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Intergalactic Summit

 
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A Declaration on Faith and Hope
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Seriphyn Inhonores
Elusenian Cooperative
#21 - 2013-02-05 18:07:54 UTC
They probably nabbed him because, you know...he's a quite darker than actual Caldari.
Marcus Horalen
Doomheim
#22 - 2013-02-05 18:13:45 UTC
Seriphyn Inhonores wrote:
They probably nabbed him because, you know...he's a quite darker than actual Caldari.

"Among those taken into custody was the lead speaker at the rally, State citizen and Revenent Defence Corporation employee Korbin “Korsavius” Lavius, who was apparently released without charge soon after."[1]

If you are suggesting that Mr. Lavius is a nationality other than Caldari, I do believe you should provide evidence to such an accusation.

 @MHoralen
Seriphyn Inhonores
Elusenian Cooperative
#23 - 2013-02-05 18:17:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Seriphyn Inhonores
Oh, I'm not accusing anyone. He's quite a dark-skinned chap. He also wears Minmatar tattoos on his face, which I would argue is just a bit offensive to the whole "Do as the locals do" culture of the State. Maybe if he respected the Caldari culture he would take those tattoos off his face.

More to the point, I know a few heads of government in the Federation who were assassinated because the colour of their skin was in opposition to who they actually represented.

Also, it was supposed to be a joke. Especially that he's been released and is generally OK.
Grideris
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#24 - 2013-02-05 18:59:28 UTC
Alizabeth Vea wrote:
I find myself endorsing . . . I-RED? Cripes. I need a drink . . . or seven


Keep the bottle out. Hopefully we'll soon be able to drink to Heth's downfall.

http://www.dust514.org - the unofficial forum for everything DUST 514 http://www.dust514base.com -** the** blog site with everything else DUST 514 you need
Tiberious Thessalonia
True Slave Foundations
#25 - 2013-02-05 19:02:41 UTC
Grideris wrote:
Alizabeth Vea wrote:
I find myself endorsing . . . I-RED? Cripes. I need a drink . . . or seven


Keep the bottle out. Hopefully we'll soon be able to drink to Heth's downfall.


I thought you were CONCORD loyal, or are you now a federation loyalist?
Scherezad
Revenent Defence Corperation
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
#26 - 2013-02-05 19:03:11 UTC
Seriphyn Inhonores wrote:
They probably nabbed him because, you know...he's a quite darker than actual Caldari.


This is a deeply offensive statement. Please don't joke about my people being bigots.
Anslo
Scope Works
#27 - 2013-02-05 19:09:12 UTC
Tiberious Thessalonia wrote:
Grideris wrote:
Alizabeth Vea wrote:
I find myself endorsing . . . I-RED? Cripes. I need a drink . . . or seven


Keep the bottle out. Hopefully we'll soon be able to drink to Heth's downfall.


I thought you were CONCORD loyal, or are you now a federation loyalist?


You don't have to be a Fed to dislike Heth or see him as a few screws short of a solid piece or armor plating...

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
Grideris
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#28 - 2013-02-05 19:14:33 UTC
Anslo wrote:
Tiberious Thessalonia wrote:
Grideris wrote:
Alizabeth Vea wrote:
I find myself endorsing . . . I-RED? Cripes. I need a drink . . . or seven


Keep the bottle out. Hopefully we'll soon be able to drink to Heth's downfall.


I thought you were CONCORD loyal, or are you now a federation loyalist?


You don't have to be a Fed to dislike Heth or see him as a few screws short of a solid piece of armor plating...


And you don't have to dislike the Caldari State as a whole to dislike Heth or the Provists. I would like to see Heth go, but the State stay. Is that too hard to grasp?

http://www.dust514.org - the unofficial forum for everything DUST 514 http://www.dust514base.com -** the** blog site with everything else DUST 514 you need
Tiberious Thessalonia
True Slave Foundations
#29 - 2013-02-05 19:33:15 UTC
One would think that if one were attempting to represent themselves as a CONCORD loyalist then one would, in fact, work to maintain an air of neutrality as regards the specific policies and leadership of CONCORD signatory nations. There is that whole issue of the CONCORD nations wishing to maintain sovereignty, after all.

Or do you think it appropriate that CONCORD should begin telling its member nations how to conduct their affairs? Who gets to head them? What laws they put in place? I rather think that is slightly outside of the purview of CONCORD as it was originally envisioned. Has this changed? Have the four princes been put into their place, and the true king raises his head once again?
Anslo
Scope Works
#30 - 2013-02-05 19:39:51 UTC
Tiberious Thessalonia wrote:
One would think that if one were attempting to represent themselves as a CONCORD loyalist then one would, in fact, work to maintain an air of neutrality as regards the specific policies and leadership of CONCORD signatory nations. There is that whole issue of the CONCORD nations wishing to maintain sovereignty, after all.


