Jita Park Speakers Corner

I am sorry, but I cannot take him seriously anymore. Sure, there needs to be some incentive for players to move out into null, and nullsec is in need of some loving, but what he suggests is ludicrous.

-Highsec will become a ghost town to all but a small number of new players. There will literally be no incentive to stay for longer than a single day upon playing eve.

This has several subsequent effects:

1) Miners will have to mine in nullsec to make any amount of money at all.

-Ship prices will skyrocket to never before seen highs.
*Combat will become much more rare, inflated ship prices with not enough isk to match.

-The "industry" that is also supposed to be positively affected by this change will take a major blow.
*Rarity of materials means no ships, modules, or ammunition being produced by independent corporations.
*A monopoly of supply will exist with the major nullsec alliances.

2) Beginning players will be forced to move out into low or even null after their first week.

-Low SP and experience means newer players do not stand a ghost of a chance.
*Their chances of success will be entirely based upon being able to join up with a corporation that provides them with some sort of safety.
*Since there is so much difficulty in starting out, new players will end their trial without even the slightest thought of subscribing to play.
*The game population will dwindle over time as more players leave than enter the game. Battles like Asakai will fade into mere memory.

-Competition between existing null-sec alliances and newcomers.
*Sheer manpower and firepower advantage means already existing nullsec alliances will have an unshakable dominance.
*Lack of industry means newer corporations will be unable to defend themselves let alone take on large nullsec alliances to win living space and resources.
*New players will have literally no choice but to join the large alliances themselves.

3) Plentiful amount of targets for roaming pirates... at first.

-Number of miners will dwindle as they are literally ganked right out of the game.
*A situation similar to the buffalo on the old western United States frontier will begin to arise; miners will be overhunted into near extinction.
*Affects every single aspect of the game: ships beyond T1 hulls and frigates will become a rare sight to see.

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EVE will not become a better game from this. The only effect I could see coming of this in the long term is: extreme decline in player population. EVE will no longer be the game where players are free to do as they wish, they will be at the mercy of anyone with a gun and the mindset of a playground bully.

This won't just kill off the AFK miner. This will kill off literally any profession that arises from ships gathered from materials from a mining laser.

The New Order claims that this is the dream of eve made manifest, and that is the juiciest irony of all.

Henceforth, I am not going to support James in this venture. He has danced around in the grey area for some time, which is perfectly fine, but this is just insane.

Perhaps that is exactly what he wants.

I will surely earn many derogatory labels for voicing my opinion, but it is a risk I am prepared to take.

Indeed, if the cooperation was there, it would be a paradise for all players. Miners would still mine in relative peace, industry would thrive, and the community would evolve into a completely player driven society - the dream of CCP.

But the fact is, it isn't. And it wont for a long, long time.

Hopefully the upcoming expansion will give lots of incentive for people to move out to null and low, but the agenda that James is pushing on EVE in its current form, and at EVE's current state, will be absolutely catastrophic.

If he really wants to see his dream realized, he needs to win the hearts of the newbies and make sure that there is at least an environment SAFE ENOUGH for newer players to really learn how to play EVE.

Because lack of new players wanting to stay will spell doom for the game in the long run.



The fact is, James is pushing his campaign like an extremist. EVE needs a moderationist. I am not just looking out for my own well being, and the fact is that his "changes" will hurt new players more than anyone else.

EDIT:

For example, take the Western United States in the late 1800's. When the gold rush first began, the first people to make it out to the frontier and reap the easily extracted rewards were the independent miners. As time went on, and all the easily mined gold was extracted, the only way to extract the ore was to turn to more expensive, more dangerous measures such as underground mining.

And only the powerful, and wealthy mining corporations could afford to establish the machinery and infrastructure needed to develop that sort of an efficient system. Miners were then employed via the wage system to provide the manpower. With no alternative, most independent mining corporations were swallowed up, and their assets - and manpower - added to the parent company.

My point is, the large corporations weren't on the frontier until a couple of years after the gold rush began. The same situation is going to happen to EVE as soon as the nullsec buffs are implemented.

The main point is, only when people actually start moving out to nullsec in large numbers will nullsec start to be safer. Then highsec can take nerfs, as its primary purpose of providing a safe environment for newer players to build up capital and start out on their own will be redundant and obsolete.

If James is to gimp highsec at the same time, he will most likely kill off industry.

tl;dr Give players time to tame the new nullsec, and make it a tad bit safer. Then, and only then, would rolling back highsec be logical.

While I do think that getting folks to interact and unite behind something is a good thing, some of Jame's views I think would not be a good thing. Much seems to be the ramblings of one who has no respect for the playstyles of others. Who knows? Maybe someone wants to be a space bussinessman or space scientist in an established empire instead a pew-pewer in lawless space. My sandbox has room for those people. That is Eve's beauty and makes it one of the most diverse MMOs in history.


I am all for more risk in high sec, but any system considered must be something better than "not being allowed to do ANYTHING in high sec" and not as extreme as "being blown up and podded repeatedly one hour into game while figuring out controls".

Tell you what, James. I got a solution.


LET THE PLAYERS BECOME BELT RATS.



Limit the power of the ships allowed to fly while doing this to that of standard high sec belt rats. Like belt rats, players in that ship do not attract CONCORD. Those pirate noob ships I saw on a test server article look like the deal. Make it to where someone that takes this path can not dock at stations at least in the area they operate in. To compensate for that lost ability, they can dock in static pirate plexes or even a corp POS.

Of course, no doing this in newbie zones. I like tears, too. But not at the expense of blowing folks up who do not even know all the controls yet.



That is just one solution. I am no game designer so file that under ideas no one cares about. BUT- I do not feel anyone would be opposed to more risk as long as there is a "risk" and not "no chance" or "no options". A true sandbox has folks that build the castles AND the folks that take army men to siege those castles.

I read his latest blog post, to me his suggestions were very much in favour of the betterment of highsec. Better does not mean themepark, bro.

Yes. Highsec.

Yes, nerfing high sec is a commonly advocated solution. The idea is to represent what people want, not to be a hipster candidate.



I agree with your premise, low sec needs more content. In my opinion the best content in EVE is player created, and not created by devs. To that end a movement of players from high to low will create content. I don't think making low sec better while leaving high sec alone will work.Why? Because to the high sec care bear, not much has changed. He is still earning the same, doing the same. Sure there is more ISK out there now, but there was always more ISK out there. The only way to make that movement happen is through the unfortunate sting of negative reinforcement.

I don't doubt for a second that some people will be upset if their daily grind had spanner thrown in it. But ultimately, it will create an incentive for people to venture to the frontier. High sec will still exist, but it wont exist as a viable end-game. That has to be the frontier.



Mission runners are hardly defenseless. It takes an extraordinary lack of caution on a mission runners part for them to get slaughtered. In fact, EVE is littered with 1 man player corps solely for mission runners to avoid paying NPC corp taxes. These 1 man CEOs will drop corp the moment they are war-decced and will rise again. I don't see how any reasonable observer could see this situation and conclude "It's too dangerous for the mission runners!"

Miners on the other hand are vulnerable, but heres a controversial opinion, as they should be! Mining pays next to nothing, its boring, where is the risk and reward here? The risk is getting ganked, and the reward is not getting ganked, and you go between the two by tanking, moving around, being watchful, etc. For the miner that plays well and doesn't die sees his ore fetch more ISK since his less intelligent competition got wiped out. That's an amazing process of natural selection and we should all be allowed to observe this space jungle in all it's majestic glory.



The idea isn't new but is there another candidate with James 315's positions, following, appeal and oh so heavenly demeanor?

Kitsumoto said it right, James is approaching this as an extremist and what hisec needs is a moderate. Yes, hisec needs to change and yes, James has the right ideas but he is too drastic In his positions. Eve is a sandbox and should forever remain so, there need be no consenting for any type of player interaction. I believe what James has done with the new order is testament to player driven Content creation. However, what all these hisec nerfers seem to ignore is that hisc is a core component of the sandbox. Industry and commerce congregate to centralized locations irl An in game as well hisec is the commercial and industrial backbone of new Eden, the game would be a lot worse off if hisec were changed to the point of carebears unsuscribing. What really needs to change isn't hisec but low and null, there needs to be greater incentives there. While I agree level 4 missions in hisec are a bit too much, nerfing hisec to death will do more harm than good. A decentralized and spread thin new Eden economy may sound good on paper but it won't be so fun when you can't buy that ship you want or those mods you need.

New Eden needs new incentives for low sec and null sec, no level 4s in hi sec and nerfed hisec exploration. And while bots are a plague to the game, mining is essential - come up with a more entertaining means of doing it otherwise deal w semi afk miners, without them new Eden would be seriously lacking minerals. Moon mining is a much more significant problem as it is a completely passive isk faucet that requires no attention and has little to no risk.


Sent from iPhone

Moderate : tending toward the mean or average
Radical ideas lea to strong opposition and therefore dilution. However what you are saying is that James is falsely stating his intention. How can I take any of his positions seriously then?

As a representative of hisec one should stand up for what the average of hisec want not one extreme. So much for that idea..

I'm sure James is stating his position honestly. In politics moderates cause stagnation and extremes cause change, and hi-sec desperately needs change.

I mean obviously your blinded as one of the new orders minions but I just think James is runnin on a platform for the sake of running. There are much more desperately needed changes to tho game than what hisec requires. Eve I a sandbox and James is supposedly the only can candidate to support that (wha?) but In reality he is just trying to push his agenda and have the game changed to a play style he likes. It's a sandbox, the people who chose to play the carebears hisec lifestyle want to and made that choice. Their role is vital to eve, to nerf their game into oblivion is counterintuitive to what James so adamantly believes in. Null sec and lowsec have a lot more problems than hisec. These so called hisec solutions are just pvpers (llike me) trying to get more targets and action but in doing so they ignore the side effects on commerce an industry in new Eden. Who cares if some people want grins missions all day, it's a GRIND its not easy and it takes time. Yes it's relatively safe but not completely as James n the new order have made perfectly clear. Fix null and lowsec first then ccp can think about hisec. James wants to make change for the sake of making change and feelin important when in reality stupid ideas like this will work to ruin the delicate balance of Eve.