
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#438 - 2013-04-18 23:20:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Shao Huang
Most likely based on some irredeemable character flaw I read this entire thread. The OP strikes me as a cogent, though not particularly elegant, case study. The heart of the argument is that the James 315 action, regardless of attributed or actual motive, is an attempt at contextual (meta game) intervention. After reading this thing I went and read collateral material. (Did I mention it is probably an irredeemable character flaw?). Based on that reading I think the premise of the OP is accurate and that the intervention though ostensibly about the pewpew-carebear debate is not exactly about that at all. It is also amusingly grandiose and contains several delightful 'logic traps'. This ability for players to enact such meta game content is one of the most attractive aspects of this game to me, about which i still understand almost nothing. Whether and how it succeeds, or even what the conditions for 'success' might be I cannot begin to entertain. At the very least I am sure it has provided James 315 (and ideological devotess who may or may mot actually fully understand the nature of the intended intervention or conditions of success) with a fair amount of amusement and enjoyment over its course. That said in terms of delivery I might suggest in future posting an 'executive summary' containing such a premise and link to the 'white paper'?

Edit: Both for readers and for the OP the sense of Apology used here is more consistent with the Socratic use of the word and therefore does not have to actually contain the words 'I am sorry'.

Private sig. Do not read.
Sundiata Arran
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#439 - 2013-04-18 23:56:49 UTC
Snore.
Rebecha Pucontis
Doomheim
#440 - 2013-04-19 02:44:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Rebecha Pucontis
I actually read the whole of the OP's opening 6 posts and found it very interesting, and the OP, and James make a good point. But then I had to laugh at all the illiterate eve players commenting straight afterwards with the standard cheesy one liners. I guess reading is hard for most people.

I played UO from the beginning also. Luckily I must have missed all the Trammel stuff as I don't remember it. I played an even more boring game called anarchy online instead, thought it was better because it was 3D but just turned out to be a grind fest.

Then I had a look back at UO a year or two later and decided not to bother going back to it as it looked completely dated. Although I remember there was going to be a UO 3D game which I was waiting for, but I think it got cancelled in the end.

But basically, Eve is the only MMORPG which is pvp centric, if it loses that niche then it is definitely dead, and I am sure the devs would know that also.