And sometimes your neutrality must be shifted in light of major evidence to shake up that neutrality. Besides, he may be a CONCORD loyalist, but he isn't a decision maker IN CONCORD. He's allowed his opinion while maintaining his professional neutrality.

He can say Heth should be shot, but not make a single move to actually act out and shoot him or any Caldari ship obeying the law per CONCORD neutrality.

Quote:
Or do you think it appropriate that CONCORD should begin telling its member nations how to conduct their affairs? Who gets to head them? What laws they put in place? I rather think that is slightly outside of the purview of CONCORD as it was originally envisioned. Has this changed? Have the four princes been put into their place, and the true king raises his head once again?


That's seriously a jump of logic there Tibs...

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
Tiberious Thessalonia
True Slave Foundations
#31 - 2013-02-05 19:48:08 UTC
Anslo wrote:
Tiberious Thessalonia wrote:
One would think that if one were attempting to represent themselves as a CONCORD loyalist then one would, in fact, work to maintain an air of neutrality as regards the specific policies and leadership of CONCORD signatory nations. There is that whole issue of the CONCORD nations wishing to maintain sovereignty, after all.


And sometimes your neutrality must be shifted in light of major evidence to shake up that neutrality. Besides, he may be a CONCORD loyalist, but he isn't a decision maker IN CONCORD. He's allowed his opinion while maintaining his professional neutrality.

He can say Heth should be shot, but not make a single move to actually act out and shoot him or any Caldari ship obeying the law per CONCORD neutrality.

Quote:
Or do you think it appropriate that CONCORD should begin telling its member nations how to conduct their affairs? Who gets to head them? What laws they put in place? I rather think that is slightly outside of the purview of CONCORD as it was originally envisioned. Has this changed? Have the four princes been put into their place, and the true king raises his head once again?


That's seriously a jump of logic there Tibs...


Actually it's not. Grideris was a major player in the Anti-Nation actions a couple of years back, claiming to be working on behalf of CONCORD. I happen to believe that a member of an organization who is rather high on the totem pole, as it were, needs to be careful about what they say, as they are taken to be representatives of that group. I am simply wondering if FCORD is no longer considering themselves CONCORD loyal (as CONCORD is supposed to be made up equally of members of all five signatory empires, including the state, and that applies to whomever happens to be leading at the moment, unless you expect the Federation to have to resign oaths and acts every time they have an election).

In this case, a representative of CONCORD is now attempting to encourage a rebellion against one of the sovereign empires that makes up CONCORD. This constitutes an interference by someone aligned to CONCORD in the personal affairs of a separate, sovereign nation-member of that agreement.

And just because it is happening with the state today doesn't mean that it can't happen with the federation, republic, or empire tomorrow.

You have to examine your membership and loyalty to that organization. It was sold to you as a service, but it has become, as all services do, your master.
Anslo
Scope Works
#32 - 2013-02-05 20:02:30 UTC
Tiberious Thessalonia wrote:
Actually it's not. Grideris was a major player in the Anti-Nation actions a couple of years back, claiming to be working on behalf of CONCORD. I happen to believe that a member of an organization who is rather high on the totem pole, as it were, needs to be careful about what they say, as they are taken to be representatives of that group. I am simply wondering if FCORD is no longer considering themselves CONCORD loyal (as CONCORD is supposed to be made up equally of members of all five signatory empires, including the state, and that applies to whomever happens to be leading at the moment, unless you expect the Federation to have to resign oaths and acts every time they have an election).

In this case, a representative of CONCORD is now attempting to encourage a rebellion against one of the sovereign empires that makes up CONCORD. This constitutes an interference by someone aligned to CONCORD in the personal affairs of a separate, sovereign nation-member of that agreement.

And just because it is happening with the state today doesn't mean that it can't happen with the federation, republic, or empire tomorrow.

You have to examine your membership and loyalty to that organization. It was sold to you as a service, but it has become, as all services do, your master.


You're being really nit picky about this. He is from an independent Alliance that considers itself CONCORD aligned. They aren't given special powers by CONCORD. They aren't official reps. As far as I can tell, they can say whatever they want, it doesn't mean they just switched sides. He has an opinion. Opinions are different than policy implementation.

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#33 - 2013-02-05 20:03:30 UTC
Tiberious Thessalonia wrote:

Or do you think it appropriate that CONCORD should begin telling its member nations how to conduct their affairs?


When a head of state of a signatory nation has breached the very Treaty he is supposed to acknowledge, I do not think that you are asking the right question.

Mr Grideris statement was indeed probably of bad form and out of place, since I believe that as you say, you can not express a feeling to see a head of state you dislike being deposed while supporting CONCORD at the same time.

But I too - CONCORD supporter - hold a dislike for Heth-haan, not ad personam mind you, but for the actions he has allowed to happen, as much as it pains me to say it.

However and unfortunately, I doubt that CONCORD has any law regarding the punishement of its member states when they deliberately decide to violate said Treaty. Or else the Elders and the Caldari State would already have been held accountable for the war they caused.

The Elders, of course, are nowhere to be found and not part of the Treaty signatories. The Providence Directorate, however, is.
Mekhana
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#34 - 2013-02-05 20:08:13 UTC
Looking forward to Heth's political demise.

Vide longe er eros di Luminaire VII, uni canse pra krage e determiniex! Sange por Sange! Descanse bravex eros, mie freires. Mortir por vostre Liberete, farmilie, ide e amis. lons Proviste sen mort! Luminaire liber mas! 
Dex Nederland
Lai Dai Infinity Systems
The Fourth District
#35 - 2013-02-05 20:37:56 UTC
Lyn Farel wrote:
The Providence Directorate, however, is.


If you can find the CONCORD NeoCom Database entry for the Caldari Providence Directorate please do share!

Unlike the Chief Executive Panel, Caldari Navy, Ishukone Corporation, even Intara Directive Action, there I have not found a CONCORD database entry for the Caldari Providence Directorate.

To my knowledge, despite the high-profile news regarding the CPD and Heth-haan, the Chief Executive Panel remains to this day the State's body dealing with interstellar politics. The CEP's members may have ceded many powers to the CEO of KK/CC/Ytiri and be proclaimed "Chief Executor" by the State populace, but the fundamental structures of the State's governance remained intact. The CEP, while taking a back seat, still administered its multitude of functions on behalf of the State's member corporations and the CBT still remained the primer third-party judiciary in the cluster, managing contract conflicts throughout the jurisdiction of CONCORD.

The actions of the CPD do not directly reflect upon the actions of the CEP, which did sign the Yulai accords, not the CPD.

Lai Dai Infinity Systems
Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#36 - 2013-02-05 22:52:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Lyn Farel
Was the Treaty signed by the CEP in the name of the CEP, or by the CEP in the name of the Caldari State ? I would genuinely like to know.
James Syagrius
Luminaire Sovereign Solutions
#37 - 2013-02-05 23:22:08 UTC
I congratulate and commend Korsavius on his willingness to defend essential liberty and basic human dignity, not only in word but in deed.

I encourage State authorities to treat those detained mercifully.

This moment, regardless of its outcome will define the Caldari State.

“Here also are the heralds of his praise."
John Revenent
Revenent Defence Corperation
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
#38 - 2013-02-05 23:39:48 UTC  |  Edited by: John Revenent
I am deeply appalled at the events that took place at the Malkalen rally. Ishukone-Raata echos the statements of the Ishukone Watch when they state that the CPD used an excessive and completely unnecessary use of force when dealing with a peaceful rally. To the families of the deceased, I wish to apologies on behalf of the Ishukone-Raata Enforcement Directive, and we will ensure compensation reaches all the families involved in this tragic event.

We will be investigating this matter, along with members of the Ishukone Watch and will be taking appropriate actions accordingly based on information found. Our employee, Captain Lavius will be detained until the investigation is finalized.

This was a unfortunate incident that could have been avoided if the CPD had taken their issues through the proper channels instead of violating the rights of Ishukone citizens. A incident I hope they learn from.

That being said, I-RED will be continuing its efforts along side Provist forces in Black Rise to ensure the stability and liberties of State citizens are kept intact. The words of Captain Lavius are in fact his own and Ishukone-Raata will continue to respect his rights as a individual to speak out, though they do not officially reflect our organization as a whole.

Kind Regards,
J. Revenent - Ishukone Raata Executor

Ishukone Loyalist - Private Contractor

"Holding on to anger is like grasping a hot coal with the intent of throwing it at someone else; you are the one who gets burned."
Silas Vitalia
Doomheim
#39 - 2013-02-06 00:00:53 UTC
John Revenent wrote:


That being said, I-RED will be continuing its efforts along side Provist forces in Black Rise to ensure the stability and liberties of State citizens are kept intact. The words of Captain Lavius are in fact his own and Ishukone-Raata will continue to respect his rights as a individual to speak out, though they do not officially reflect our organization as a whole.


In, or out, dear?

You can't have it both ways.

Sabik now, Sabik forever
Dex Nederland
Lai Dai Infinity Systems
The Fourth District
#40 - 2013-02-06 01:44:55 UTC
Lyn Farel wrote:
Was the Treaty signed by the CEP in the name of the CEP, or by the CEP in the name of the Caldari State ? I would genuinely like to know.


Can you rephrase the question? The CEP is the State entity that manages international affairs impacting the whole of the Caldari State; the Caldari State being the megacorporations, corporations, and their subsidiaries.

Lai Dai Infinity Systems