These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

LVL 4 missions in high still....

Author
Mike Voidstar
Voidstar Free Flight Foundation
#61 - 2013-02-15 15:38:21 UTC
And what if your next mission is Recon or some thing silly that's mostly just running around for 10-15 minutes. Did your agent give you a mission 5 jumps away? You can get ticks like this, but not often in Highsec missions, and it would rarely average out as high as you seem to think. I've done it a couple of times, but it's a rare event.
Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#62 - 2013-02-15 16:12:35 UTC
Kusum Fawn wrote:
Tauranon wrote:


ie 70mil / hr peak rate including LP, 40mil/hr average rate including LP



oh is it maths time? when did you accept the mission?
when did you start the mission?
what was the total payout of the mission?

I can also link the last three ticks that come into my wallet but that doesnt mean it took that long to finish what it was that made that isk tick happen


I've bolded my claims more clearly for you. I gave you an example of my peak rate with a t1 battleship - 70mil isk/hr effective. I claimed I average 40mil/isk hr, which last time I checked was conservative.

2013.02.15 15:52:04 Bounty Prizes 14,591,250.00 ISK

will happen at some point every day - this was in the drone standings mission that I've never done before - and would have fitted differently for had I had prior experience with it.
Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#63 - 2013-02-15 16:14:45 UTC
Mike Voidstar wrote:
And what if your next mission is Recon or some thing silly that's mostly just running around for 10-15 minutes. Did your agent give you a mission 5 jumps away? You can get ticks like this, but not often in Highsec missions, and it would rarely average out as high as you seem to think. I've done it a couple of times, but it's a rare event.


Serpentis recon 1 loads ~12mil in 10 minutes if you chill out and shoot the battleships. Which I do.

If the mission is particularly crap, I will reject it, which appears to influence the agent into not giving it to you very much too.

Kirimeena D'Zbrkesbris
Republic Military Tax Avoiders
#64 - 2013-02-15 16:20:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Kirimeena D'Zbrkesbris
Mike Voidstar wrote:
And what if your next mission is Recon or some thing silly that's mostly just running around for 10-15 minutes. Did your agent give you a mission 5 jumps away? You can get ticks like this, but not often in Highsec missions, and it would rarely average out as high as you seem to think. I've done it a couple of times, but it's a rare event.

Recon is a perfect example of how Missions should be run: Angel's Recon(1) - is 10min(max) (pun not intended) for 10mil bounties and 2 other recons are 5-7min to complete. So you have 15mil of bounties + rewards for 15min of your time + lots of LP.

Opinions are like assholes. Everybody got one and everyone thinks everyone else's stinks.

Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#65 - 2013-02-15 16:42:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Tauranon
Quintessen wrote:


My general experience is they're not all like this though.

And please post your fit (or at least your ship and major modules). People keep claiming stuff like this, but provide little if any evidence that it's just that easy to get into.


reject the terrible missions - you get a free reject every 4 hours, and if you are playing shorter sessions, then you can reject a higher proportion, and you can occasionally eat the penalty if its a run of terrible missions.

dominix L4 - blood

[high]
5x 350mm railgun II (caldari navy antimatter charge L)
1x drone link aug II

[mid]
2x omni tracking link II
2x tracking comp II. For other races, 2x sebo, or 2x mag eccm II, for generic missions 1x sebo, 1x tracking comp II.
1x medium electrochemical capacitor booster (cap 800)

[low]
1x large armor rep II
2x em hardener II - For other races rat specific
2x thermic hardener II - For other races rat specific
2x drone damage augmenter II

[rigs]
1 x large hybrid burst aerator
1 x large hybrid collision accelerator
empty rig slot (no calibration)

[drones]
5x garde II
5x curator II
5x hobgob II
(spare space - mine has a flight of hammers rarely used).

998 dps @ 27km, garde IIs
735 dps @ 75km (navy iridium L, curator IIs) - (bear in mind - does theory damage on all targets at this range).

typical tank ~450 rat specific - little higher on bloods

1x 5% cap regen implant
1x 5% armor rep amount implant
1x 5% turret tracking implant.

I also have a shield navy domi that shoots ~1200 dps at 45km - but haven't carted that over to amarr space - didn't think it would deal with em damage too well.
Quintessen
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#66 - 2013-02-15 18:22:28 UTC
Tauranon wrote:
Quintessen wrote:


My general experience is they're not all like this though.

