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Manufacturing in WH's.
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Tarunik Raqalth'Qui
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#21 - 2013-02-04 23:17:48 UTC
Zoltan Lazar wrote:
I see X-L ship assembly pos's, super-lab'd pos's and obvious carebear production pos's in WH space all the time, usually in C3 holes. They're very rarely attacked, for two reasons. One, they usually indicate the defender has at least one cap, which makes a supcap fleet rather difficult to field. Two, a reinforce timer of more than 24 hours means having to find another route back to the attacker's home WH after killing your tower.


TL;DR Put your reinforce timer to above 24 hours, have at least a carrier and a moros if not more to defend.


This is both somewhat right and VERY wrong. Full stront is good, yes, but it is not sufficient; your starbase will need some serious teeth (a combo of racial guns (but not missiles!), tackle, neuts, and very heavy rainbow ECM is what has been shown to work well in sub-C5 space) to go with that 40+hr reinforcement timer. Towers without tackle and/or using missiles as their sole damage source can be vulnerable to attacks from bombers, while a lack of jamming and neuts means that hostile logistics can do their job without serious risk of interference. Another good idea is to have starbase gunners in your corporation; they greatly bolster the effectiveness of the defenses you do have in place.

Furthermore, floating caps (or sometimes even a XL-SAA) can draw a siege, especially if in a lightly defended or undersized tower; T3/logi gangs with energy neuting support can down caps much more easily than most folks anticipate them to. While building them is a good idea, especially if you have some working relationships with more gun-happy groups that have skilled cap pilots among their ranks, its best to leave them stuffed in SMAs to serve as an unpleasant surprise for an actual invader than to leave them floating and risk getting a tower sieged by someone who's trying to get those capitals to come out and play.
Johnson 1044
Johnson Organic Produce
#22 - 2013-02-17 21:26:14 UTC
I don't know why manufacturing arrays would attract more attention than any other well-stocked POS. Odds are the real money is in the hangar array (sleeper loot) and the ship maintenance array anyway.
Derath Ellecon
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#23 - 2013-02-17 21:51:43 UTC
Tarunik Raqalth'Qui wrote:
Furthermore, floating caps (or sometimes even a XL-SAA) can draw a siege,



The most common reason for POS sieging a C2/C3 I've been a part of was to get the caps to come out and play.
Tinu Moorhsum
Random Events
#24 - 2013-02-20 16:11:04 UTC
Stonewall Jackson Adama wrote:
Is it ever worth manufacturing in WH"s? I'm not talking fuel blocks or t3 cruisers. I'm talking more about regualar low to mid-level production, t1/t2 frig and cruiser hulls and mods/boosters. I was thinking about moving a small manufacturing operation into a c4/c3, but I was worried it would arouse too much attention. If I leave it in k-space, there will be a lot of transporting in and out of w-space, just as there will be a lot of transporting in and out if I stay in w-space, so the logistics isn't really what is bothering me.


I don't see any advantage to doing actual construction in a wormhole beyond what you actually use for your WH operations.

Mining and Invention are another matter. You pretty much need your own POS if you take T2 production seriously at all. What I personally do is mine and invent in the WH and then take the BPC's and minerals out to run them at my production base. If you do it on any scale at all you'll also need a rorqual in the WH to compress the ore because ... well... hauling suck.

T-
Trinkets friend
Sudden Buggery
Sending Thots And Players
#25 - 2013-02-21 01:31:47 UTC
You can produce in a WH, but, for a start, the refinery is inefficient. You lose up to 25% of the minerals. So there goes your profit margin. And everything else is irrelevant immediately, so we won't discuss manufacturing inefficiencies, etc.

The only thing worth manufacturing in wormholes is ammo, preferably T2 stuff you've researched BPC's for at your POS.

Reactions, as Azreal said, can be profitable, but they are a PITA to set up, very expensive to run, and a whorebeast of complexity.

That said, there are several C1's owned by big nullsec blocs with 40+ large lab towers, some have massive reaction operations in C2's they use to refine and value-add to moon goo in total security (no capital hotdrops in a C2!) etcetera.

~~ Localectomy Blog ~~
Oxandrolone
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#26 - 2013-02-21 02:23:13 UTC
Stonewall Jackson Adama wrote:
Is it ever worth manufacturing in WH"s?


No it is not, everything is less efficient, harder and more dangerous than doing it in HS (nerf highsec)
Althiare
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#27 - 2013-02-21 10:08:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Althiare
Doing indie in wh space can be very profitable. I have done my share of reactions in wh space but I would only recommend doing that if you also want some pvp on the side, else just get a hs POS setup and do your thing there.

If some pvp on the side sounds good. get a c2 with a hs static so logistics is manageable and you can get some visitors to blow up (or scan down the chain to find some pew). I also would recommend some friends to join you in your hole for all the obvious reasons.

Also after the ninja harvesting fix in patch 1.1 you can expect gas prices to go back up so stock up while you can if you plan to do reactions.
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