And please post your fit (or at least your ship and major modules). People keep claiming stuff like this, but provide little if any evidence that it's just that easy to get into.


reject the terrible missions - you get a free reject every 4 hours, and if you are playing shorter sessions, then you can reject a higher proportion, and you can occasionally eat the penalty if its a run of terrible missions.

dominix L4 - blood

[high]
5x 350mm railgun II (caldari navy antimatter charge L)
1x drone link aug II

[mid]
2x omni tracking link II
2x tracking comp II. For other races, 2x sebo, or 2x mag eccm II, for generic missions 1x sebo, 1x tracking comp II.
1x medium electrochemical capacitor booster (cap 800)

[low]
1x large armor rep II
2x em hardener II - For other races rat specific
2x thermic hardener II - For other races rat specific
2x drone damage augmenter II

[rigs]
1 x large hybrid burst aerator
1 x large hybrid collision accelerator
empty rig slot (no calibration)

[drones]
5x garde II
5x curator II
5x hobgob II
(spare space - mine has a flight of hammers rarely used).

998 dps @ 27km, garde IIs
735 dps @ 75km (navy iridium L, curator IIs) - (bear in mind - does theory damage on all targets at this range).

typical tank ~450 rat specific - little higher on bloods

1x 5% cap regen implant
1x 5% armor rep amount implant
1x 5% turret tracking implant.

I also have a shield navy domi that shoots ~1200 dps at 45km - but haven't carted that over to amarr space - didn't think it would deal with em damage too well.


Yeah I'm still months away from something like that. That also requires about 400M in implants alone. While it would eventually be paid for, you're talking to close to 1B investment which firmly places it a bit later in character progress. And while I accept that boat like this would rake in the money (even as it spends a non-trivial amount on ammo/boosters) we're still talking about something not really in the reach of anyone less than two years old unless they went straight for it.
Mike Voidstar
Voidstar Free Flight Foundation
#67 - 2013-02-15 20:59:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Mike Voidstar
Not to mention it's a Dominix, which means drones, which are extreemly unreliable as a weapon system in PVE now due to the occasional case of insane munchies the rats get. This is why I fly a Kronos now, because the Dominix got to be too much of a hassle to use.

That setup is pretty much what I used minus the sentries and I went for CCC rigs to be able to be more stable with the rep, and I got very similar DPS out of it. I didn't make anything approaching an average of 70 million an hour though. When Retribution went live, my ISK dropped through the floor, it took me almost a month to save up for the Kronos---according to your numbers, I should have been able to do it that first Weekend with ease.

I would not consider myself to be average, though I rarely attempt to min/max for ISK. When I do, I can pull down about 50/mill in an hour, assuming I spend time stageing ammo, and it's not a pace I can sustain. Eventually either turned down mission timers, drone/ammo replacement, or other factors like some guy from TEARS coming through to take my mission objectives will take that peak rate and more than halve it for a 2 or 3 hour game session.
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#68 - 2013-02-16 00:38:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Daichi Yamato
Tauranon wrote:


lol 800 dps faction mission boats.

2013.02.14 13:49:04 Bounty Prizes 13,293,750.00 ISK
2013.02.14 13:44:51 Agent Mission Time Bonus Reward 2,700,000.00 ISK
2013.02.14 13:44:51 Agent Mission Reward 2,410,000.00 ISK

Thats 18mil shot in 15 minutes (as you can see I was back in station 5 minutes before the tick ended), with a t2 fit, tier1, tech1 battleship, out of region ( bloods vs regular dominix), without bothering to loot or salvage.

ie 70mil / hr peak rate including LP, 40mil/hr average rate including LP - I would expect a 5 hour binge to net at least 185mil after faction ammo, and I'd expect there are people out there who blitz properly who can do at least twice what I do.


like i said, ppl get a little holier than thou when it comes to the money they make running level 4 missions. very few missions actually pay out 5 mil just from rewards so it was likely a tougher mission with higher bountied rats and from a faction that pays better than average bounties.

also note the inclusion of LP's in his isk/hour blox. Roll

edit- i wasnt even saying that i made that much. suddenly pissing contest lol

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs

Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#69 - 2013-02-16 02:14:48 UTC
Mike Voidstar wrote:
Not to mention it's a Dominix, which means drones, which are extreemly unreliable as a weapon system in PVE now due to the occasional case of insane munchies the rats get. This is why I fly a Kronos now, because the Dominix got to be too much of a hassle to use.


aggro is much rarer on sentries, and since sentries are instant on - you blap the frigates when you arrive at the pocket. it is usual for me to not bay the sentries for the entire pocket, beyond perhaps a switch to gardes if I'm getting too close for the racial sentries. Missions respond a lot to you managing tracking, ewar and triggers with who you shoot, both in terms of completion and whether or not your tank will be stretched - I play to keep the dps minimised on my weak tank a lot.

Quote:


That setup is pretty much what I used minus the sentries and I went for CCC rigs to be able to be more stable with the rep, and I got very similar DPS out of it. I didn't make anything approaching an average of 70 million an hour though. When Retribution went live, my ISK dropped through the floor, it took me almost a month to save up for the Kronos---according to your numbers, I should have been able to do it that first Weekend with ease.



sentries are instant on - if you were using heavies, your effective dps is ruined by travel time, likewise you'll let everything fly 10km closer whilst your heavies fly to them, which negatively influences your railgun tracking. I found them seductive when I first started because they are one of the lowest skilled weapons that will crack an npc battleship tank, but they were always a dead end due to long periods at 0 dps.

cap stable is also a dead end, if I'm making 10mil isk more an hour than you, then I can pay to replace the dominix in 13 - 14 hours and not be behind, and realistically even thinly tanked mission boats have survivals of hundreds of hours or never die.

Quote:


I would not consider myself to be average, though I rarely attempt to min/max for ISK. When I do, I can pull down about 50/mill in an hour, assuming I spend time stageing ammo, and it's not a pace I can sustain. Eventually either turned down mission timers, drone/ammo replacement, or other factors like some guy from TEARS coming through to take my mission objectives will take that peak rate and more than halve it for a 2 or 3 hour game session.


A single iteron IV load will cart a month of ammo + some spare drones.
Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#70 - 2013-02-16 02:25:28 UTC
Daichi Yamato wrote:


like i said, ppl get a little holier than thou when it comes to the money they make running level 4 missions. very few missions actually pay out 5 mil just from rewards so it was likely a tougher mission with higher bountied rats and from a faction that pays better than average bounties.

also note the inclusion of LP's in his isk/hour blox. Roll

edit- i wasnt even saying that i made that much. suddenly pissing contest lol


ahh you cannot ignore LPs in your isk/hr if attempting to discuss missioning. Bear in mind that people who blitz, focus deliberately on LP, and pull down far more LP/hr than I do, and make far more money than I do.

its not a pissing contest anyway - if you are going to have a discussion about level 4s, you must include reasonable play, as well as optimal play. I only ever function at a "reasonable" play level because I don't enjoy the optimal play method.
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#71 - 2013-02-16 03:33:45 UTC
Tauranon wrote:


ahh you cannot ignore LPs in your isk/hr if attempting to discuss missioning. Bear in mind that people who blitz, focus deliberately on LP, and pull down far more LP/hr than I do, and make far more money than I do.

its not a pissing contest anyway - if you are going to have a discussion about level 4s, you must include reasonable play, as well as optimal play. I only ever function at a "reasonable" play level because I don't enjoy the optimal play method.


already said, ur LP's do not transfer into isk directly and instantly. everytime someone tries to factor it into their isk/hour, they try to attribute an isk value to each LP and then convert their LP/hour into isk/hour...even tho it takes time to acquire enough LP's to buy items and then more time to sell the items. And then it may not always be sold for a decent price.

and of course ppl try to convert loot into isk/hour as well. even tho they don't sell it at estimated price they quote.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs

Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
#72 - 2013-02-16 04:07:50 UTC
As it stands, uninterrupted highsec mining can make you more ISK/hr than L4 missions, if your skills are good.

Mining. Really?
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#73 - 2013-02-16 10:13:17 UTC
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:
As it stands, uninterrupted highsec mining can make you more ISK/hr than L4 missions, if your skills are good.

Mining. Really?


if u have several alts doing it it can yeah.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs